***Official 2024 STL Cardinals Thread ***

[BigRedChief]

I'll update the rosters and opening day lineup when its officially released.

2024 Opening Day roster.

Spoiler!

Our 2024 Opening Day roster is set!#ForTheLou pic.twitter.com/YdcaRqRVtz

— St. Louis Cardinals (@Cardinals) March 27, 2024

For the new Cardinal fans that joined the Planet since last year, here are some of the historical threads going back to 2006.

Spoiler!

2023 thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=348136
2022 thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/show...8#post16877588
2021 Thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=337124
2020 Thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=329273
2019 Thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=320239
2018 Thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=312812
2012 Thread
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=254619
etc.
All the way back to 2006 WS
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=312812
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[George Liquor]

I thought Pham hated it here? Or did he just hate Tony?

[raybec 4]

Originally Posted by George Liquor

I thought Pham hated it here? Or did he just hate Tony?

It's ok though because the Cardinals will move Pham to the bullpen in long relief. Just because he's always been an outfielder doesn't mean he can't add value there. They're always finding new and interesting ways to **** up a player.

[George Liquor]

Originally Posted by raybec 4

It's ok though because the Cardinals will move Pham to the bullpen in long relief. Just because he's always been an outfielder doesn't mean he can't add value there. They're always finding new and interesting ways to **** up a player.

I also seem to remember PGM having a hate boner for Pham well before Heyward and Noot. I bet he's thrilled.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by George Liquor

I thought Pham hated it here? Or did he just hate Tony?

He hated Matheny.

I've told the story about him making an awesome catch in LF one day after replacing some hack we'd put in the OF (something ridiculous like Matt Adams) and just hate glaring into the dugout for the rest of the inning.

I don't think he had a problem with St. Louis apart from absolutely despising Mike Matheny.

The problem is that we have a clubhouse culture that is so weird and largely indifferent that adding someone like Pham can be seen as a plus. And frankly, it probably is.

In no sane world should a team with the resources and fan support that the Cardinals have need to add a volatile headcase like Pham to get some energy in the room. Yet...here we are.

Because for a decade we've avoided bringing anyone in with a personality so we ended up with shit like Dexter Fowler instead of Bryce Harper. Now the entire team looks like it couldn't give less of **** about being there.

Coinflip odds that Pham throws hands with Arenado at some point. Because god almighty has Arenado put a stamp on the last season+. That dude just doesn't seem to give a shit at all. And at some point that's gonna piss Pham right off.

[raybec 4]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

He hated Matheny.

I've told the story about him making an awesome catch in LF one day after replacing some hack we'd put in the OF (something ridiculous like Matt Adams) and just hate glaring into the dugout for the rest of the inning.

I don't think he had a problem with St. Louis apart from absolutely despising Mike Matheny.

The problem is that we have a clubhouse culture that is so weird and largely indifferent that adding someone like Pham can be seen as a plus. And frankly, it probably is.

In no sane world should a team with the resources and fan support that the Cardinals have need to add a volatile headcase like Pham to get some energy in the room. Yet...here we are.

Because for a decade we've avoided bringing anyone in with a personality so we ended up with shit like Dexter Fowler instead of Bryce Harper. Now the entire team looks like it couldn't give less of **** about being there.

Coinflip odds that Pham throws hands with Arenado at some point. Because god almighty has Arenado put a stamp on the last season+. That dude just doesn't seem to give a shit at all. And at some point that's gonna piss Pham right off.

I hope you're right. Arenado walks like the big dog while hitting jack shit.

[George Liquor]

Ok that makes more sense.

[DJ's left nut]

So the Cardinals have 3/5 of an almost decent rotation next year at really a nothing pricetag.

Gray, Fedde and Gibson would cost them $45 million combined next season and if those are your 2, 4 and 5 starters, you're really not in bad shape.

Sadly, they've committed $30 million to Mikolas and Matz next season. And will likely pick up Lynn's option at $11 million next season as well. So they'll end up spending $40 million on those 3 buckets of crap who might give them 350 replacement level innings next season (so, y'know, about $35 million set on fire).

And they can't develop pitching worth a shit so Libby, Thompson, McGreevy and Graceffo are essentially organizational non-entities. So this is what we'll be treated to for 2026 and beyond, I'm guessing. Just a lot of dumpster diving for old arms that can absorb innings at a league average rate. Maybe.

[DJ's left nut]

It's really strange to me that they seem to have conceded that they can't develop arms and yet they aren't firing anybody on account of it.

Their entire offseason was an acknowledgement that their farm wasn't going to meaningfully contribute. And their draft full of low ceiling options further confirmed it. They're just looking to throw as many high-ceiling bodies at the problem as they can in the hopes that a couple of them become Kyle Gibson when they grow up.

Someone like Ian Bedell is a legitimate hope for the future for them. Because he might not be hot garbage (even though they know full well he won't actually be good).

This team just has a .500 mindset; the soul of a semi-finalist.

[Rams Fan]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

So the Cardinals have 3/5 of an almost decent rotation next year at really a nothing pricetag.

Gray, Fedde and Gibson would cost them $45 million combined next season and if those are your 2, 4 and 5 starters, you're really not in bad shape.

