****Our Wide Receivers Suck- Official Thread****

[Sofa King]

They can’t get open, they drop passes in their hands, their jet sweeps are slow and terrible. These guys are not good.

[BenoniBenko]

Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief

It's not just a WR problem, hasn't been all year. If you think Mahomes is playing great this year, you are delusional. He's playing good, but far from great. I can't explain why he made that throw on the pick and I can't explain why he didn't hit Pacheco on first and goal which appeared to be his primary read. Those two plays were huge mistakes, and as impactful as the mistakes made by our WR's. It's ok to say that, and I'm not panicking because its uncharacteristic of Mahomes. But yes, BITCH, he needs to be better too.

He's the best player in the NFL but somehow is playing with the worst recieving room in the entire league.

We'll see the same Mahomes we've been seeing if he was actually given good football players to catch his throws. Like a decrepit Juju in New England if brought back right now will make me feel really positive about going back to the Super Bowl.

That's what's so vexing about this season. WR is inundated with talent NFL draft after NFL draft and somehow, through bad drafting and bad decision making, we're stuck with this pile of shit WR room the same season Mahomes has by far the best defense he's ever had.

[Shoes]

Originally Posted by IowaHawkeyeChief

... I just put blame where it belongs. On that pick, it's on Pat. Feel free to give any explanation why that pass was thrown?

I think it's fair to be critical of where the pass was thrown but man the expectations for Mahomes are insanely high if we are putting all the blame on him for that play.

What is being lost is that Mahomes has to pick a spot to throw that ball when the pick/rub is happening. Mahomes doesn't get the benefit of seeing the pick happen and then either going downfield or back shoulder, his throwing motion starts as the rub mesh is occurring. What I have a problem with on Skyy's route is that you don't need hesitate or slightly chop your feet to catch a back shoulder ball, he can continue his speed down the field and open his hips to the sideline if Mahomes put the ball there. The only reason to slow down in that instance in my opinion is if that route turns into a 8 yard back shoulder hitch- aka that ball is thrown on a line if the DB plays it way over the top. I don't know the exact play design or progression so it's impossible for me to determine. In the end, Green Bay's DB plays it well, I just don't know how that play turns into an interception- that's what I have an issue with.

Absolutely you can point at Mahomes and say "Well Mahomes needs to throw the ball perfectly so JAG Moore can make the play". Technically you aren't wrong but I'd rather have a receiver who has the ability to at least fight for the ball so if Mahomes pass is a yard or two off, it doesn't end in a turnover.

At the end of the day Skyy Moore just doesn't do anything at a high enough level to warrant the amount of snaps he is getting on a championship caliber team. Sure Mahomes can play better and I'm sure he will, but we need more dynamic playmakers.

[notorious]

Originally Posted by Sofa King

The only way we'll upgrade the wr position at this point is if Skyy Moore blows his knee out and it forces Andy to play someone else. Which he won't. He'll just overcompensate with even more reeruned tricky gadget plays that go nowhere.

You are going to eat crow when Skyy blows up and makes 30 catches for 350 every season.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Shoes

I think it's fair to be critical of where the pass was thrown but man the expectations for Mahomes are insanely high if we are putting all the blame on him for that play.

What is being lost is that Mahomes has to pick a spot to throw that ball when the pick/rub is happening. Mahomes doesn't get the benefit of seeing the pick happen and then either going downfield or back shoulder, his throwing motion starts as the rub mesh is occurring. What I have a problem with on Skyy's route is that you don't need hesitate or slightly chop your feet to catch a back shoulder ball, he can continue his speed down the field and open his hips to the sideline if Mahomes put the ball there. The only reason to slow down in that instance in my opinion is if that route turns into a 8 yard back shoulder hitch- aka that ball is thrown on a line if the DB plays it way over the top. I don't know the exact play design or progression so it's impossible for me to determine. In the end, Green Bay's DB plays it well, I just don't know how that play turns into an interception- that's what I have an issue with.

Absolutely you can point at Mahomes and say "Well Mahomes needs to throw the ball perfectly so JAG Moore can make the play". Technically you aren't wrong but I'd rather have a receiver who has the ability to at least fight for the ball so if Mahomes pass is a yard or two off, it doesn't end in a turnover.

At the end of the day Skyy Moore just doesn't do anything at a high enough level to warrant the amount of snaps he is getting on a championship caliber team. Sure Mahomes can play better and I'm sure he will, but we need more dynamic playmakers.

Skyy is not an NFL level WR. But even for what he is (probably a guy that will tool around on NFL practice squads and get activated if teams have injuries) we are using him wrong too. The only positive WR trait he has is at the LOS where he can get a nice release if someone is pressing him and get open there. It is not much but that's it.

Skyy Moore should never be used as a vertical threat in this offense ever again.

But I fully expect him to be out there next week with zero coaching adjustments.

[wazu]

I want Moore to switch places with James on this list and Toney to switch places with MVS.

Chiefs wide receiver snap counts (Week 13 vs. Packers)

Rice - 46
Moore - 44
Watson - 40
Valdes-Scantling - 33
Toney - 12
James - 4

— Pete Sweeney (@pgsween) December 4, 2023

[JPH83]

I just don't understand how Moore, Toney and MVS look so much worse this season. I get having JJSS maybe helped them, but man. Toney you could argue it's the injuries, MVS...age? He still seems pretty quick.

