****Our Wide Receivers Suck- Official Thread****

[Sofa King]

They can’t get open, they drop passes in their hands, their jet sweeps are slow and terrible. These guys are not good.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I think there is a line between blind loyalty and blind hatred. We should trust in veach, but also what makes him great is he’s quick to accept mistakes and works relentlessly to address them. We are 6-1 but let’s be real, we’ve had a lot of really good schedule bounces along the way. I am not discounting our success. I’m just saying it’s given us leeway to work through mistakes.

I personally believe we inflated how good our WR room was and were blessed with rashee progressing quickly. And I think veach acknowledges that when Reid goes against his instincts and pushes rice out quickly and when you’re willing to trade for a guy he didn’t originally think would make your top 7. I would say we overestimated Toney and skyy, and the Ross experiment isn’t looking so hot. We will be fine but it’s because we’re adjusting out of our original plan.

If your version of 'the plan' was that ALL of these guys were expected to be world beaters right out of the gate, that's a you problem. Veach threw numbers at it, knowing that some would rise, some would not.

Skyy has disappointed. Toney missed all of camp. Ritchie got hurt. Rice is looking good.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

If your version of 'the plan' was that ALL of these guys were expected to be world beaters right out of the gate, that's a you problem. Veach threw numbers at it, knowing that some would rise, some would not.

Skyy has disappointed. Toney missed all of camp. Ritchie got hurt. Rice is looking good.

It's hilarious how he's trying to frame it as a mistake that they've learned from. It's his way of being like "I was right all along".

What a delusional little man.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by RunKC

WR's are just not vital to Andy's scheme here. It's always been that way. Sure there's outliers like TO and Tyreek, but it's mostly been this way for Andy in over 2 decades of coaching. It's kinda like chess to me.

The King is Mahomes. Queen is Kelce. Rooks are the OL (specifically tackles) and bishops the RB's.

WR's aren't exactly pawns, but they're knights. Still important and valuable but not vital by any means. Not sure what other analogy to use here bc Andy's history proves the WR theory even when he didn't have Kelce in Philly all those years.

Thank you coming to my Ted Talk

But he's always had/looked for/valued WR's.

Jackson, Maclin x2, Watkins etc.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I think there is a line between blind loyalty and blind hatred. We should trust in veach, but also what makes him great is he’s quick to accept mistakes and works relentlessly to address them. We are 6-1 but let’s be real, we’ve had a lot of really good schedule bounces along the way.


I am not discounting our success. I’m just saying it’s given us leeway to work through mistakes.

I personally believe we inflated how good our WR room was and were blessed with rashee progressing quickly. And I think veach acknowledges that when Reid goes against his instincts and pushes rice out quickly and when you’re willing to trade for a guy he didn’t originally think would make your top 7. I would say we overestimated Toney and skyy, and the Ross experiment isn’t looking so hot. We will be fine but it’s because we’re adjusting out of our original plan.

This thread has just turned into absolute comedy.

The schedule hasn’t changed. It’s been the same since the NFL published it. Not one thing has bounced their way schedule wise. Last season the schedule included (guessing here) 8 playoff teams in the first 10 games?

This team will lose a couple more games along the way. Maybe not be the 1 seed even. Should the Chiefs have to go on the road, do you think any team wants to see the Chiefs and Mahomes on the other side of the field? In the playoffs?

The day will come when Mahomes takes this team on the road and (just like at home last season) leads them to victory and a SB.

[raybec 4]

Originally Posted by WilliamTheIrish

This thread has just turned into absolute comedy.

The schedule hasn’t changed. It’s been the same since the NFL published it. Not one thing has bounced their way schedule wise. Last season the schedule included (guessing here) 8 playoff teams in the first 10 games?

This team will lose a couple more games along the way. Maybe not be the 1 seed even. Should the Chiefs have to go on the road, do you think any team wants to see the Chiefs and Mahomes on the other side of the field? In the playoffs?

The day will come when Mahomes takes this team on the road and (just like at home last season) leads them to victory and a SB.

Right?! There's a lot of the "We got lucky" vibe going on and that's just silly.

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by WilliamTheIrish

This thread has just turned into absolute comedy.

