****Our Wide Receivers Suck- Official Thread****

[Sofa King]

They can’t get open, they drop passes in their hands, their jet sweeps are slow and terrible. These guys are not good.

[Hammock Parties]

At least Mahomes can coach the WRs

Talked about this on the pod, but Mahomes having to fix Rice and Toney's pre-snap alignment was one of the plays that started to get him simmering. pic.twitter.com/lRFZPloon1

— Nate Tice (@Nate_Tice) December 13, 2023

[BleedingRed]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

At least Mahomes can coach the WRs

Talked about this on the pod, but Mahomes having to fix Rice and Toney's pre-snap alignment was one of the plays that started to get him simmering. pic.twitter.com/lRFZPloon1

— Nate Tice (@Nate_Tice) December 13, 2023

Toney was wide open

[JPH83]

Where Chris is right earlier I think is that regression is probably the biggest issue. There's no obvious reason MVS should be this bad, Moore is even worse, Toney looks this much worse than in previous years (obviously the injury didn't help). That's why Nagy and Embree deserve the spotlight on them.

Outside of that it's harder to pin blame. I would say the WR committee approach has been a big mistake and hasn't helped Nagy and co. Maybe they wanted it, maybe it was Veach cobbling stuff together. But you have to think having that sort of rotation isn't great for chemistry and consistency. Good to cover the injury bug, but the idea seemed to be we'd try everyone out in different roles and see what worked. We still seem to have no idea other than what definitely doesn't work. Could be on Nagy, could be Veach, could be both.

On Veach it's hard to say. Looking at e.g. the draft investment it seems he hasn't prioritised as much in favour or building the D. But who knows who he tried to trade up for, if the rumours are true he's been after a WR and had no partners. There's also rumours he wanted Mazi Smith, so who knows. Perhaps they wanted WRs but just didn't like how they fell so went BPA. Fair enough.

On the other hand, going back to 2020, MEH is an egregious mistake. Not just because he's bad, but the resource allocation was terrible. There's no excuse, it was bad. 2021 was about protection so fine. 2022 and 2023, I know people love Karlaftis here but there's no way I prefer him even to that headcase Pickens, there's no way I prefer FAU over Rice in the first and Dell in the second etc. There's a LOT of ways we could have added more weapons to this team and haven't.

Make the argument Veach had a different plan and other GMs pushed it off course. But with the last 4 years of WR investment, I think it's hard to definitively say it's been a big priority for them.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by BleedingRed

Toney was wide open

For no gain at best.

Mahomes was trying for 6.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

At least Mahomes can coach the WRs

Talked about this on the pod, but Mahomes having to fix Rice and Toney's pre-snap alignment was one of the plays that started to get him simmering. pic.twitter.com/lRFZPloon1

— Nate Tice (@Nate_Tice) December 13, 2023

One point to notice there is that Toney has a walk in touchdown if Mahomes throws him the ball.

[Hammock Parties]

Toney has a 0 yard gain if Mahomes throws him the ball.

C'mon, man. There's a DB just waiting to jump him if Mahomes looks that way.

[Gary Cooper]

Originally Posted by TEX

Nagy and Embree are not good.

I don't even remember who the WR coach was before Embree.

As for Nagy/Bienemy, I thought Reid calls the majority of the plays? Mahomes and Nagy seem to have a decent relationship. I agree Bienemy was more hard nosed but there's supposed to be leaders on this team (Mahomes/Kelce) to hold players accountable. If you need the offensive coordinator to yell and scream, then you have some issues.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

Toney has a 0 yard gain if Mahomes throws him the ball.

C'mon, man. There's a DB just waiting to jump him if Mahomes looks that way.

No there's absolutely not. As soon as Mahomes looks upfield all three go that way. If he throws it WHEN he threw it, but back to Toney, he walks in.

It was a nice play design.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by Gary Cooper

I don't even remember who the WR coach was before Embree.

As for Nagy/Bienemy, I thought Reid calls the majority of the plays? Mahomes and Nagy seem to have a decent relationship. I agree Bienemy was more hard nosed but there's supposed to be leaders on this team (Mahomes/Kelce) to hold players accountable. If you need the offensive coordinator to yell and scream, then you have some issues.

Well, there's clearly a difference in fundamentals and precision. With largely the same guys.

So you tell me.

One legged Juju (who's production Rice is on pace to mirror or surpass) is the only guy missing, and NOBODY from last year's #1 offense can do a single thing right?

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

No there's absolutely not. As soon as Mahomes looks upfield all three go that way. If he throws it WHEN he threw it, but back to Toney, he walks in.

It was a nice play design.

Bro. In no way should Mahomes be throwing to a guy five yards behind the line of scrimmage here, with a DB camped out.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

Bro. In no way should Mahomes be throwing to a guy five yards behind the line of scrimmage here, with a DB camped out.

Eh - good defense.

I think Rice was the read; there's just not much room to get the ball in there. A perfect pass probably gets there but perfect ain't been in the vocabulary most of the season.

Ultimately the Bills just stayed sound and that play didn't have a ton of life in it.

[Hammock Parties]

Chiefs scored on this possession anyway, but I feel like in season's past that ball is going to the corner to Kelce.

[Chiefnj2]

That play was sunk the moment Rice lined up incorrectly. It was designed as a fake screen to Toney hoping to draw the LB to let Rice sneak in behind him between the safeties. The problem is that Rice doesn't seem to run a great route (or at least not where Mahomes thought he would be). I don't think there was enough time to fake the screen, fake it to Rice and then go back to Toney. If anything if Mahomes waits a split second more Watson was gets open in the middle.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

Chiefs scored on this possession anyway, but I feel like in season's past that ball is going to the corner to Kelce.

Safety was eye-banging Mahomes all the way and did a nice job not committing until Mahomes had already started to deliver.

I'm not sure there was a window to Kelce there. As soon as Mahomes looks that directly, safety's getting over there with inside position on the throw. It's a much higher risk play; underthrow it a little and it's an easy pick.

About the worst thing that could've happened on the throw to Rice there is exactly what did and I think the degree of difficulty on the completion is about the same, if not a little easier to Rice.

No qualms about the decision there. Play just didn't quite work.

[Gary Cooper]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

Well, there's clearly a difference in fundamentals and precision. With largely the same guys.

So you tell me.

One legged Juju (who's production Rice is on pace to mirror or surpass) is the only guy missing, and NOBODY from last year's #1 offense can do a single thing right?

I agree it's more fundamentals and precision rather than personnel.

With Reid, Mahomes, Kelce, there should be enough brains and leadership to fix issues that didn't exist last season from largely the same group.

Or maybe last season was an anomaly considering the WR group was one of the worst you'll ever see win a SB. You'd think though, over 20 games last year, some team would have figured out how to box out Kelce and take away the other targets.