***Official Bushwood Country Club Lounge***

[smittysbar]

Okay, here is a place for the Golfers to talk about tournaments, clubs, swing help or thoughts.

Today is the Players Championship, which I think ought to be the 5th Major. Largest pot in the PGA. The daunting 17th, which seems to bring excitement every year. At least we will get to see Sergio blow up yet again.

I am ready to see some water balls!

[ILChief]

When did people start liking Tiger again? I thought he was still the POS that cheated on his smoke machine wife with any skank with a pulse

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Originally Posted by ILChief

When did people start liking Tiger again? I thought he was still the POS that cheated on his smoke machine wife with any skank with a pulse

Um...that's actually WHY we like him. A lot of golfers win championships, but before Tiger, none had done it while banging Denny's waitresses in port-a-johns between holes.

[Pablo]

Originally Posted by Chief Northman

**** Tiger.

Canadians do hate grass hockey. Not enough ice for their liking.

[GloryDayz]

Originally Posted by ILChief

When did people start liking Tiger again? I thought he was still the POS that cheated on his smoke machine wife with any skank with a pulse

SOme of us never stopped. Don't get me wrong, I really like Phil (I'm a lefty...), but Tiger is awesome, and always has been.

I think I'm on record as saying, "Like Jeff Gordon changed/moved NASCAR exponentially, so too did Tiger." We could argue all day about Jeff Gordon changing NASCAR, but I think it's clear that Tiger is the single biggest catalyst that's ever happened to golf.

As for his sexual excursions, Meh...

[Chief Northman]

Originally Posted by Pablo

Canadians do hate grass hockey. Not enough ice for their liking.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHammersticks

Um...that's actually WHY we like him. A lot of golfers win championships, but before Tiger, none had done it while banging Denny's waitresses in port-a-johns between holes.

Sadly, this is not true at all. Even someone as revered as Palmer was a notorious pussy hound on the Tour while married.

[Why Not?]

Originally Posted by GloryDayz

SOme of us never stopped. Don't get me wrong, I really like Phil (I'm a lefty...), but Tiger is awesome, and always has been.

I think I'm on record as saying, "Like Jeff Gordon changed/moved NASCAR exponentially, so too did Tiger." We could argue all day about Jeff Gordon changing NASCAR, but I think it's clear that Tiger is the single biggest catalyst that's ever happened to golf.

As for his sexual excursions, Meh...

This. I could give a damn about what these guys(athletes)do on their own time. Tiger is the best I’ve ever seen, period.

[ROYC75]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Sadly, this is not true at all. Even someone as revered as Palmer was a notorious pussy hound on the Tour while married.

Uh, yes, Palmer was a hound dog in heat on the tour.

Originally Posted by Why Not?

This. I could give a damn about what these guys(athletes)do on their own time. Tiger is the best I’ve ever seen, period.

Best at what? I'm going go with his talent,play on the tour ?

IMHO,I have to politely disagree. IMHO,I have seen both, I will go with Jack.

Let me break down the reasons why.

Tiger
Better Clubs - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Better Balls - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Challengers- Who all has been a challenge week in,week out for Tiger on the tour. Phil Mickelson has five majors, Ernie Els has four, and Vijay Singh has three.

Jack
Clubs - not on par with what Tiger had to play with., how much more dominate could Jack of been
Balls - not on par with what Tiger had to play with.
OK, Jack was hitting the ball 300 yards with wooden clubs
Challengers - Jack had many,weekly it was somebody. Palmer,Player,Weiskopf,Trevino,Watson, Ballesteros,Floyd.
All of these golfers have 4 majors or more during Jacks time on the tour.

Now, Tiger has the chance now with his new found health,Health he has sought to get, worked his ass off to achieve and now he is back on the tour. There is some very good golfers coming on strong to challenge him in his latter age of life. Can he get back to winning, winning dominately as he did when he was younger?

But as of now, Jack Nicklaus is still the Greatest golfer to play the game.

[Why Not?]

Originally Posted by ROYC75

Uh, yes, Palmer was a hound dog in heat on the tour.



Best at what? I'm going go with his talent,play on the tour ?

IMHO,I have to politely disagree. IMHO,I have seen both, I will go with Jack.

Let me break down the reasons why.

