Conspiracy, the Paranormal, the Unexplained and the Esoteric

[keg in kc]

Figure this would have a better chance of surviving in the Media Center than on the main page, and I'll be adding youtube and podcast links from time to time as I come across them, so it fits.

This has been something that's interested me from a very young age, all aspects of mysterious stuff, whether we're talking forgotten or forbidden archeology or civilization (Atlantis, pre-colombian exploration of america, etc), unexplained events (like Tunguska in 1908, the lost Roanoke Island colony, etc), paranormal events like ghosts, the study of ESP and that sort of thing, conspiracy (ranging from JFK to stuff like the perpetration of the drug war and the infilitration of the media by US intelligence) and, of course, UFOs (which to me means "unexplained" not "extraterrestrial" but that's a whole other topic).

Anything could show up, and everybody should feel free to add whatever they like. Just try to keep it as civil and respectful as possible. This is not intended to be a DC thread; it's as much for entertainment purposes as it is to solve all the world's mysteries.

**Although if anybody posts anything from Third Phase of Moon they should probably expect me to kick them in the balls.**

Few things I like to watch or listen to in no particular order (most of this can be found on itunes as well...):

The Paracast
Binall of America
The Gralian Report
The Paranormal Report
Dark City
Radio Misterioso
Open Minds (mostly their podcast)

That's it for now, just wanted to get this started. Been thinking about doing it for a while...

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Fish

Yeah. Don Berliner himself later said it was fake. I understand that the documents made reference to Area 51 S-4. But that designation didn't even exist until well after the dates on the documents. Along with a bunch of other stuff.

Not trying to piss on the nature of the thread, but that's pretty much accepted.

The nature of the thread is simply to provide a place to discuss this stuff. I post what I find interesting or entertaining but my interest should never be confused with belief in any particular thing. If you have some conflicting information for anything feel free to post it. Wouldn't be much of a discussion without different viewpoints.

Regarding the manual, if I remember right Berliner was ambivalent about them from the very beginning. There's been a pretty heavy effort to debunk them all along, as well as work to ascertain their provenance.

I tend to think of them much like the mj-12 docs: they're probably fake, with some snippets of real information in them. I think, for example, there was a group much like that outlined in the mj-12 docs, including the rumored members, but it was called something else.

I think there's a combination of disinformation by people like Doty and Moore, which includes some kernels of truth and some few real whistleblowers.

The story behind the manual seems very far fetched, some unknown individual taking pictures of them and then getting them developed at a pharmacy, or however it goes.

But on the flip side if they are fake then who, how and why? Just to **** with Berliner, try to pull one over on ufo nuts? To try to make some cash? Seems like an awful lot of work for no real payoff.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by Fish

Yeah. Don Berliner himself later said it was fake. I understand that the documents made reference to Area 51 S-4. But that designation didn't even exist until well after the dates on the documents. Along with a bunch of other stuff.

Not trying to piss on the nature of the thread, but that's pretty much accepted.

And on top of that, the document was made with, allegedly, the same type writer used in other counterfeit reports, and Truman's signature was directly lifted off another document. Im not 100% on the details, but there seems to be substantial evidence against it.

And yeah, im not trying to shit on the thread either.

I find this stuff very, very fascinating. I was watching a documentary the other night on the Phoenix Lights.....now there's one that's hard to explain.

[keg in kc]

On a completely unrelated note, I think the next few years will be interesting with regards to RAF Bentwaters. I think/have always thought Rendlesham may be more of a watershed event than even Roswell, and we'll have a lot of people hitting retirement age before too long.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by Jerm

Fire in the Sky freaked the ever loving hell out of me as a kid

Oh man....same here.

I was 8-9 years old, home alone at night and decided to watch this. Freaked me the **** out.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

And on top of that, the document was made with, allegedly, the same type writer used in other counterfeit reports, and Truman's signature was directly lifted off another document. Im not 100% on the details, but there seems to be substantial evidence against it.

And yeah, im not trying to shit on the thread either.

I find this stuff very, very fascinating. I was watching a documentary the other night on the Phoenix Lights.....now there's one that's hard to explain.

I think you might be mixing your stories but I'm not sure.

In any case you can't shit on the thread. I'm not sure why you guys keep worrying about that.

I would suggest though that if you're going to make some broad claims (pro or con) it might be worthwhile to provide some links to support or verify what you're saying. I follow this stuff pretty closely but it's impossible to keep track of every book or interview. So anything you may have seen or heard that sheds light (about anything...) I'm interested in hearing about.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Oh man....same here.

I was 8-9 years old, home alone at night and decided to watch this. Freaked me the **** out.

Travis Walton's given some good interviews in the last six months.

His story is actually quite a bit different from the movie. He thinks he was killed by accident, brought aboard the ship and brought back to life. Technologically I should say, not some woowoo new age stuff.

I know one interview was on the paracast. I'll have to dig around for any others. Might have done open minds. Was I think on coast to coast but that wouldn't be available.

