Investing megathread extravaganza

[DaFace]

A place to talk about investing stuff.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

How long do you typically finance them for?

15 years with the bank

with the owners for the 20% I offer them a 5 year balloon ammoritized for a 15 year payout but normally give them a higher interest rate like 8% to help motivate.

I never ever ever ever do a 30 year loan.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Originally Posted by Kiimosabi

Do you avoid PMI because the owner is financing your 20% downpayment? Or is it because you are financing with a non-conforming loan with a higher interest rate?

I avoid PMI because it costs money.

[Kiimo]

I'm clear on why you want to avoid PMI I'm just unclear on the how. It's like people buying condos out here and saying they don't pay association dues because they're a ripoff. Okay...go on...

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Rentals can be tough if you only have 1 or 2 and the reason is they normally don't generate enough cash flow. A hot water heater replacement can cost you $1000 and if you're clearing $50 /month on a rental after Principal/Interest/Taxes and Insurance well then two rentals will pay for that one water heater in a year. My break seemed to have come at 10 rentals to cover itself without having to pull money out of my pocket. but keep in mind I was at 100% financing too.

[lewdog]

Originally Posted by wutamess

I'm a novice investor. I admit. However, what have I said (or done) that makes you think I know little about investing? I have a 401K and Roth IRA both stocked with multiple high performing index, ETF and mutual funds for long term growth. I also have a play account I use for "gambling" money with the stock market.

Anyhow... Maybe I used a wrong buzz word or something. A regular brokerage account in her name cannot play the options market. So in that case... she will learn about investing and I"ll see what she can do and she will either fail or succeed but it'll be her choice.

Thanks for your input.

Absolutely, and I wasn't trying to offend you. Just looking at things a different way. Wasn't sure of your investing background. Sounds like you know more than I originally thought you did.

That being said there are plenty of index and ETF funds that can be bought in brokerage account. I'd lean that way if you're planning to have her invest. TD Ameritrade has 100+ index and ETF funds that trade for free. Might start there.

[lewdog]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

How long do you typically finance them for?

Hogfarmer can answer this more but here's my thoughts.

Financing a house will obviously give you the tax advantage of the interest paid on the mortgage for the year. However, seeing as you'll rent this and have a new line of income, you'll have to pay taxes on this income. I'd have no idea of the tax advantage of the mortgage interest over how much income you'd generate though. Maybe Hogfarmer can answer that?

It is a different type of investment though and is fairly liquid, especially when comparing to a 401k. I would never do it because of what Hog Farmer mentioned, maintenance cost. Being unhandy like myself, I'd have to contract out all the work. If you're handy, like you are, and can do most of the maintenance, you can make way more money.

If your sole goal is to lower your taxes, having your wife max out her 401k for the year ($18,000), decreases your taxable income by that exact amount.

[O.city]

I have a friend that I golf with alot that has over 90 rental properties. Seems to do pretty well?

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by Hog Farmer

15 years with the bank

with the owners for the 20% I offer them a 5 year balloon ammoritized for a 15 year payout but normally give them a higher interest rate like 8% to help motivate.

I never ever ever ever do a 30 year loan.

Yeah, it would have to be a 15 for it to work for me. I'd be lucky to live another 30 years. Just a matter of the monthly rent covering the payment. I haven't really crunched any real numbers yet to see if that's realistic.

Originally Posted by Hog Farmer

Rentals can be tough if you only have 1 or 2 and the reason is they normally don't generate enough cash flow. A hot water heater replacement can cost you $1000 and if you're clearing $50 /month on a rental after Principal/Interest/Taxes and Insurance well then two rentals will pay for that one water heater in a year. My break seemed to have come at 10 rentals to cover itself without having to pull money out of my pocket. but keep in mind I was at 100% financing too.

I wouldn't be at 100% financing. I'd probably be looking at 25% or so down for a lower payment so there's some extra money to help cover costs. As I mentioned, I'm not concerned so much with month to month income, I'm more interested in a place to put some money besides the 401k.

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by lewdog

Hogfarmer can answer this more but here's my thoughts.

Financing a house will obviously give you the tax advantage of the interest paid on the mortgage for the year. However, seeing as you'll rent this and have a new line of income, you'll have to pay taxes on this income. I'd have no idea of the tax advantage of the mortgage interest over how much income you'd generate though. Maybe Hogfarmer can answer that?

It is a different type of investment though and is fairly liquid, especially when comparing to a 401k. I would never do it because of what Hog Farmer mentioned, maintenance cost. Being unhandy like myself, I'd have to contract out all the work. If you're handy, like you are, and can do most of the maintenance, you can make way more money.

If you sole goal is to lower your taxes, having your wife max out her 401k for the year ($18,000), decreases your taxable income by that exact amount.

That does seem like the easiest, most practical thing to do. I just hate having all our eggs in one basket. You can hardly lose on real estate in the midwest. But there certainly will be headaches I'm sure. There's a reason most renters are renters, and I deal with the worst of the worst every day.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

My frame of thought has always been to use other peoples money. if you put a big down payment on a property then you have all that money tied up when it could be used to generate more income.

[Bugeater]

That's true. I could be using it to start my own hog farm.

[scho63]

Originally Posted by Hog Farmer

Rentals can be tough if you only have 1 or 2 and the reason is they normally don't generate enough cash flow. A hot water heater replacement can cost you $1000 and if you're clearing $50 /month on a rental after Principal/Interest/Taxes and Insurance well then two rentals will pay for that one water heater in a year. My break seemed to have come at 10 rentals to cover itself without having to pull money out of my pocket. but keep in mind I was at 100% financing too.

You answered an important question here for someone thinking about getting into the rental home game, I think Buehler for tax reasons.

You NEVER want to buy a rental for tax reasons, you want to buy it to make money and positive cash flow even if it's $25 a month. Taking money out of your pocket every month to pay for someone else to live in your home is ludicrous.

Great summary!

[Bugeater]

That was me. Thinking about all the potential headaches certainly has me leaning towards just dumping the money in the 401k.

[scho63]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

That was me. Thinking about all the potential headaches certainly has me leaning towards just dumping the money in the 401k.

Nothing wrong with a great rental property. Just buy it for the right reasons.

Location is paramount no matter how cliche

[O.city]

I'm looking to eventually get into the commercial real estate side of things. Right now, I rent my dental office. It's the same price as the tenant has paid there since 1981, so I'm not in a hurry to move. But I would eventually like to own my building I think.

My plan is to eventually have a little 3 offie strip mall, with my office on the end and rent out the 2 next to me.