Tiger
Better Clubs - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Better Balls - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Challengers- Who all has been a challenge week in,week out for Tiger on the tour. Phil Mickelson has five majors, Ernie Els has four, and Vijay Singh has three.

Jack
Clubs - not on par with what Tiger had to play with., how much more dominate could Jack of been
Balls - not on par with what Tiger had to play with.
OK, Jack was hitting the ball 300 yards with wooden clubs
Challengers - Jack had many,weekly it was somebody. Palmer,Player,Weiskopf,Trevino,Watson, Ballesteros,Floyd.
All of these golfers have 4 majors or more during Jacks time on the tour.

Now, Tiger has the chance now with his new found health,Health he has sought to get, worked his ass off to achieve and now he is back on the tour. There is some very good golfers coming on strong to challenge him in his latter age of life. Can he get back to winning, winning dominately as he did when he was younger?

But as of now, Jack Nicklaus is still the Greatest golfer to play the game.

Jack won 4 majors in my lifetime and the last one came when I was 9 years old. I threw the “best I’ve ever seen” in there for a reason.

[srvy]

The Golden Bear was also a 2 time US Amature champion and in his finale year as an amature was runner up to Arnold Palmer in the US Open at Cherry Hills at 20.


Many younger folks unkindly remember The Golden Bear as Fat Jack .

[ROYC75]

Originally Posted by srvy

The Golden Bear was also a 2 time US Amature champion and in his finale year as an amature was runner up to Arnold Palmer in the US Open at Cherry Hills at 20.


Many younger folks unkindly remember The Golden Bear as Fat Jack .

Uh yes he did, thanks for adding to the mix!

[DRM08]

Originally Posted by ROYC75

Uh, yes, Palmer was a hound dog in heat on the tour.



Best at what? I'm going go with his talent,play on the tour ?

IMHO,I have to politely disagree. IMHO,I have seen both, I will go with Jack.

Let me break down the reasons why.

Tiger
Better Clubs - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Better Balls - 40/50 yrs difference, a plus for Tiger
Challengers- Who all has been a challenge week in,week out for Tiger on the tour. Phil Mickelson has five majors, Ernie Els has four, and Vijay Singh has three.

Jack
Clubs - not on par with what Tiger had to play with., how much more dominate could Jack of been
Balls - not on par with what Tiger had to play with.
OK, Jack was hitting the ball 300 yards with wooden clubs
Challengers - Jack had many,weekly it was somebody. Palmer,Player,Weiskopf,Trevino,Watson, Ballesteros,Floyd.
All of these golfers have 4 majors or more during Jacks time on the tour.

Now, Tiger has the chance now with his new found health,Health he has sought to get, worked his ass off to achieve and now he is back on the tour. There is some very good golfers coming on strong to challenge him in his latter age of life. Can he get back to winning, winning dominately as he did when he was younger?

But as of now, Jack Nicklaus is still the Greatest golfer to play the game.

The equipment argument is nonsense. Jack's competitors had to use the same equipment. If anything, poor equipment actually helped the older elite golfers separate themselves from the field.

Tiger grew up with the older equipment in the 1970's and 1980's. He shot incredible scores at very young ages with this older equipment. Tiger has said if he made the rules, everyone today would be playing persimmon and balata. That's because he knows there are a bunch of younger guys on Tour today who would not be able to strike the ball as well as he could with that equipment.

The equipment today does not help an old school guy like Tiger. It helps all the lower level guys who might not be able to flush their shots, might not have the super high/soft ball flight that Tiger & Jack were naturally blessed with, might not be able to spin it as well as someone like Tiger or Jack. The newer equipment levels the playing field instead of making it easier for the elite players to dominate the competition.

[ROYC75]

Originally Posted by DRM08

The equipment argument is nonsense. Jack's competitors had to use the same equipment. If anything, poor equipment actually helped the older elite golfers separate themselves from the field.

Tiger grew up with the older equipment in the 1970's and 1980's. He shot incredible scores at very young ages with this older equipment. Tiger has said if he made the rules, everyone today would be playing persimmon and balata. That's because he knows there are a bunch of younger guys on Tour today who would not be able to strike the ball as well as he could with that equipment.

