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Old 08-12-2014, 04:26 PM  
ROYC75 ROYC75 is offline
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Old 03-19-2022, 02:14 PM   #42316
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Less and less birthday bashes it seems good lord Patty wrecked your soul. Knowmo threw his God damned moms meatloaf through the wall watching the sweep again this year
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Old 03-19-2022, 02:32 PM   #42317
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Less and less birthday bashes it seems good lord Patty wrecked your soul. Knowmo threw his God damned moms meatloaf through the wall watching the sweep again this year
I’m not sure I follow that really.
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Old 03-21-2022, 09:32 PM   #42318
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Damn...Donks could have had Ryan for a 3rd ...and forced Atlanta to eat his salary.

Look at the stats....Dornks are going to Dornk.

Wilson's name brand is definitely worth two entire drafts/seven players...





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Old 03-22-2022, 12:14 AM   #42319
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Damn...Donks could have had Ryan for a 3rd ...and forced Atlanta to eat his salary.

Look at the stats....Dornks are going to Dornk.

Wilson's name brand is definitely worth two entire drafts/seven players...
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Old 03-22-2022, 03:14 AM   #42320
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What's funny about those stats?

I mean it's funny to me...Ryan has been a League MVP since Wilson was relevant.

Is the rationalization that Wilson just had bad coaching and an inferior team? The same could be said for Ryan...they both did well when they had a solid supporting cast.

Ryan has put up better numbers every season in the past 5 years....

Trust me...I'm happy the way things played out...had the Donks got Ryan for essentially nothing, they could have continued to build their roster, draft a top QB and develop him.

It'll be interesting to see who becomes the better team...Colts/Donks.

BTW, who is the Doinks backup QB....that's not a cheap position to fill. One of the hidden costs of the trade....You haven't had a healthy QB for an entire season since before Manning retired.
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Old 03-22-2022, 04:10 AM   #42321
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While I do agree that the Broncos got fleeced, I do not agree with the argument that Ryan=Wilson based on pct and yds. Look at the attempts from Ryan vs. Wilson’s. Compare td’s, Wilson scores more than Ryan. So while their yds and pct are similar, Wilson is doing more on less attempts than Ryan.
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Old 03-22-2022, 06:47 AM   #42322
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What's funny about those stats?

I mean it's funny to me...Ryan has been a League MVP since Wilson was relevant.

Is the rationalization that Wilson just had bad coaching and an inferior team? The same could be said for Ryan...they both did well when they had a solid supporting cast.

Ryan has put up better numbers every season in the past 5 years....

Trust me...I'm happy the way things played out...had the Donks got Ryan for essentially nothing, they could have continued to build their roster, draft a top QB and develop him.

It'll be interesting to see who becomes the better team...Colts/Donks.

BTW, who is the Doinks backup QB....that's not a cheap position to fill. One of the hidden costs of the trade....You haven't had a healthy QB for an entire season since before Manning retired.
I'm laughing at the notion that you will go to any lengths to say whatever it is that Denver did... it was the wrong move.
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Old 03-22-2022, 06:48 AM   #42323
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I'm laughing at the notion that you will go to any lengths to say whatever it is that Denver did... it was the wrong move.
While I wouldn't say getting Wilson was the "wrong" move, getting Ryan for essentially nothing would have likely been a BETTER move.
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Old 03-22-2022, 07:18 AM   #42324
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While I wouldn't say getting Wilson was the "wrong" move, getting Ryan for essentially nothing would have likely been a BETTER move.
Only if you think Ryan is more than a stats QB… he’s not clutch.
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Old 03-22-2022, 07:20 AM   #42325
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Only if you think Ryan is more than a stats QB… he’s not clutch.
I would argue Wilson isn't "clutch" either, at least not in recent years.

There's more upside with Wilson over Ryan in the short term. It's about whether there's more long-term upside with Ryan and a drafted QB than there is with Wilson.

Gotta think about that ceiling. Of course, Wilson has a ring so we know the ceiling is high but is that really Wilson now or does that guy really no longer exist?
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Old 03-22-2022, 07:21 AM   #42326
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And FWIW, I'm not a Matt Ryan fan. I think he's a compiler, a game manager, albeit a good one.

I don't think either of them (Ryan or Wilson) are the long-term answer. And by trading for Wilson, they've essentially married themselves to the idea that he is.
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Old 03-22-2022, 07:45 AM   #42327
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I would argue Wilson isn't "clutch" either, at least not in recent years.

There's more upside with Wilson over Ryan in the short term. It's about whether there's more long-term upside with Ryan and a drafted QB than there is with Wilson.

Gotta think about that ceiling. Of course, Wilson has a ring so we know the ceiling is high but is that really Wilson now or does that guy really no longer exist?
I get it... there's an argument for anything and there's an opportunity cost tied to whatever moves a team makes. I'm willing to bet that few on here had/have high aspirations for Ryan at this point in his career.

