Trade Deadline October 31

[O.city]

Coming up here, anyone have any interest in any certain player the Chiefs might look to add.

Figured we could have a thread to discuss not only the Chiefs but league wide.

[crispystl]

Originally Posted by The Franchise

So basically just a failure from the top down. I’ve watched some of the highlights and Reid didn’t call his best game either. Couple that with the Broncos needing that win to end the narrative that they can’t beat us….it was a perfect storm of shit.

Now if we come out and shit the bed against the Dolphins….then we have bigger problems.

I'm hoping the positive from that loss is that it a lit a fire in the team's ass and they'll be ready to play Miami.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by The Franchise

So basically just a failure from the top down. I’ve watched some of the highlights and Reid didn’t call his best game either. Couple that with the Broncos needing that win to end the narrative that they can’t beat us….it was a perfect storm of shit.

Now if we come out and shit the bed against the Dolphins….then we have bigger problems.

Yeah, no question.

Like I said on Tuesday I think - this felt like a game where we just got outcoached. Those games happen on occasion but haven't happened often since Andy got here.

We just weren't ready. We weren't motivated. There was nothing creative at all to try to goose anyone out of a slumber. It was a game where seemingly everything was half-assed in the week leading up to it, right down to a gameplan that was completely bottled up by vanilla zone coverages, and it showed.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Not even a little bit.

It was one of the worst, most indifferent performances you'll see from him. Just kinda standing there in the middle of the line most of the time. I struggle to come up with a game from him the last several season that was clearly worse - maybe that Houston game last year where we had to go to OT to beat the worst team in football? If he's played that poorly in the Mahomes era, it's a really REALLY short list. Almost certainly one of the 5 worst games of his career.

It was hard to find anyone that truly played well in that game. Donovan Smith had a strong game, Trey Smith was solid. Kelce was fine. Karlaftis was good, Gay and Chenal were solid at LB.

Pretty much everyone else ranged from bad to flat out awful. And two of those guys in the awful category were arguably our best defensive players in Jones and Sneed.

Really good LB play, a really bad Denver offense and a typically steady effort from McDuffie disguised the fact that our defense was largely as forgettable as the offense was. There just wasn't as obvious a root cause.

Sneed looked like as soon as he realized Sutton was going to physically manhandle him and the refs were going to call DPI for him trying to just hold his own..he just checked out.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

On balance, Veach has been extremely strong in the draft over the last 4 years.

Which only further demonstrates how really damn hard it's going to be to keep winning these championships going forward.

Because with a foundation of Mahomes/Kelce/Jones (and Hill) that he inherited, as well as extremely strong draft outcomes, we're still facing some issues on the roster and a lot of cap pressure.

What O.City is saying (and has been for some time) is that a bunch of Cooks aren't going to get the job done if/when Kelce/Jones have aged or priced themselves out.

At that point Mahomes + role players is gonna be a tough row to hoe. Granted, McDuffie isn't a mere role player and Karlaftis is looking to be progressing nicely. Rice could step in and be a real 'dude' as well.

But we'll need more. Not a TON more, but we'll likely need to hit on a couple more standout performers in the next year or two. We really can't afford another MEH and ultimately FAU will need to perform sooner rather than later as well.

You can kinda shell game things (i.e. slot Rice into the 1st, FAU into the 2nd; Sneed into the first, Gay 2nd, Danna 3rd, MEH 4th) and make some of those picks more palatable. But it demonstrates how narrow the line we have to walk going forward truly is.

Especially when Mahomes is a mere mortal. And I think that's where myself and others (O.City as well) seem 'eager' to pile on Mahomes. Because we NEED him to play at a superstar level. If for no other reason than the impact on the rest of the roster that his presence (and cap charge) has.

We need Mahomes to be a top 3 guy. That's not being too hard on him. It's not putting too much weight on him. It's not blaming him. It's just a statement of the reality of things. You need your stars to be stars.

