****Our Wide Receivers Suck- Official Thread****

[Sofa King]

They can’t get open, they drop passes in their hands, their jet sweeps are slow and terrible. These guys are not good.

[-King-]

To put it in perspective: here's a comparison with a TOTALLY random WR. Very random:

MVS:
Cap hits past 2 years: $15M
Yards: 936
Catches: 56
TDs: 3
Catch %: 52%


Totally random receiver that I randomly chose to use in this random comparison:

Cap Hit: 19M
Yards: 2900
Catches: 198
TDs: 16 (18 APY)
Catch %: 71%

That's why the goal should never be to just be cheaper

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

The eagles were pretty much letting Justin Watson roam free all day long. You think kelce is getting bottled up because he can’t beat single coverage? When you have a stud like kelce you’re gonna have multiple people collapsing on him. When you run the ball for 100 yards on a great pass rush they’re going to start paying attention to the run. That includes keeping a lb to spy on mahomes and keep him in the pocket.

And with all that our WRs STILL are bad at getting open.

And once again you have to address that even when Watson, Mvs and skyy do get open they’re risky to throw to because they are very subpar at finishing their route and catch. So even if it is true that these guys are good enough to get open we’ve seen time and time again that they’re ineffective even when they’re open. That’s a big problem and undoubtedly why mahomes doesn’t trust these guys

Except they weren't having problems getting open, they were absolutely getting open, they just stopped catching the damned ball.

You've decided on a narrative and aren't looking at it logically.

The Eagles decided they were going to take Kelce away; and for the most part, they did. And the WR's were beating coverage, and doing it consistently. They didn't "let Watson run free", he was beating the coverage (or Andy was using scheme to beat the rules of coverage, same difference) he just dropped several balls. And MVS beat single man coverage for what should have been the winning TD, he just dropped the damned ball.

If they don't drop those balls, the narrative this week is how bad the Eagles' game plan was.

This is how offense is supposed to work; you beat the defense's plan, which was to take away your best weapon. The receivers just dropped the ****ing ball.

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by O.city

It’s all about money. Guys have to play to their contract or you’re losing value.

Pat deserves some blame here. Yes the drops on the final drive were killer. They might not have been in that spot if the 50 million dollar qb hadn’t thrown an interception in the endzone or the hall of game tight end hadn’t fumbled at the 9 yard line.

I don’t put the same expectations on cheap young draft picks. They’re gonna **** up and do dumb shit. It happens.

It's the mistakes overall that are killing us.

Before Skyy's drop at the end in Denver we had an MVS fumble (after he caught it) and a Mecole punt returner fumble that basically iced the game.

Before the MVS debacle against th Eagles, Patrick threw a god awful INT and Kelce fumbled. Both in the red zone.

It's a snowball effect on errors. Seriously just cut the errors in half and convert those to FG's and we will win

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by -King-

To put it in perspective: here's a comparison with a TOTALLY random WR. Very random:

MVS:
Cap hits past 2 years: $15M
Yards: 936
Catches: 56
TDs: 3
Catch %: 52%


Totally random receiver that I randomly chose to use in this random comparison:

Cap Hit: 19M
Yards: 2900
Catches: 198
TDs: 16 (18 APY)
Catch %: 71%

That's why the goal should never be to just be cheaper

the 'goal' was not to be cheaper.

And you didn't choose a 'random' receiver, you specifically chose a receiver that has outplayed his contract. There's nothing random about that.

It's clear that MVS has not played up to his, but you don't have to be disingenuous to show that.

The goal was to find specific skill-sets that had been underutilized and get more out of them. If you want to argue that hasn't worked out as hoped, I won't disagree.

[O.city]

The problem with looking for certain skill sets is that defenses aren’t dumb and can put them in places they can’t excel.

They went cheap on weapons and it hasn’t worked this year after it did last year. It’s time to not go cheap and expand some resources.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by O.city

The problem with looking for certain skill sets is that defenses aren’t dumb and can put them in places they can’t excel.

They went cheap on weapons and it hasn’t worked this year after it did last year. It’s time to not go cheap and expand some resources.

I don't disagree, except that you've got half your defense up for new contracts and you've got like $60m in cap space to try to get it all done.

And I'm absolutely against pushing any significant amount of Mahomes money forward, as I really don't want to have lost seasons in cap hell.

It needs to be better, but you don't need to panic. Swap in a Mooney for MVS, Rice in year two, draft another WR high, and it's probably considerably better.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

I don't disagree, except that you've got half your defense up for new contracts and you've got like $60m in cap space to try to get it all done.

And I'm absolutely against pushing any significant amount of Mahomes money forward, as I really don't want to have lost seasons in cap hell.

It needs to be better, but you don't need to panic. Swap in a Mooney for MVS, Rice in year two, draft another WR high, and it's probably considerably better.

This is why you don’t keep elite defenses together and why it’s better to do it on offense.

It’s too costly on defense because you need a whole hell of a lot of guys to do it. It’s more unit than individual player and that’s costly.