The schedule hasn’t changed. It’s been the same since the NFL published it. Not one thing has bounced their way schedule wise. Last season the schedule included (guessing here) 8 playoff teams in the first 10 games?

This team will lose a couple more games along the way. Maybe not be the 1 seed even. Should the Chiefs have to go on the road, do you think any team wants to see the Chiefs and Mahomes on the other side of the field? In the playoffs?

The day will come when Mahomes takes this team on the road and (just like at home last season) leads them to victory and a SB.

It's so weird to freak out over games when the counter argument for NOT freaking out is "well yeah, they're 6-1, but these games don't really count, we'll have to see how they do against SB contenders".

I totally agree.... so WTF are you freaking out?

Anyone who's ever watched sports knows you can't just say "well, if they do this versus the 25th rated team, what about the top rated teams?!?" ...I dunno, we'll find out soon enough.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by raybec 4

Right?! There's a lot of the "We got lucky" vibe going on and that's just silly.

Of course there is and it's all in service of his overarching narrative.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

I feel like nothing was exactly "learned" in that regard... the Chiefs are obviously learning who is progressing and isn’t and all of that in terms of player development, but everything else was known from the beginning.

The Chiefs knew it sucks to lose a HoF WR and they'd have to make more decisions this offseason and balance this year's success with long term success, etc. They (and many of us) knew the product on the field would evolve and they would use the first couple months to evaluate and make adjustments where needed, and may not look great in week 1 or even week 8. They (and hopefully everyone) knows you can't just throw out anyone, but also had to work within a certain set of limitations, along with the feedback of the greatest QB we've ever seen and so forth.

Nobody here saying "we'll be fine" was ever completely lacking any of that knowledge... we know all of that, which is exactly why we haven't been worried about it.

There’s a bit of 20/20 hindsight in there. There was a lot of belief that Toney was a legit wr1 if he stayed healthy, or at least by mahomes standards. That juju was the low bar we had to hit and that Toney/skyy would easily clear that. There was pushback that a WR1 at all would only vulture receptions because we need to spread the ball a lot (nevermind that juju, for all his shortcomings, was a target eater).

And frankly an overestimation that mahomes/Reid/kelce can carry a pretty low standard of wr. Not terrible, but a “just good enough” standard. Some even saying it’s the best wr room mahomes has ever had.. Sure some wanted to still get better where we could at WR. But most didn’t expect rashee to get many reps this year and yet still believed we were basically the same #1 offense as last year if not better. I think that mentality has changed and I’m glad to see it.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

There’s a bit of 20/20 hindsight in there. There was a lot of belief that Toney was a legit wr1 if he stayed healthy, or at least by mahomes standards. That juju was the low bar we had to hit and that Toney/skyy would easily clear that. There was pushback that a WR1 at all would only vulture receptions because we need to spread the ball a lot (nevermind that juju, for all his shortcomings, was a target eater).

And frankly an overestimation that mahomes/Reid/kelce can carry a pretty low standard of wr. Not terrible, but a “just good enough” standard. Some even saying it’s the best wr room mahomes has ever had.. Sure some wanted to still get better where we could at WR. But most didn’t expect rashee to get many reps this year and yet still believed we were basically the same #1 offense as last year if not better. I think that mentality has changed and I’m glad to see it.

OR RICE, and he has, but be sure to leave that part out because it makes you more right!

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by WilliamTheIrish

This thread has just turned into absolute comedy.

The schedule hasn’t changed. It’s been the same since the NFL published it. Not one thing has bounced their way schedule wise. Last season the schedule included (guessing here) 8 playoff teams in the first 10 games?

This team will lose a couple more games along the way. Maybe not be the 1 seed even. Should the Chiefs have to go on the road, do you think any team wants to see the Chiefs and Mahomes on the other side of the field? In the playoffs?

The day will come when Mahomes takes this team on the road and (just like at home last season) leads them to victory and a SB.

We’ve played 7 games and 4 of them were against bottom 4 pass yardage defenses. 5 after this week. That’s a good bounce.