Sadly, they've committed $30 million to Mikolas and Matz next season. And will likely pick up Lynn's option at $11 million next season as well. So they'll end up spending $40 million on those 3 buckets of crap who might give them 350 replacement level innings next season (so, y'know, about $35 million set on fire).

And they can't develop pitching worth a shit so Libby, Thompson, McGreevy and Graceffo are essentially organizational non-entities. So this is what we'll be treated to for 2026 and beyond, I'm guessing. Just a lot of dumpster diving for old arms that can absorb innings at a league average rate. Maybe.

The best part is trading for Fedde actually saves them $ next season.

Wanna bet that they'll pocket the $1.5 mil. salary difference?

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Rams Fan

The best part is trading for Fedde actually saves them $ next season.

Wanna bet that they'll pocket the $1.5 mil. salary difference?

I just love they they insisted in the off-season they were going to raise payroll then...didn't.

And then when the deadline comes they say they aren't taking on more payroll.

And they wonder why ticket sales are down.

They gave the game away 3 seasons ago when they so openly cooked their books to say they raised payroll. They got Wainwright on a backloaded deal then counted his AAV; did the same with Goldschmidt. They had the Rockies paying almost all of Arenado's salary but counted his full salary in their public proclamations. The following year they replace Molina with Contreras at a lesser payroll figure but again, cite his AAV and ignore the backloading.

Wanna bet they'll count cash spending on Contreras next season when the case outlay gets above his AAV?

I mean they're just so damn dishonest. The open antagonism of the fanbase is just insane to me. This is the shit they'll say OUT LOUD. Can you imagine what they say behind closed doors.

As much as anyone hates this organization and ownership, you just don't hate them enough. These people have zero respect for you as a fan or the fanbase writ large. They're the absolute ****ing worst.

And fellas, it's not gonna get better. DeWitt's dipshit silver spoon kid is even worse. And they can't sell the team now that rates are up and debt service on a $3 billion acquisition will be staggering.

This is what you've got, fellas. For a loooooooong time. Better hope we manage to get generational hitter in the 13th round because lord knows this team doesn't intend to try anytime soon.

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Originally Posted by George Liquor

I also seem to remember PGM having a hate boner for Pham well before Heyward and Noot. I bet he's thrilled.

Ah the Ole "Turdy" Pham era

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by Pasta Little Brioni

Ah the Ole "Turdy" Pham era

At least he plays with some passion. This clubhouse could use a big jolt of that passion.

[Miles]

Looks like a pretty solid trade in a vacuum. I was guessing they were going to payroll dump Edman separately and then use the salary for some mediocre vet that cost some other asset.

[Rams Fan]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I just love they they insisted in the off-season they were going to raise payroll then...didn't.

And then when the deadline comes they say they aren't taking on more payroll.

And they wonder why ticket sales are down.

They gave the game away 3 seasons ago when they so openly cooked their books to say they raised payroll. They got Wainwright on a backloaded deal then counted his AAV; did the same with Goldschmidt. They had the Rockies paying almost all of Arenado's salary but counted his full salary in their public proclamations. The following year they replace Molina with Contreras at a lesser payroll figure but again, cite his AAV and ignore the backloading.

Wanna bet they'll count cash spending on Contreras next season when the case outlay gets above his AAV?

I mean they're just so damn dishonest. The open antagonism of the fanbase is just insane to me. This is the shit they'll say OUT LOUD. Can you imagine what they say behind closed doors.

As much as anyone hates this organization and ownership, you just don't hate them enough. These people have zero respect for you as a fan or the fanbase writ large. They're the absolute ****ing worst.

And fellas, it's not gonna get better. DeWitt's dipshit silver spoon kid is even worse. And they can't sell the team now that rates are up and debt service on a $3 billion acquisition will be staggering.

This is what you've got, fellas. For a loooooooong time. Better hope we manage to get generational hitter in the 13th round because lord knows this team doesn't intend to try anytime soon.

I loathe the DeWitts. Granted, it took me longer than most (probably around 2021 or 2022), but they clearly do not care about winning. They care about being slightly above average and milking nostalgia for a profit. They haven’t gotten rid of Mozeliak because he does what they want usually, with 2023 being an exception.

This team isn’t winning shit unless the DeWitts actually spend on FA or wipe the FO clean (that includes not promoting Bloom).

Originally Posted by Miles

Looks like a pretty solid trade in a vacuum. I was guessing they were going to payroll dump Edman separately and then use the salary for some mediocre vet that cost some other asset.

In a vacuum, sure.

They gave up Edman when they didn’t have to, though, because they could have gotten both guys in FA in the off-season.

They did the same shit in 2022.

[DJ's left nut]

Fedde won’t be a FA in the off-season. He’s under contract for 7.5 million next year.

And is in the top 5 for AL pitching WAR.

It suggests that the league doesn’t trust his stuff. Or that they don’t think he’s a post-season pitcher.

In truth he probably isn’t. The fastball just isn’t very good. But as a slop tossing righty he can probably throw 180 IP at 25% above league average. That’s probably good for 4-5 WAR most seasons and is a screaming bargain in the regular season.

But it’s just another example of the team not being built for the post-season. It’s a rotation full of junkers. If they make it to October, they’re drawing dead.