Chiefs Is it time to start Foles over Smith? - Page 79

Deberg_1990 · 09-11-2016, 12:32 PM

Pathetic.

He's played poorly today

Thoughts?

O.city · 10-31-2016, 02:57 PM

How many guys have improved their accuracy at this point in heir career though?

I don't really think it's something you can really improve by that much. Scheme around, etc maybe.

**Ming the Merciless** · 10-31-2016, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Dole

Doesn't matter how many misses to most of these tards. They'd be perfectly happy burning a first round pick every year of someone, ANYONE who isn't Alex Smith.

Since youre so smart, how do you figure we go about replacing alex smith without burning a draft pick on someone?

I mean alex has been in the league 11-12 years...how much longer would you think we should wait? When is the last time we 'burned' a 1st round pick on a QB?

I'm all ears waiting for your genious , mind bottling answers...

DJ's left nut · 10-31-2016, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy 6

Theres just no way I can buy this

Foles may not be all around better, but to say his style is some kind of bad fit?

Plus arm talent and a willingness to use it, is a good fit in any scheme, on any team

I disagree.

Routinely putting a ball in harms way and an inability to consistently repeat your mechanics is a recipe for trouble against elite defenses. And when exactly did Foles develop 'plus arm talent'? He has an above average arm (elite, it ain't) and sub-standard accuracy. Again, this is the same guy that was a dink and dunk artist in College. A guy that was traded from the team he was white hot for the prior season (and had to have a 1st rounder included with him for Sam Bradford of all people). Plus arm talent? Christ, you guys want to act like he's some premier gunslinger all of the sudden.

Foles like to throw downfield...so have a lot of other quarterbacks that have shot their teams directly in the foot. For a team that relies on timing routes and horizontal passing and has been versed in that system for 3+ years now, putting a guy out there that isn't as in sync and isn't as accurate on short/intermediate throws isn't going to be beneficial against better teams and honestly won't gain you much against poorer teams in the long run.

**Easy 6** · 10-31-2016, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

His problem is his accuracy in the short/intermediate passes and awareness. Those are 2 things Alex has on him right now.

I agree, Smith has him on the intermediate to short game... at the same time, its not like Foles is missing guys by a mile in those areas

**The Franchise** · 10-31-2016, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASS11

Comparing offensive numbers from yesterday....

Snaps with Foles:

45 plays, 265 yards, 20 points

5.8 yards per play, 2.86 points per drive (not counting first drive since those points are Alex's)

Third downs: 6-12

Plays over 15 yards: 7

Snaps with Smith:

26 plays, 141 yards, 10 points,

5.42 yards per play, 2.5 points per drive (not counting last drive, since those points are Foles).

Third downs: 3-6

Plays over 15 yards: 3

When did Ware go down?

**Ming the Merciless** · 10-31-2016, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

How many guys have improved their accuracy at this point in heir career though?

I don't really think it's something you can really improve by that much. Scheme around, etc maybe.

in Foles 3 seasons with philly (his 1st 3 in league) he was 61% accurate

In alex Smith's first 7 years in SF he was 59% accuracy

Alex smith improved to 64% with KC
alex smith has improved 5% after year 7 under this scheme (5 % improvement over his 1st 7 years)

Nick FOles is 5 years into his career.....

Beef Supreme · 10-31-2016, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Dole

Doesn't matter how many misses to most of these tards. They'd be perfectly happy burning a first round pick every year of someone, ANYONE who isn't Alex Smith.

Just because a few people around here want to give away the farm every year on a first round QB, doesn't mean that everyone who wants to move on from Smith is an idiot.

We could have had Russell Wilson, but unlike Pete Carroll, Andy never would have started him because we just paid big money for Smith.

We could have had Dak Prescott, who seems to be doing ok in Dallas.

I'm sure there are several more. Let's not pretend that there wasn't anybody worth taking.

And I still think Foles would make us better. We don't need to give away our draft to do better than Alex Smith. The bar is not that high.

DJ's left nut · 10-31-2016, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

How many guys have improved their accuracy at this point in heir career though?

I don't really think it's something you can really improve by that much. Scheme around, etc maybe.

I've said for years that you have it coming out of college or you don't.

You can move within the letter but you can't change a full letter grade. A B- passer might become a B+ passer but he's not getting to an A. A C+ can get to a B- but not a B+

You can develop accuracy in the margins or perhaps disguise it through improved anticipation, but the outstanding pure passers came into the league with the biomechanics to repeat the delivery. The mediocre ones didn't and won't.

Which is to say that I expect Foles to pretty much remain who he is - a mediocre fit that's probably better playing for a shitty team where he can sling the ball around than he would be playing for a team that needs to win tight ballgames against premier defenses.

RunKC · 10-31-2016, 03:02 PM

Another big reason why Andy would want Alex is probably the mismatch it creates. Every team we've played has had at least 1 LB/S spying Alex if he takes off. That's one less defender to guard Hill, Maclin or Kelce.

**Easy 6** · 10-31-2016, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I disagree.

Routinely putting a ball in harms way and an inability to consistently repeat your mechanics is a recipe for trouble against elite defenses. And when exactly did Foles develop 'plus arm talent'? He has an above average arm (elite, it ain't) and sub-standard accuracy. Again, this is the same guy that was a dink and dunk artist in College. A guy that was traded from the team he was white hot for the prior season (and had to have a 1st rounder included with him for Sam Bradford of all people). Plus arm talent? Christ, you guys want to act like he's some premier gunslinger all of the sudden.