I think a roster full of solid role players, specifically on defense, who just do their job to their level of talent allows, can win alot of games and get you thru the regular season. Especially against the also rans.

But that's not what we're really about here at this point. You need those Tyreek's and Kelce's, and Jones's in January when you have a Bengals team rolling into Arrowhead.

Or when inevitably we have to go on the road to Baltimore or wherever.

It's why to the chagrin of yourself and many others, if we have to use our first to go trade for someone, so be it. And pay them. Again, so be it.

Because we can get FAU or Cooks in the 2nd round every year.

We can't always get a Chase Young. Damn, the fact that our 3rd would have been able to get that done stings.

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Yeah, no question.

Like I said on Tuesday I think - this felt like a game where we just got outcoached. Those games happen on occasion but haven't happened often since Andy got here.

We just weren't ready. We weren't motivated. There was nothing creative at all to try to goose anyone out of a slumber. It was a game where seemingly everything was half-assed in the week leading up to it, right down to a gameplan that was completely bottled up by vanilla zone coverages, and it showed.

Not sure I agree here. Spags and the defense performed extremely well, so can't fault them. On offense I wasn't a fan of the play calling but I feel it was more of an effort and mistakes issue.

MVS fumble, Hardman fumble, Skyy and Rice missing a key block on back-to-back plays forcing a FG. I agree with the second part of your post that we weren't ready and we weren't motivated.

I think this team fell into an ego problem. They knew Germany was coming up and they could put on a "C+ performance" and beat them like the have the last few games but Denver just wanted it more. You could tell from our first drive how energized they were.

This game meant so much more to the Broncos and their confidence then it did us and it showed. Nobody on that roster had ever beaten this Chiefs team and they made it their mission to fix that.

It was literally their Super Bowl.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by RunKC

Not sure I agree here. Spags and the defense performed extremely well, so can't fault them. On offense I wasn't a fan of the play calling but I feel it was more of an effort and mistakes issue.

MVS fumble, Hardman fumble, Skyy and Rice missing a key block on back-to-back plays forcing a FG. I agree with the second part of your post that we weren't ready and we weren't motivated.

I think this team fell into an ego problem. They knew Germany was coming up and they could put on a "C+ performance" and beat them like the have the last few games but Denver just wanted it more. You could tell from our first drive how energized they were.

This game meant so much more to the Broncos and their confidence then it did us and it showed. Nobody on that roster had ever beaten this Chiefs team and they made it their mission to fix that.

It was literally their Super Bowl.

Can't get there.

About half the defense no-showed that game, which is about what we got on offense as well.

I don't think anyone is really above some criticism for that game apart from maybe 5(ish) players who seemed to be bringing it from the opening snap. Most of the rest seemed like they had someplace else they'd rather be.

That's on coaching.

All of 'em.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by O.city

This is what I've been yelled at for saying for a while. "You can't expect him to play that well with the shit at WR".

Well, his contract is the reason said shit is at WR. You wanna go pay for WR's, it's gonna come at the cost of the OL or the defense.

He's taking up 20 plus % of the cap space we have. He has to bring that much value or this is what you're gonna get.

Late to the party, but he's proven he can win a Lombardi with an average to below average defense.

Yet instead of maintaining his weapons, we spent both cash and draft capital on defense.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by O.city

The bigger killer is the CEH first rounder when you could have had a real good player there. But also, they could have traded said pick for someone.

I just pretend that pick was Sneed or something and I don't get annoyed.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath15

Late to the party, but he's proven he can win a Lombardi with an average to below average defense.

Yet instead of maintaining his weapons, we spent both cash and draft capital on defense.

He proved he could win a Lombardi with an average to below average set of weapons as well.

Again - this group of supporting characters is no worse from a talent perspective than last seasons. The problem appears to be that Mahomes has convinced himself it is.