Stats are stats... they don't tell the whole story, esp with QBs.

Ryan has the most passing yards since 2015 - anyone here think that matters really compared to the others in the top 10 on this list? https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/who...rds-since-2015

Ryan is 6th on passing TDs in that timeframe. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/who...tds-since-2015

Ryan is 7th in wins. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/whi...ins-since-2015

Denver, by most accounts outside of this site, made the right move with trading for Wilson. They gave up players that are not hard to replace and giving up the top 2 picks in the next 2 drafts will not cripple the Broncos.

In 2022, Denver has 9 picks - still have a R2 and believe it's 4 in the top 5 rounds. So, they have the ability to acquire young playmakers and they can trade up if someone they really like (say a QB) is there in the 40-50 range.

By all accounts, few expect much from this QB class.

Ideally, as I said before all the issues hit, I would have been a fan of them trading for Watson and whatever that cost was... but, I think there's just too much baggage there right now. Good luck to CLE.

Hell, I think there are a few here that would say Denver would have been better off waiting and get either JG or Baker cheap.

At the end of the day, Russell Wilson still has a 4-6 years in him at this pace and considering the older age at which QBs are playing. 2021 was his worst year and the worst overall for SEA in the last decade. Is that a sign that Wilson is declining or done? I like the odds that he is not declining nor is he done.

And, if Denver only has Wilson at a top 10 level for 5 years - so be it. There will be other QBs. Right now, the 2023 draft is the only area where they were weakened and that's just one draft. They have done a much better job in recent years with their selections and believe they should do well in 2022.

Denver has a young team with lots of talent, now they have a QB with proven consistency and Wilson should have success with them offensively. Acquiring a Ryan, Baker, JG or similar would have been a continuation of what Denver has done since 2016. They were smart and jumped out on the Wilson opportunity quick.

Good luck to Ryan and all the rest...
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Old 03-22-2022, 07:53 AM   #42328
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What's funny about those stats?

I mean it's funny to me...Ryan has been a League MVP since Wilson was relevant.

Is the rationalization that Wilson just had bad coaching and an inferior team? The same could be said for Ryan...they both did well when they had a solid supporting cast.

Ryan has put up better numbers every season in the past 5 years....

Trust me...I'm happy the way things played out...had the Donks got Ryan for essentially nothing, they could have continued to build their roster, draft a top QB and develop him.

It'll be interesting to see who becomes the better team...Colts/Donks.

BTW, who is the Doinks backup QB....that's not a cheap position to fill. One of the hidden costs of the trade....You haven't had a healthy QB for an entire season since before Manning retired.
Might as well compare 2021 Ryan and Wentz... both of their stat lines are crazy similar and makes you wonder exactly what they think Ryan can do to improve on that production. IND gets an additional pick out of the deal by flipping Wentz and getting Ryan, but that's it really. They got about 7 years older at the position and really the upside is the same.

Denver signed Josh Johnson as a backup a few days ago... JAG signing. I would expect them to use a pick on a QB.
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Old 03-22-2022, 12:00 PM   #42329
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Did it ever cross your mind that signing Wilson had as much to do with boosting the asking price for the Donk franchise?

I'm sure a name brand QB will increase the price by a few hundred million....

From that vantage, the fleece-job trade makes more pragmatic business sense. Whats a handful of picks matter when you can gain a few hundred million and ownership can walk away.
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Old 03-22-2022, 01:15 PM   #42330
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This gave the Broncos no choice but to be aggressive in the trade market. They needed to acquire not just a better quarterback than who they had but a true difference-maker. Russell Wilson is that guy; he is an elite NFL QB and gives them a chance to compete with Mahomes, Herbert, and Carr.

If anything, Wilson has been held back by Seattle’s consistently weak offensive line and run-heavy scheme. Since Russ entered the league in 2012, the Seahawks are 27th in early-down pass rate (49.4%).

The Broncos’ roster is also strong enough to withstand the loss of draft picks they are sending to Seattle. They will still have nine picks in the 2022 Draft. As long as Russ continues to play at a high level and their young core continues to develop, trading these picks to Seattle will not hamstring them.

In light of the circumstances they found themselves in, Denver was smart to make this trade. The price they paid was certainly justifiable to bring in a Super Bowl winning quarterback. Wilson not only won a Super Bowl, but he did it in his second season then won the NFC again in the following season. He should have two rings, and it’s not like those teams were winning in spite of him. Seattle had good teams then, not great ones, and Russ was a huge part of why they went to back-to-back Super Bowls.

Despite having such substantial success early in his career, it is not unreasonable to think that Russ’ best seasons are ahead of him. The team hasn’t performed well, but that isn’t because of Wilson. He has played well and has had to overcome the coaching staff’s conservative philosophy.

For all of these reasons, the Broncos deserve to be commended for making a bold move that they desperately needed to make in order to be competitive.
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