Foles like to throw downfield...so have a lot of other quarterbacks that have shot their teams directly in the foot. For a team that relies on timing routes and horizontal passing and has been versed in that system for 3+ years now, putting a guy out there that isn't as in sync and isn't as accurate on short/intermediate throws isn't going to be beneficial against better teams and honestly won't gain you much against poorer teams in the long run.

Plus talent is better than average, not sure why you're stuck on that in particular... I'm not acting like its elite, but you're acting like he is some kind of friggin Ty Detmer noodle launcher

But you're on a roll with this subject today, so have at it... I guess Reid drafted Foles, then brought him here because he doesnt fit the scheme

**Ming the Merciless** · 10-31-2016, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I've said for years that you have it coming out of college or you don't.

You can develop accuracy in the margins or perhaps disguise it through improved anticipation, but the outstanding pure passers came into the league with the biomechanics to repeat the delivery. The mediocre ones didn't and won't.

Which is to say that I expect Foles to pretty much remain who he is

The stats prove you wrong.

Alex smith was 59% completion rate with SF in his 1st 7 years...

Adding 5% to make it 64% during 4 years in KC....under reid

59% versus 64% is like a completely different QB

**The Franchise** · 10-31-2016, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC

Another big reason why Andy would want Alex is probably the mismatch it creates. Every team we've played has had at least 1 LB/S spying Alex if he takes off. That's one less defender to guard Hill, Maclin or Kelce.

So either defenses now have a spy on him at ALL TIMES during the game.....OR he's not running anymore because he can't. I'm going with the latter.

DJ's left nut · 10-31-2016, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefTablet

Just because a few people around here want to give away the farm every year on a first round QB, doesn't mean that everyone who wants to move on from Smith is an idiot.

We could have had Russell Wilson, but unlike Pete Carroll, Andy never would have started him because we just paid big money for Smith.

We could have had Dak Prescott, who seems to be doing ok in Dallas.

I'm sure there are several more. Let's not pretend that there wasn't anybody worth taking.

And I still think Foles would make us better. We don't need to give away our draft to do better than Alex Smith. The bar is not that high.

Oh **** me, do your homework if you're going to talk out your ass.

Russell Wilson pre-dated Reid by 2 years. He was a Pioli ****up. Exactly when was he there for Reid to have but/for Smith's contract? If you can't even get THAT right I'm not sure how much any of us should give a shit about your brilliant insight.

And kindly direct me to all the guys that had Prescott pegged as a sure thing. The Cowboys struck lightening but had we taken him in the 4th, people would've bitched that we didn't take a first round QB. Oh, and but/for Romo AND Kellen Moore getting injured, Prescott isn't starting right now either. There's a lot of luck that went into the Cowboys falling into Prescott. They have little more invested in him than we had in Murray, Bray or Hogan.

DJ's left nut · 10-31-2016, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pawnmower

The stats prove you wrong.

Alex smith was 59% completion rate with SF in his 1st 7 years...

Adding 5% to make it 64% during 4 years in KC....

59% versus 64% is like a completely different QB

Completion% /= accuracy.

It's a fair proxy, but Smith's % improved because he understood timing/rhythm in the offense and became more conservative. He's no more capable of routinely putting the ball in a bucket than he ever was, he just chooses easier/smarter buckets to throw it at.

Frosty · 10-31-2016, 03:09 PM

Foles has only had one season that he's had more INTs than TDs (last year with the Rams) including his rookie year on a putrid Eagles team. I don't know about all this "routinely" putting the ball in harm's way stuff. It actually looks like Foles' biggest problem is staying healthy as he has never made it through an entire season (though he was benched, not hurt, with the Rams). He has also fumbled quick a few times (13).

09-11-2016, 12:32 PM
Deberg_1990 In Search of a Life Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio Tx. Casino cash: $344454	Is it time to start Foles over Smith? Pathetic. He's played poorly today Thoughts?
Posts: 68,401

10-31-2016, 02:57 PM	#1171
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $-525936	How many guys have improved their accuracy at this point in heir career though? I don't really think it's something you can really improve by that much. Scheme around, etc maybe.
Posts: 84,149

10-31-2016, 03:02 PM	#1179
RunKC Andy Reid Supporter Join Date: Apr 2012 Casino cash: $-1400389	Another big reason why Andy would want Alex is probably the mismatch it creates. Every team we've played has had at least 1 LB/S spying Alex if he takes off. That's one less defender to guard Hill, Maclin or Kelce. __________________ Mike Greenberg@Espngreeny I can’t fathom what it must be like to be a fan of the #Chiefs. Adopt a Chief: Jared Wiley
Posts: 52,050

10-31-2016, 03:09 PM	#1185
Frosty Go Beavers! Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Washington Casino cash: $3528243	Foles has only had one season that he's had more INTs than TDs (last year with the Rams) including his rookie year on a putrid Eagles team. I don't know about all this "routinely" putting the ball in harm's way stuff. It actually looks like Foles' biggest problem is staying healthy as he has never made it through an entire season (though he was benched, not hurt, with the Rams). He has also fumbled quick a few times (13).
Posts: 14,537