We weren't rocking the Bengals/Eagles/Dolphins weapons last season, folks. And Rice is more talented and likely to be more productive than anybody we lost last season.

Mahomes needs to get out of his own head and stop telling himself that he's seen some massive fall-off in the ability of the pass-catchers around him. He hasn't.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

He proved he could win a Lombardi with an average to below average set of weapons as well.

Again - this group of supporting characters is no worse from a talent perspective than last seasons. The problem appears to be that Mahomes has convinced himself it is.

We weren't rocking the Bengals/Eagles/Dolphins weapons last season, folks. And Rice is more talented and likely to be more productive than anybody we lost last season.

Mahomes needs to get out of his own head and stop telling himself that he's seen some massive fall-off in the ability of the pass-catchers around him. He hasn't.

This is where I'll push back a smidge.

Toney is a shell of his 2022 self, Moore is somehow worse, MVS "seems/feels" to be less involved and we're not getting 10 receiving TD's out of McKinnon.

That's a MASSIVE dropoff.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath15

This is where I'll push back a smidge.

Toney is a shell of his 2022 self, Moore is somehow worse, MVS "seems/feels" to be less involved and we're not getting 10 receiving TD's out of McKinnon.

That's a MASSIVE dropoff.

Mahomes apparently doesn't think MVS is the same guy either as he repeatedly clutches and doesn't throw it to him even when he's open.

It's probably time to admit Toney isn't a WR, he's an offensive weapon without a position.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath15

This is where I'll push back a smidge.

Toney is a shell of his 2022 self, Moore is somehow worse, MVS "seems/feels" to be less involved and we're not getting 10 receiving TD's out of McKinnon.

That's a MASSIVE dropoff.

I'll give you Toney, even though I'm not convinced that the Monstars took his talent, just hard to understand/know what's going on there, but the rest?

Moore is not "somehow worse". He was non-existent last year as a WR outside of the Chargers game. He's not worse, he's just not better, even with much more opportunity.

MVS is still MVS. That's on Pat for not going to him more.

McKinnon's 10 receiving TDs are an irrelevant stat that people keep pointing to. He did jack shit as a receiver in the playoffs and SB. McKinnon not giving us those 10 TDs in the regular season has no impact on a repeat.

Also, Hardman is healthy. He wasn't last year for the stretch run. Rice is more talented than any WR we had on the team, and has essentially filled the JuJu role. Watson looks better than he ever did last year, and is more involved.

It's not at all a "massive" dropoff. That's hyperbolic nonsense.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by staylor26

I'll give you Toney, even though I'm not convinced that the Monstars took his talent, just hard to understand/know what's going on there, but the rest?

Moore is not "somehow worse". He was non-existent last year as a WR outside of the Chargers game. He's not worse, he's just not better, even with much more opportunity.

MVS is still MVS. That's on Pat for not going to him more.

McKinnon's 10 receiving TDs are an irrelevant stat that people keep pointing to. He did Jack shit as a receiver in the playoffs and SB. McKinnon not giving us those 10 TDs in the regular season has no impact on a repeat.

Also, Hardman is healthy. He wasn't last year for the stretch run. Rice is more talented than any WR we had on the team, and has essentially filled the JuJu role. Watson looks better than he ever did last year, and is more involved.

It's not at all a "massive" dropoff.

Interesting that doing the same or less with MORE opportunity isn't doing worse for you, but whatever. You'll literally argue anything.

Exhibit, McKinnon - where you've somehow brought regular season vs playoffs into this. DJ said "past seasons". Well, those 10 TD's helped this offense hum to to the tune of a 14-3 record and a 1st round bye - and we're talking about the offense struggling NOW.

You've gone a real long way to say Mahomes is the problem, you can't have it both ways.

[Mecca]

McKinnon got old, that's it.

[Sassy Squatch]

Some of it definitely is on Mahomes. Also, not sure who's in charge of on field personnel but that aspect has been absolutely shit this year.