Andy Reid's oldest found dead at Training Camp

[OnTheWarpath15]

Per NFLN. No link.

Found dead in his room at Lehigh University. No signs of foul play.

Originally Posted by milkman

The difference is that the other names you mention all won multiple SBs.

The only reason I mentioned those names was to refute the "well gosh he had Manning, Sapp, and Brooks".

If there are people putting Dungy alongside these coaches, yes, he's overrated. But I think very few people even attempt that. If you want to put him up against the Billicks, Holmgrens, Cowhers, and Ditkas.... I think he holds his own there in that 2nd echelon of all-time coaches.

Originally Posted by Chiefshrink

Coincedence or for ratings ?

They had the Reid kid in their death pool.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Phobia

The only reason I mentioned those names was to refute the "well gosh he had Manning, Sapp, and Brooks".

If there are people putting Dungy alongside these coaches, yes, he's overrated. But I think very few people even attempt that. If you want to put him up against the Billicks, Holmgrens, Cowhers, and Ditkas.... I think he holds his own there in that 2nd echelon of all-time coaches.

When you look at the Billicks, Cowhers and Ditkas, none of them had an elite QB, except Cowher, though Roethlisberger was still a baby in the NFL.

Championships are won by elite QBs, with the exception of 3(?) SBs.

Dungy hd an elite QB for years, and still managed only one chapionship.

There's no way of knowing, but I would argue that those coaches would have won more than one championship with Manning.

[Chiefshrink]

Originally Posted by mcaj22

one of Reid's sons was smuggling drugs up his butt cheeks during his prison sentence and got caught for it. I'm not sure if this is one but those kids have had a rocky history. It's a shame when their dad makes millions and they can live off that.

The profession of coaching football whether it be college or pro and all the moving around you do and the time spent away from the family is a HUGE OBSTACLE to overcome because the demands are so overwhelming. Some can do it and many do not. Divorce rate is high and their are more kids from football coaching families like Dungy's and Reid's that we don't hear about that struggle big time IMO. And why I always have thought you are better off single until your coaching career is over IF you are one of those career climbing type coaches.

I don't judge Reid at all and part of me feels sorry for Reid but the other part say's this is a classic example of when career comes b4 family and the toll it takes when you don't 'nip sh** in the bud' when it first rear's it's head when they are kids and you continue to let 'sh**' slide time and time again. There were huge signs way b4 these 2 got into trouble the first time and Mom couldn't do it all by herself and now Andy has paid a severe price. I thought for sure when Reid had his family issues aired out several yrs ago with his boys that he would step away from the game for awhile to actually BE THERE but in reality it was too late especially when these 2 were already young adults BUT STILL he should have stepped away from the game to put his family 'truly first' regardless if his boys kept falling off the wagon.

Just sad.

[Sucky]

Damn thats just awful

RIP

Originally Posted by milkman

When you look at the Billicks, Cowhers and Ditkas, none of them had an elite QB, except Cowher, though Roethlisberger was still a baby in the NFL.

Championships are won by elite QBs, with the exception of 3(?) SBs.

Dungy hd an elite QB for years, and still managed only one chapionship.

There's no way of knowing, but I would argue that those coaches would have won more than one championship with Manning.

We're obviously not going to match up exact dynamics when comparing any coach career. My entire point is that Dungy isn't an elite head coach. Based on his product across 2 teams, he's 2nd tier as a SB winner. If you're putting him there (as I think most reasonable people do), I don't think that's overrating him.

Besides, Ditka would have traded Manning for Ricky Williams. Now there's an overrated HC. Great player. But won a SB on the back of Buddy Ryan then did nothing in New Orleans. Without Buddy Ryan, Ditka was essentially Marty.

[JD10367]

And he still probably could play QB better than Cassel. /TheUsualSuspects

[aturnis]

Originally Posted by milkman

Tony Dungy is Herman ****ing Edwards with an elite QB.

This X3

Originally Posted by aturnis

This X3

An elite QB wouldn't win Herm a SB in 50 years. Herm is dogpiss. I can't believe Chiefs fans - of all people would even make that comparison.

[mlyonsd]

Originally Posted by Phobia

An elite QB wouldn't win Herm a SB in 50 years. Herm is dogpiss. I can't believe Chiefs fans - of all people would even make that comparison.

His name is a 4 letter word that should be stricken from CP. Just like the kicker that shall go nameless.

[Deberg_1990]

Talk about a thread hijack! Can we stay on subject out of respect for the Reids please.....
Posted via Mobile Device

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

Talk about a thread hijack! Can we stay on subject out of respect for the Reids please.....
Posted via Mobile Device

I don't have any respect for them. Sympathy, yes. Respect? No.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

Talk about a thread hijack! Can we stay on subject out of respect for the Reids please.....
Posted via Mobile Device

Yeah, I bet they'll really be offended when they read it.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Phobia

We're obviously not going to match up exact dynamics when comparing any coach career. My entire point is that Dungy isn't an elite head coach. Based on his product across 2 teams, he's 2nd tier as a SB winner. If you're putting him there (as I think most reasonable people do), I don't think that's overrating him.

Besides, Ditka would have traded Manning for Ricky Williams. Now there's an overrated HC. Great player. But won a SB on the back of Buddy Ryan then did nothing in New Orleans. Without Buddy Ryan, Ditka was essentially Marty.

I'm not that high on Ditka, but I believe, if you follow this, I think Marty is better than Dungy.

So, the fact that Ditka is essentailly Marty only suggests to me that Ditka and Marty are on a tier above the level of Dungy.

Originally Posted by milkman

I'm not that high on Ditka, but I believe, if you follow this, I think Marty is better than Dungy.

So, the fact that Ditka is essentailly Marty only suggests to me that Ditka and Marty are on a tier above the level of Dungy.

If we're talking about coaching success, the pinnacle is obviously the SB. Ditka gets way more credit than deserved based on the 85 Bears. Marty doesn't get near the respect he deserves because,... well, obviously.

I think we kind of agree here - we're just using different measuring sticks. I'm looking at the total picture with heavy weight given to SB wins and development put towards SB teams. You give heavier weight to a gameday coach and you're grading based on guys you would want coaching your team.