Chiefs Are We Headed For Vermeil 2.0? - Page 3

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:00 AM

The way Mahomes can sling the ball shows promise for some high scoring offense. That being said, is the defense going to be able to cut it this season?

One thing that bailed out the defense to a degree the last few seasons was that Smith rarely turned the ball over. Even in a 3 & out situation, MVP usually kicked the ball deep enough to control field position.

Mahomes is neither Green nor Smith. I think he will put up the points Green did but obviously is going to have more turnovers than Smith did. Which is okay. But the defense can't be what it has been.

The defense and Bob Sutton are going to have to learn how to help out when those turnovers happen as they are probably going to happen more than they are used too given the nature of Mahomes. We know there are going to be some great passing plays. We also know that gunslingers will usually throw a few more INT's as well trying to make plays happen. Again, that is okay.

The Sutton defense of "bend but don't break" may have to take a page out of the Denver defense and start really getting after the QB and actually shutting down offenses before they get into FG range, etc.

If our defense is anything like has been during the Sutton era, we could be heading toward Vermeil 2.0 where you're going to have to hope 49 points is enough to win.

O.city · 08-02-2018, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

They didn't hold them to FGs, stupid playcalling and abysmal execution by Roethlisberger gifted them FGs.

They consistently, almost inexorably, marched untouched from 20 to 20, and stalled on three horrid passes once in easy FG range.

Ok.

Now do Alex and the offense

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

They didn't hold them to FGs, stupid playcalling and abysmal execution by Roethlisberger gifted them FGs.

They consistently, almost inexorably, marched untouched from 20 to 20, and stalled on three horrid passes once in easy FG range.

I will give the d credit to the point that they often tightened up inside the 20 simply because they had the back of the end zone as a 12th defender

**loochy** · 08-02-2018, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28

I think Vermeil "tried". I am not saying they are shooting for Vermeil style team either. Just questioning if that is what we are heading for at the moment, regardless of intent by the front office\coahces, etc.?

Do you? I think he didn't. I genuinely felt like he didn't care and told his assistants / dc "here you go, do what you can, kthxbai."
Posted via Mobile Device

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

18 points. That offense, scored 18 points.

If my defense gives up 18 points at home, in a playoff game, I don't care what happens, you should win. That games on Andy and the offense.

Except when maybe facing a good defense???

That game, is on the coaching PERIOD! Which is my entire ****ing point.

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loochy

Do you? I think he didn't. I genuinely felt like he didn't care and told his assistants / dc "here you go, do what you can, kthxbai."
Posted via Mobile Device

I will say be made some effort as long as it wasn't at the expense of the offense. But in St. Louis he had a defense in the top 5 the year they won the SB. So he wasn't hell bent on a formula of all offense, no defense.

O.city · 08-02-2018, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28

Except when maybe facing a good defense???

That game, is on the coaching PERIOD! Which is my entire ****ing point.

But when facing a good offense, the defense got lucky to hold them to 18 points.

Going into that game, what were you thinking would have been a good outing for the D?

O.city · 08-02-2018, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28

I will say be made some effort as long as it wasn't at the expense of the offense. But in St. Louis he had a defense in the top 5 the year they won the SB. So he wasn't hell bent on a formula of all offense, no defense.

Top 5 by what metric?

**DaFace** · 08-02-2018, 09:28 AM

At least this year, I don't think the offense will be that good, and I don't think the defense will be that bad.

Offense:
Green > Mahomes (most likely)
Priest > anyone on our roster
2003 OL >>> 2018 OL
Tony G > Kelce
2003 WR < 2018 WR

Defense:
2003 = giant pile of shit
2018 = Houston and Berry at least are worth something

**Baby Lee** · 08-02-2018, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealSNR

All defenses eventually suck ass in the playoffs.

Look at the Super Bowl. Look at the Vikings. The mighty Jaguars gave up a ****ton of points to the Steelers.

Greatest Show on Turf won a home playoff game 12-10. They got a SB out of that.

Sometimes you find yourself in a dogfight 'all of a sudden.'

O.city · 08-02-2018, 09:31 AM

I will say though, I'm not the biggest Sutton fan, but I do think he had his hands tied last year with what he could do.

Wouldn't have been upset replacing him, but I do also feel with better talent he's not bad.

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

But when facing a good offense, the defense got lucky to hold them to 18 points.

Going into that game, what were you thinking would have been a good outing for the D?

In that game...largely. As was stated... the Steelers did more to hurt themselves than we did to stop them.

**Baby Lee** · 08-02-2018, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Top 5 by what metric?

fourth in the NFL in points allowed per game (15.1),
first in run defense (74.3 yards per game)
tied for the league lead with 57 sacks.
sixth in takeaways with 36
scored eight defensive touchdowns.

Sassy Squatch · 08-02-2018, 09:34 AM

Ah, I'd almost forgotten why I hate Bob Sutton with such a passion until I read this thread.

**DaFace** · 08-02-2018, 09:34 AM

I mean, seriously, look at our 2003 defensive starters. There's no comparison between this year's D and this pile of shit.

**petegz28** · 08-02-2018, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

I mean, seriously, look at our 2003 defensive starters. There's no comparison between this year's D and this pile of shit.

Again, I am not so much worried about the players as I am the guy calling the defensive plays.

08-02-2018, 09:00 AM
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $-875873	Are We Headed For Vermeil 2.0? The way Mahomes can sling the ball shows promise for some high scoring offense. That being said, is the defense going to be able to cut it this season? One thing that bailed out the defense to a degree the last few seasons was that Smith rarely turned the ball over. Even in a 3 & out situation, MVP usually kicked the ball deep enough to control field position. Mahomes is neither Green nor Smith. I think he will put up the points Green did but obviously is going to have more turnovers than Smith did. Which is okay. But the defense can't be what it has been. The defense and Bob Sutton are going to have to learn how to help out when those turnovers happen as they are probably going to happen more than they are used too given the nature of Mahomes. We know there are going to be some great passing plays. We also know that gunslingers will usually throw a few more INT's as well trying to make plays happen. Again, that is okay. The Sutton defense of "bend but don't break" may have to take a page out of the Denver defense and start really getting after the QB and actually shutting down offenses before they get into FG range, etc. If our defense is anything like has been during the Sutton era, we could be heading toward Vermeil 2.0 where you're going to have to hope 49 points is enough to win.
Posts: 132,259

08-02-2018, 09:28 AM	#38
DaFace Kind of a mod Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Donkey Land Casino cash: $-1653101	At least this year, I don't think the offense will be that good, and I don't think the defense will be that bad. Offense: Green > Mahomes (most likely) Priest > anyone on our roster 2003 OL >>> 2018 OL Tony G > Kelce 2003 WR < 2018 WR Defense: 2003 = giant pile of shit 2018 = Houston and Berry at least are worth something
Posts: 53,117

08-02-2018, 09:31 AM	#40
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $-535936	I will say though, I'm not the biggest Sutton fan, but I do think he had his hands tied last year with what he could do. Wouldn't have been upset replacing him, but I do also feel with better talent he's not bad.
Posts: 84,153

08-02-2018, 09:34 AM	#43
Sassy Squatch The man you could post like. Join Date: Oct 2010 Casino cash: $-1220345	Ah, I'd almost forgotten why I hate Bob Sutton with such a passion until I read this thread.
Posts: 42,053

08-02-2018, 09:34 AM	#44
DaFace Kind of a mod Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Donkey Land Casino cash: $-1653101	I mean, seriously, look at our 2003 defensive starters. There's no comparison between this year's D and this pile of shit.
Posts: 53,117