[keg in kc]

Here's the paracast: http://www.theparacast.com/podcast/n...travis-walton/

[Rausch]

Once you've read a number of books from "INTRUDERS" to strange $3it like "COMMUNION" to the "Interrupted Journey" about the Betty and Barney Hill case there is only one thing you can conclude: IF these reports are reliable their perceptions have been distorted.

At the very beginning of these abductions all of them report time/perception distortions.

And each time someone is "taken" there's a description of something happening that we know not to be possible.

What if the "agent responsible" has the ability to cause hallucinations and sensations in people ? Be that the terrestrial or otherwise.

It's impossible to deny something is going on. There are far too many reports by otherwise sane people.

We should immediately quit questioning if something is going on and start investigating WHAT is going on...

[keg in kc]

Open Minds with Travis Walton: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/ufo_rad...duction-update

[Fish]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

The nature of the thread is simply to provide a place to discuss this stuff. I post what I find interesting or entertaining but my interest should never be confused with belief in any particular thing. If you have some conflicting information for anything feel free to post it. Wouldn't be much of a discussion without different viewpoints.

I appreciate the sentiment. But I don't really have much desire to be the debunking guy that shits on the thread contents, despite the urge with some of these topics. That's a surefire way for the thread to get stupid. Plus scott's head might actually explode.

Originally Posted by keg in kc

Regarding the manual, if I remember right Berliner was ambivalent about them from the very beginning. There's been a pretty heavy effort to debunk them all along, as well as work to ascertain their provenance.

I tend to think of them much like the mj-12 docs: they're probably fake, with some snippets of real information in them. I think, for example, there was a group much like that outlined in the mj-12 docs, including the rumored members, but it was called something else.

I think there's a combination of disinformation by people like Doty and Moore, which includes some kernels of truth and some few real whistleblowers.

The story behind the manual seems very far fetched, some unknown individual taking pictures of them and then getting them developed at a pharmacy, or however it goes.

But on the flip side if they are fake then who, how and why? Just to **** with Berliner, try to pull one over on ufo nuts? To try to make some cash? Seems like an awful lot of work for no real payoff.

The most popular of the debunkers have said that it was a misinformation thing. To me, it feels really fake. Like it was written with a very different audience in mind than military investigators. It had a bunch of useless info that you wouldn't expect.

Why would anybody go to the work of doing it? Same reason idiots go out in ape gear and make fake Bigfoot sightings.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Fish

I appreciate the sentiment. But I don't really have much desire to be the debunking guy that shits on the thread contents, despite the urge with some of these topics. That's a surefire way for the thread to get stupid. Plus scott's head might actually explode.

I'm already that guy. I think we should all look skeptically at all of this. That's not being a debunker. That's acknowledging that you don't know everything and looking for evidence of whatever the truth is rather than believing (or not, in the case of debunkers...) in something just because I/you/we decide we want to.

That's the dirty little secrets about debunkers: at their core they're just a different kind of believer. Anti-believers maybe. Whatever they are, it's not skeptical and it doesn't have anything to do with science. That's not what you're doing.

Discussing reasons why something may not be real is exactly the kind of thing we should be doing...

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by Jerm

So where do you guys stand on the Betty & Barney Hill and Travis Walton abductions?

Fire in the Sky freaked the ever loving hell out of me as a kid and it's still freaky to this day...

The Hills was probably the first well publicized case of abduction, and try as many did to poke holes in their testimony, no one ever could.

Travis Walton, all I can say is that people have picked at it for decades now and no one has veered from their story one iota, many have even re-passed more modern polygraphs. The book was awesome, but in a very rare instance, a tv show/movie equaled the book. This episode of Paranormal Witness brings back all but one of the men there that night and the emotions are still just as plainly raw as they were that night, the one guy is still crying almost like a baby over the fear it produced in him, decades later...



PS - Fish, hahaha no... this is one subject I will promise to never argue or get all mad about, might have in the past a little bit, but the older I get the more I realize its not my job to convince anyone of anything.

I totally understand how hard it might be for so many to not give a second thought to if they hadnt witnessed the things I've witnessed.

[Jerm]

Yeah I watched that episode of Paranormal Witness which was awesome.

I actually quite like that show...

Sightings back in the day was another doozy...they were the first to bring the Sallie House case to light so they're cool in my book lol.

[beach tribe]

I swear to god the government manipulates the weather in South FL.
Which I think is cool, but why keep it a secret? I don't get it.
I'm gonna take some pics of this shit and show you guys.
At dawn, and I know this because I have been getting up and Slaying 2-3lb (and up) Bass out of the Golf course lake about 10 paces from my door, There is a crisscross of contrails across the sky.
By 1pm they have dispersed out and give a light cloud coverage that probably knocks the Temp down 5-10 deg.
Why all the secrecy?

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Jerm

Yeah I watched that episode of Paranormal Witness which was awesome.

I actually quite like that show...

Sightings back in the day was another doozy...they were the first to bring the Sallie House case to light so they're cool in my book lol.

Nothing has ever been as cool as In Search Of. Unsolved Mysteries was pretty good too.