The equipment today does not help an old school guy like Tiger. It helps all the lower level guys who might not be able to flush their shots, might not have the super high/soft ball flight that Tiger & Jack were naturally blessed with, might not be able to spin it as well as someone like Tiger or Jack. The newer equipment levels the playing field instead of making it easier for the elite players to dominate the competition.

Let me say this up front, being blind or just not accepting the facts is not a reason for argument.

First off, I played golf in the 70's until the present. I drove the ball 270 to 300 depending on the fairways. With today's clubs it improved 285 to 320 depending on the fairway. Today's clubs do give certain players an advantage on distance,balls in the fairways, softness on the greens, etc. I'm a long ball hitter and it was much easier to get into trouble with the older clubs and balls, a slice could really take off on you. Where as today's clubs are more forgiving with a bigger sweet spot. Even the golf balls are designed ( dimples ) to be more forgiving, cutting down on a misplaced hit. The newer equipment will allow any golfer to score better, to attain a lower score, regardless of your talent level.

So yes, today's clubs and balls can make a difference. Besides, we are talking about 2 golfers in two different era's. Each player was awesome in their own era, it has always been difficult to compare players, teams, from different era's because of changing rules /& or equipment.

You are saying Jack was better than his competition because of talent. Yet Jack played against better competitors in his era.

You are saying the better equipment is not a help to Tiger? That his talent is better, yet still many golf experts claim that he is not playing to the talent level as a whole ( field ) as Jack did. Plus the facts show the newer equipment does help current golfer achieve better scores. So Tiger in his prime was much better than the competition he was playing with. Now with that said,Tiger is blessed with a talent level we have not seen since the likes of Jack Nicklaus.

[Prison Bitch]

No way can you touch 320 with a driver. Not even close. I used to golfwith some burly 30 year old big hitters who thought they were bombing 300, and one day I brought my GPS and marked their distances.....250 Max


Everyone overestimates their length. In more ways than one

[DRM08]

Originally Posted by ROYC75

Let me say this up front, being blind or just not accepting the facts is not a reason for argument.

First off, I played golf in the 70's until the present. I drove the ball 270 to 300 depending on the fairways. With today's clubs it improved 285 to 320 depending on the fairway. Today's clubs do give certain players an advantage on distance,balls in the fairways, softness on the greens, etc. I'm a long ball hitter and it was much easier to get into trouble with the older clubs and balls, a slice could really take off on you. Where as today's clubs are more forgiving with a bigger sweet spot. Even the golf balls are designed ( dimples ) to be more forgiving, cutting down on a misplaced hit. The newer equipment will allow any golfer to score better, to attain a lower score, regardless of your talent level.

So yes, today's clubs and balls can make a difference. Besides, we are talking about 2 golfers in two different era's. Each player was awesome in their own era, it has always been difficult to compare players, teams, from different era's because of changing rules /& or equipment.

You are saying Jack was better than his competition because of talent. Yet Jack played against better competitors in his era.

You are saying the better equipment is not a help to Tiger? That his talent is better, yet still many golf experts claim that he is not playing to the talent level as a whole ( field ) as Jack did. Plus the facts show the newer equipment does help current golfer achieve better scores. So Tiger in his prime was much better than the competition he was playing with. Now with that said,Tiger is blessed with a talent level we have not seen since the likes of Jack Nicklaus.

You calling me blind? Look at hybrid clubs and Pro-V1 balls compared to the old 1 irons or 2 irons with balata. Nicklaus had an enormous advantage over his competition with long irons. They were hard as hell to hit flush and he was better than anyone at it, blessed with natural ability to hit them higher and softer than anyone.

Guess what, Tiger had similar talent to Nicklaus with long irons. This advantage was wiped out with the development of the new technology in the early 2000's. The guys ranked around 100 in the world who went from struggling to pull off shots with long irons suddenly had hybrids to help them hit a high, soft shot along the lines of what Jack or Tiger could do with the older technology.

Tiger is an old school guy. If anything, I believe he has actually struggled to adapt to the newer technology. It's designed to go dead straight and he prefers to shape the ball. Bubba is the only guy I have seen in the modern game who can really shape the ball easily with the modern equipment instead of playing straighter shots. Meanwhile Tiger will aim 30 yards left trying to play a big fade and then hit a dead straight pull shot. Too stubborn to just go with the straight shot like so many other Tour players do today.