Player development isn't linear I realise, but watching them make horrible, basic route running mistakes feels like coaching. If not actively bad coaching than at least an absence of good coaching. If it's combined with an unwillingness or inability to identify their relative strengths and weaknesses, maybe that's how you get this pile of turds. Baffling.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by JPH83

I just don't understand how Moore, Toney and MVS look so much worse this season. I get having JJSS maybe helped them, but man. Toney you could argue it's the injuries, MVS...age? He still seems pretty quick.

Player development isn't linear I realise, but watching them make horrible, basic route running mistakes feels like coaching. If not actively bad coaching than at least an absence of good coaching. If it's combined with an unwillingness or inability to identify their relative strengths and weaknesses, maybe that's how you get this pile of turds. Baffling.

MVS is the same player he always has been. He runs fast but can’t track a football. Unless Andy schemes him open is space he’s useless. Last year they did some of that but those plays go elsewhere.

Moore was no good last year either.

Toney barely played last year too.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by JPH83

I just don't understand how Moore, Toney and MVS look so much worse this season. I get having JJSS maybe helped them, but man. Toney you could argue it's the injuries, MVS...age? He still seems pretty quick.

Player development isn't linear I realise, but watching them make horrible, basic route running mistakes feels like coaching. If not actively bad coaching than at least an absence of good coaching. If it's combined with an unwillingness or inability to identify their relative strengths and weaknesses, maybe that's how you get this pile of turds. Baffling.

I think we are elevating these guys to roles where we are asking more from them. That and while kelce is still awesome he’s regressing just a tiny bit enough where we can’t hide these flaws as well. Mvs was making bad adjustments last year too. Skyy didn’t really play, and Toney and Watson didn’t play nearly as much as we remember. With Mvs, toney and James having some of these issues pre Kansas City I think we’ve just gravitated to athletes over instinct. And I imagine that will change this offseason. Rice seems to be a reflection of that.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Originally Posted by OKchiefs

Why can't it be both? There are former NFL players on Twitter calling out Skyy for running a bad route there. But even then, yes it was likely a bad decision to make that throw.

It can be both but def more on Mahomes and he admitted that in his press conference after the game.

[OKchiefs]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

It can be both but def more on Mahomes and he admitted that in the press conference.

Take anything he says in a press conference with a grain of salt. He also took blame for the non-call PI on MVS.

[DrunkBassGuitar]

Originally Posted by Shoes

I think it's fair to be critical of where the pass was thrown but man the expectations for Mahomes are insanely high if we are putting all the blame on him for that play.

What is being lost is that Mahomes has to pick a spot to throw that ball when the pick/rub is happening. Mahomes doesn't get the benefit of seeing the pick happen and then either going downfield or back shoulder, his throwing motion starts as the rub mesh is occurring. What I have a problem with on Skyy's route is that you don't need hesitate or slightly chop your feet to catch a back shoulder ball, he can continue his speed down the field and open his hips to the sideline if Mahomes put the ball there. The only reason to slow down in that instance in my opinion is if that route turns into a 8 yard back shoulder hitch- aka that ball is thrown on a line if the DB plays it way over the top. I don't know the exact play design or progression so it's impossible for me to determine. In the end, Green Bay's DB plays it well, I just don't know how that play turns into an interception- that's what I have an issue with.

Absolutely you can point at Mahomes and say "Well Mahomes needs to throw the ball perfectly so JAG Moore can make the play". Technically you aren't wrong but I'd rather have a receiver who has the ability to at least fight for the ball so if Mahomes pass is a yard or two off, it doesn't end in a turnover.

At the end of the day Skyy Moore just doesn't do anything at a high enough level to warrant the amount of snaps he is getting on a championship caliber team. Sure Mahomes can play better and I'm sure he will, but we need more dynamic playmakers.

someone in the GDT said it and I agree, I don't know enough to determine who is at fault but Mahomes has earned the benefit of the doubt and Skyy Moore hasn't

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

It can be both but def more on Mahomes and he admitted that in the press conference.

I don’t know about that. Mahomes always takes the blame. He’s right that he probably should have led way more back shoulder. But he is not “allowed” to point out where skyy got tripped up.

But with the RPO rub that read needs to be instantaneous and it seems reasonable why mahomes would have opted for more of a fade. It’s probably more a both sides blame thing. I think the frustrating thing is where other QBs get bailed out all the time by errant passes, we have zero margin for error which looks to be the case here where just running the right route at minimum likely saves this from an INT.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Originally Posted by OKchiefs

Take anything he says in a press conference with a grain of salt. He also took blame for the non-call PI on MVS.

So you think that was a good throw he made to Moore? Let's be real it was a terrible throw and decision.

If that was another chiefs QB that did it you'd be calling for his head but because it is Mahomes it is Moore's fault.

Obviously Mahomes isn't the main problem w the offense but he's got to be better and he knows that.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy

So you think that was a good throw he made to Moore? Let's be real it was a terrible throw and decision.

If that was another chiefs QB that did it you'd be calling for his head but because it is Mahomes it is Moore's fault.

Obviously Mahomes isn't the main problem w the offense but he's got to be better and he knows that.

I don’t think it’s an awful decision other than choosing the fade over back shoulder. But as some have pointed out that is a decision mahomes has to make before the play develops because otherwise you’ll get flagged for ineligible man downfield. It is still a good read to throw to skyy because rashee did a terrific job on the rub. It’s more of ball location that’s a little questionable. If anything mahomes just made it harder for skyy to complete the play, but I just can’t see a regular WR at the bare minimum not breaking the pass up

[BleedingRed]

Can we just call Desean Jackson?