Chicago was on meltdown
Jets lost rodgers 10 minutes into the season
Denver has been in full tank mode and we get them twice
Staley is on the hottest of seats because of his teams defensive meltdown
And Minnesota isn’t very good

You can’t deny that we’ve had a very favorable schedule this year especially for the pass offense.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

There’s a bit of 20/20 hindsight in there. There was a lot of belief that Toney was a legit wr1 if he stayed healthy, or at least by mahomes standards. That juju was the low bar we had to hit and that Toney/skyy would easily clear that. There was pushback that a WR1 at all would only vulture receptions because we need to spread the ball a lot (nevermind that juju, for all his shortcomings, was a target eater).

And frankly an overestimation that mahomes/Reid/kelce can carry a pretty low standard of wr. Not terrible, but a “just good enough” standard. Some even saying it’s the best wr room mahomes has ever had.. Sure some wanted to still get better where we could at WR. But most didn’t expect rashee to get many reps this year and yet still believed we were basically the same #1 offense as last year if not better. I think that mentality has changed and I’m glad to see it.

As everyone told you the whole offseason, after they won a ****ing SB with a group just as talented, Mahomes and company can carry it.

And thru 7 games they have.

But if you think CP's mentality on it has changed, great.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by staylor26

OR RICE, and he has, but be sure to leave that part out because it makes you more right!

I literally said 500 times that most people did not expect rice to contribute much his rookie season if at all, given Reid’s history. Most peoples read on the 2023 pass offense was built on what we’d do until rice was ready

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by staylor26

OR RICE, and he has, but be sure to leave that part out because it makes you more right!

Correct.

The idea was that Toney would be roughly what he was last season (though he hasn't been) while some combination of Moore/Rice would make up for what we lost in JuJu.

Then we figured James could provide what Hardman provided.

Oddly, they tried to use Toney to replace Hardman and Rice/Moore have definitely replaced JJSS.

No, nothing changed in the thought process - simply in the execution. And with Hardman back to be Hardman, we're actually EXACTLY where many people expected us to be.

there's nothing revisionist or hindsight about it. The point was always that the strength of last years WR corps was overstated. The value of JJSS was WILDLY overblown and the rest could be carried over.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Correct.

The idea was that Toney would be roughly what he was last season (though he hasn't been) while some combination of Moore/Rice would make up for what we lost in JuJu.

Then we figured James could provide what Hardman provided.

Oddly, they tried to use Toney to replace Hardman and Rice/Moore have definitely replaced JJSS.

No, nothing changed in the thought process - simply in the execution. And with Hardman back to be Hardman, we're actually EXACTLY where many people expected us to be.

there's nothing revisionist or hindsight about it. The point was always that the strength of last years WR corps was overstated. The value of JJSS was WILDLY overblown and the rest could be carried over.

Exactly. Rice was still a candidate, albeit the most unlikely considering he's a rookie.

To pretend otherwise is 100% revisionist history.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

There’s a bit of 20/20 hindsight in there. There was a lot of belief that Toney was a legit wr1 if he stayed healthy, or at least by mahomes standards. That juju was the low bar we had to hit and that Toney/skyy would easily clear that. There was pushback that a WR1 at all would only vulture receptions because we need to spread the ball a lot (nevermind that juju, for all his shortcomings, was a target eater).

And frankly an overestimation that mahomes/Reid/kelce can carry a pretty low standard of wr. Not terrible, but a “just good enough” standard. Some even saying it’s the best wr room mahomes has ever had.. Sure some wanted to still get better where we could at WR. But most didn’t expect rashee to get many reps this year and yet still believed we were basically the same #1 offense as last year if not better. I think that mentality has changed and I’m glad to see it.

Dude... I just can't even. LoL

Veach took three good sized swings at WR and bought a lottery ticket.

Skyy and Rice were the biggest investments. So they get the most rope. Skyy hasn't done anything much. Rice is looking good.

Toney missed all of camp, and has a lingering toe issue. Still, he suits up every week, but his usage has been weird. Who knows what is going on there.

Ritchie has been on IR. That would appear skill-set wise to have been Skyy insurance, but he's been unavailable.

They were never going to throw Skyy, Toney, and Rice out there together. That's too much newbie.

The only thing they've 'learned' is that it looks like Rice might be a real good one.

All other grades are incomplete, unless you're ready to say Moore is a lost cause. That's an argument that is at least defensible.

Hardman was a smart pickup with two vets out of commission and Toney being iffy.

This narrative where we must accept that the plan has failed is ****ing nonsense.