They need to overhaul the weapons, mainly a high end wr. That would allow the o the others to slot in where they need to be

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

the 'goal' was not to be cheaper.

And you didn't choose a 'random' receiver, you specifically chose a receiver that has outplayed his contract. There's nothing random about that.

It's clear that MVS has not played up to his, but you don't have to be disingenuous to show that.

The goal was to find specific skill-sets that had been underutilized and get more out of them. If you want to argue that hasn't worked out as hoped, I won't disagree.

Trust me, as random as that was, there was nothing disingenuous about it... Just 2 options we had available at that time

[TEX]

Originally Posted by O.city

Yeah, if you take some random clips thru a game, guys may not be open. That’s every team in the league.

This whole bullshit that they “aren’t getting open where they’re supposed to be” is just tired shit.

They’re not open every play. Yet when it gets nutt cutting time late, weirdly guys are open where they’re supposed to be and Pat puts it on them and they drop it.

Turnovers and penalties are the big issue but the drops are the shiny toy everyone focuses on. Sure, that’s a problem, but it’s secondary

Originally Posted by Delano

They’ve had to chip so much that Andy had to devise double tight end motion to disguise who and where the chip was going to happen. Trying to help the tackles but also keep Kelce in tight while getting a semi-free release.

That shit looked cool though!

[O.city]

I’m just not a “spread it around” guy. Sure if they’re tripling Kelce, or whatever throw it elsewhere.

But give me 2-3 weapons and get them targets. Throw it to rice and Toney, take a deep shot to hardman and forget the rest

[O.city]

The best weapons come from early in the draft. We either need to trade up, or trade for and pay one of those.

And no, I don’t care about Cooper kupp outliers. Looking for those is how you end up with sky moore

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by O.city

The problem with looking for certain skill sets is that defenses aren’t dumb and can put them in places they can’t excel.

They went cheap on weapons and it hasn’t worked this year after it did last year. It’s time to not go cheap and expand some resources.

The Chiefs had a disastrous group of tackles last year. They were so bad that Andy had to have a RB or TE help chip one of them on almost every passing play except in the Super Bowl due to the field.

They fixed the tackles and the OL actually looks top
Tier in pass pro.

Andy and Veach paraded Toney as WR1 and Skyy as a legitimately improved weapon that was turning the corner all off-season. At the combine, before the draft, in OTA's and even in camp.

That's the difference with the receivers. Toney and Skyy weren't at all what they said/thought they'd be

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by O.city

Yeah, if you take some random clips thru a game, guys may not be open. That’s every team in the league.

This whole bullshit that they “aren’t getting open where they’re supposed to be” is just tired shit.

They’re not open every play. Yet when it gets nutt cutting time late, weirdly guys are open where they’re supposed to be and Pat puts it on them and they drop it.

Turnovers and penalties are the big issue but the drops are the shiny toy everyone focuses on. Sure, that’s a problem, but it’s secondary

And yet people had no issue cherrypicking clips showing mahomes, a HOF QB, missing WRs left or right? It isn't cherrypicking. Our WRs have terrible football IQ. Mvs and Watson are smart guys who have terrible instincts and are consistently inconsistent in how they close routes and attack the ball. That didn't just happen this year. They've been doing this since the damn beginning of time. Skyy doesn't get open and runs awful routes when he does. These are knowns.

I mean, goddamn... We're not even talking about the wide range of WR effort passes we can't attempt. We're not even talking about trying to throwing to a spot because our WRs don't consistently hit it. We are talking about WRs who aren't doing the bare minimum where scheme opens them up and the ball hits their damn hands with no contest.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by RunKC

The Chiefs had a disastrous group of tackles last year. They were so bad that Andy had to have a RB or TE help chip one of them on almost every passing play except in the Super Bowl due to the field.

They fixed the tackles and the OL actually looks top
Tier in pass pro.

Andy and Veach paraded Toney as WR1 and Skyy as a legitimately improved weapon that was turning the corner all off-season. At the combine, before the draft, in OTA's and even in camp.

That's the difference with the receivers. Toney and Skyy weren't at all what they said/thought they'd be

Sky is why you don’t draft guys from small schools with shit measurable early.

[O.city]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

And yet people had no issue cherrypicking clips showing mahomes, a HOF QB, missing WRs left or right? It isn't cherrypicking. Our WRs have terrible football IQ. Mvs and Watson are smart guys who have terrible instincts and are consistently inconsistent in how they close routes and attack the ball. That didn't just happen this year. They've been doing this since the damn beginning of time. Skyy doesn't get open and runs awful routes when he does. These are knowns.

I mean, goddamn... We're not even talking about the wide range of WR effort passes we can't attempt. We're not even talking about trying to throwing to a spot because our WRs don't consistently hit it. We are talking about WRs who aren't doing the bare minimum where scheme opens them up and the ball hits their damn hands with no contest.

My expectations are higher for a hall of fame qb than some mid tier at best wrs

Sorry yours aren’t I guess