Ty Cobb is second now

[HemiEd]

Baseball Integrates Leaderboards

Major League Baseball officially updated its statistics leaderboard yesterday to include 2,300 qualifying men who played in the Negro Leagues between 1920 and 1948. The integration incorporates findings from a three-year research process initiated after MLB first recognized the Negro Leagues as major leagues in December 2020.



The update reshapes long-standing leaderboards, with legendary power hitter and Hall of Fame catcher Josh Gibson now recognized as the all-time leader in career batting average with a .372 mark, passing prior leader, Ty Cobb. Lifetime numbers from MLB players reflecting their time in the Negro Leagues were also recognized, including those of Jackie Robinson, Willie Mays, and Satchel Paige. See a rundown of leaderboard changes here. https://www.mlb.com/news/stats-leade...ro-leagues-mlb



Tacit bans in the major leagues forced Black players to create their own leagues in the first half of the 20th century. Jackie Robinson broke the sport's racial barrier when he made his debut with the Brooklyn Dodgers in 1947

[Hog Rider]

Records.
They're only good for playing music, and they last a long time.
If ya have a turntable.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by Eureka

What are white people good at?

Chess?

[chiefzilla1501]

Yeah I'm not a fan of messing around with records of different era. But ty Cobb also had some small advantage playing in a league that excluded negro league pitchers. He'd still rake but it could be the difference of a few points batting average which is what's happening here

[Ocotillo]

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

It was still a different league. I'm not sure this is the right move, but if that's what major league baseball wants to do more power to them

Other leagues were already included in the official statistical record.

It's also worth remembering: the Major Leagues were never just AL/NL. There were six of them. Now there's more. If that 1969 committee had been more thoughtful, this might have been done long ago. pic.twitter.com/O0caB6D5dg

— Mike Petriello (@mike_petriello) May 29, 2024

[kysirsoze]

Originally Posted by seamonster

Virtue signaling is embarrassing and you should be ashamed of yourself. You're like a guy with a microdick that has to drive around in a lifted truck with aggressive tires so that you can let everybody know that you've got a personality disorder. There's no "racial justice" at work here. All 20th century parties involved are dead as are their kids as are most of their grandkids. This is irreverent.

This guy is more of a miserable, hateful loser than Prison Bitch was. And not as intelligent.

[Ocotillo]

Originally Posted by smithandrew051

I used to be a major purist for Major League Baseball stats, and these used to be sacred to me as a kid.

Then the Steroid Era happened, and the Homerun records became completely unattainable.

Pitching is so different now that those old time records are also unattainable. Winning 20 games is somewhat rare anymore. Imagine doing that 25 straight seasons and still be 11 wins away from Cy Young’s record.

So really, what do the records in baseball mean if no one can break them?

Given that, I don’t have an issue with this.

The Associated Press ran this story yesterday.

Forget 300 career wins. Even 200 wins for an MLB pitcher might be a thing of the past

https://apnews.com/article/baseball-...13ecc316f3c9cd

[ChiTown]

Originally Posted by Eureka

What are white people good at?

Golf and embezzling money

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

Originally Posted by tredadda

Good for MLB. This is long overdue and the right thing to do. It would have been one thing if African American players had an opportunity to play in the majors but willfully chose not to and start their own league.

They were excluded for a long time and had no options but to form their own league.

This did not negate their stats, because the argument that they did not play against MLB players also would apply to MLB players who did not play against the very best. Many of those players would have been very successful on MLB rosters had they been given the chance.

Except the MLB players at the time played against 75-80% of the best talent available while Negro League players competed against 25% at best.

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

Originally Posted by Eureka

What are white people good at?

Civilizations and inventions?

Virtue signaling?

Curling?

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

People who say the Negro league was hitting against inferior pitching talent, are insane. What do you think was happening in the whites only MLB league? Long overdue.

Well, the Negro Leagues had, at best, 20% of the best talent around.

So if you are going to criticize white players for facing lesser talent, then the Negro Leagues were facing even a smaller talent pool.

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

https://www.mlb.com/news/faq-negro-l...-league-record

They only have 75% of the data.

"However, because of the inconsistencies of Negro Leagues team schedules (or the available data), the minimum qualifier for each league and season is based upon the average number of games played by each team, multiplied by 3.1 plate appearances for hitters and one inning for pitchers. Those values are subject to change as more data is discovered.
As for career leaderboards, the current standard for career MLB leaders is 5,000 at-bats and 2,000 innings pitched, which roughly equates to 10 full qualifying seasons (5,020 at-bats and 1,620 innings). Therefore, for Negro Leagues players, this standard has been set at 1,800 at-bats and 600 innings -- roughly the equivalent of 10 seasons’ worth of 60-game seasons."

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

Originally Posted by Ocotillo

Other leagues were already included in the official statistical record.

It's also worth remembering: the Major Leagues were never just AL/NL. There were six of them. Now there's more. If that 1969 committee had been more thoughtful, this might have been done long ago. pic.twitter.com/O0caB6D5dg

— Mike Petriello (@mike_petriello) May 29, 2024

They are still missing the NA (1871-1875).

The reason they and the Negro Leagues were not included in 1969 is because the data wasn't readily available. Even now only 75% of the Negro Leagues data has been found.

[MarkDavis'Haircut]

Originally Posted by Ocotillo

Other leagues were already included in the official statistical record.

It's also worth remembering: the Major Leagues were never just AL/NL. There were six of them. Now there's more. If that 1969 committee had been more thoughtful, this might have been done long ago. pic.twitter.com/O0caB6D5dg

— Mike Petriello (@mike_petriello) May 29, 2024

Also, the American Association (1882-1891) is drastically underrepresented in the MLB Hall of Fame.

It was a damn good league whose stars haven't been inducted.

19th century baseball has been underappreciated in historical narratives but groundbreaking research has been ongoing.

The Players League is a fascinating story.

[Ocotillo]

Originally Posted by MarkDavis'Haircut

Except the MLB players at the time played against 75-80% of the best talent available while Negro League players competed against 25% at best.

The other thing is that Negro League stats are shoddy, incomplete for obvious reasons.

Take for example John Henry "Pop" Lloyd. Babe Ruth apparently called him the greatest player he ever saw. But nobody knows for sure because Monte Irvin revealed that info in a radio interview he heard.

That's what makes the Negro Leagues so fascinating is there is a mythology, folklore surrounding these players and that's OK. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

[ghak99]

From a statistical point of view I think this is a really dumb move, but MLB records are so meaningless anymore I guess who really cares. The game changed so much from era to era there's really no point in even discussing or acknowledging many of the records we all admired as a kid growing up. They're near meaningless without a contemporary group qualifier defining the environment and actual opponents involved.