Let's Talk About the Eagles (Super Bowl 59 Discussion)

[SHOWTIME]

We're headed back to the Ship and will try to be the first team to 3-peat in Super Bowl history!!! Chiefs open up as 1.5 favorites over the Eagles.

Discuss.


and don't forget...

Nick Sirianni:

“HEY, I DONT HEAR SHIT ANYMORE, CHIEFS FANS!! SEE YA!!”pic.twitter.com/4XB3msLEUc

— JPAFootball (@jasrifootball) November 22, 2023

[SHOWTIME]

Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz

Do I hear Patrick Mahomes vs. #1 Overall Defense?

These tend to be fun games.

The Chiefs biggest weakness this year was playing teams with great pass rushers like Houston and Denver. Philly is currently ranked 14th overall in sacks and does not have the pass rushing ability they had a few years ago. Mahomes SHOULD get tie in the pocket to throw the ball.

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Man I think you're WILDLY underestimating some of these guys. I think you're really hand-waiving the development from Smith and ESPECIALLY the contributions from Williams this year. I think you're gonna be shocked when someone gives him $17+ million/season this offseason.

Cox was very much on the decline at that point. They play more base 3-4 than that team did so a 1 for 1 review doesn't work terribly well, but a guy like Milton Williams is absolutely as good as Hargrave was that year, IMO. Nolan Smith has been improving all season and I think already has 4 sacks this post-season.

You can really only try to compare box 7s due to their formation changes but I think Carter, Davis, Smith, Williams, Baun, Sweat and Burks is absolutely comparable to Reddick, Hargrave, Cox, Sweat, Joseph, Edwards and Kyzir White.

And I think this defensive backfield is significantly better than the 2022 version.

Remember when people were getting all over Kingsley bc Washington had a so called better LT from rd 3?

Yeah that guy isn’t very good and Jayden’s mobility really helped him. He was terrible vs the Eagles. smith just kept using speed and he couldn’t adjust.

Not trying to make light of him but Thuney is smarter and more technical than that guy. A one-dimensional speed rusher isn’t going to make Thuney look like Wanya.

Eagles do have more depth. They have more players in the green, but to me I think Carter and Quinyon are their only true star players that are force multipliers.

I think this is the worst DL we have played in the SB by a decent margin. Their LB’s are also either not good (Burks) or do not excel in coverage (Baun).

The Chiefs absolutely embarrassed Slay in the SB 2 years ago and he’s 34 now. Why are we scared of him? One of Hollywood and Worthy will be covered by him and I think that their speed will show.

Let’s not forget how god awful CJG has been with angles, missed tackles, errors in coverage. Fans ever hate him him and want him gone bc he just keeps make these same mistakes.

Idk man. I see mismatches everywhere in their front 7. Idk how they cover Kelce. Idk how they deal with speed from Worthy/Hollywood and I sure as hell don’t know how they’re gonna put a ton of pressure on Mahomes.

I think you’re right about the Buffalo comparison. Their defense is a lot like Buffalo’s and we just put 32 on them when we easily should have put at least 38 if not for the fumble and the Mahomes error sack against Milano.

Biggest key will be our run defense, but boy if we are able to go up multiple scores on these guys and force them to pass this game will get ugly for them

[Bl00dyBizkitz]

I say close game, probably decided by 3 points.

I hate to be reductive, but all the Chiefs do is play close games and keep games close all the way to the bitter end. We don't blow teams out, and we don't get blown out.

When you get teams that are this good I think the chances of a blowout on either side is like 10% while the chances of the game being decided by 7 points or less is the other 90%.

[Iconic]

i am genuinely not concerned about us scoring points, mohomes and andy will take care of business.

our defense is what i am losing sleep over. you clearly HAVE to sellout to stop barkley, most likely through some iteration of single high. problem is that is going to leave us susceptible to getting thrown on and hurts job much easier.

brown is going to get 1 on 1s deep and godert/smith will be a headache. comes down to our secondary and just how much we can cheat to bottle barkley. is it mcduffie on smith and watson on brown? they probably can't afford to bracket brown... its all moot if the bad version of hurts shows up but i do not count on that happening given he played his best ball against us last time.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Man I think you're WILDLY underestimating some of these guys. I think you're really hand-waiving the development from Smith and ESPECIALLY the contributions from Williams this year. I think you're gonna be shocked when someone gives him $17+ million/season this offseason.

Cox was very much on the decline at that point. They play more base 3-4 than that team did so a 1 for 1 review doesn't work terribly well, but a guy like Milton Williams is absolutely as good as Hargrave was that year, IMO. Nolan Smith has been improving all season and I think already has 4 sacks this post-season.

You can really only try to compare box 7s due to their formation changes but I think Carter, Davis, Smith, Williams, Baun, Sweat and Burks is absolutely comparable to Reddick, Hargrave, Cox, Sweat, Joseph, Edwards and Kyzir White.

And I think this defensive backfield is significantly better than the 2022 version.

I know you already speculated about this, but I DO think you're giving Baun too much credit. He's been very good for them but is a LIABILITY in coverage. They miss Dean a lot there. The Chiefs exploited Burks in the Super Bowl last year. He can't handle Kelce-Mahomes.

On that front line, I think their DL and OLBs are good, but not AS good as they were two years ago. They sacked the QB 70 times in 2022... only 41 times this year. Just not the same type of pressure-creating unit. And actually, according to Pro Football Reference, literally DEAD last in the NFL in pressure percentage per dropback.

Some of that is Fangio's scheme, but still, that stands out.

I think you're also underrating that Eagles secondary. Bradberry was an All-Pro that year (second team). Slay was still a good leading corner and was a Pro Bowl pick. Avonte Maddox was injured a lot that season, but I thought he looked pretty good in that SB.

Yes, DeJean and Mitchell have been really good as rookies. But I don't think that unit is THAT much of an upgrade from 22.

The Chiefs' WR room is also quite a bit better.

In games I've watched the Eagles play, I didn't see them moving Carter around on the inside - he lined up exclusively over the RG against the Redskins.

If the Chiefs protect the ball, they can work the short- and intermediate-range of the field.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

I know you already speculated about this, but I DO think you're giving Baun too much credit. He's been very good for them but is a LIABILITY in coverage. They miss Dean a lot there. The Chiefs exploited Burks in the Super Bowl last year. He can't handle Kelce-Mahomes.

On that front line, I think their DL and OLBs are good, but not AS good as they were two years ago. They sacked the QB 70 times in 2022... only 41 times this year. Just not the same type of pressure-creating unit. And actually, according to Pro Football Reference, literally DEAD last in the NFL in pressure percentage per dropback.

Some of that is Fangio's scheme, but still, that stands out.

I think you're also underrating that Eagles secondary. Bradberry was an All-Pro that year (second team). Slay was still a good leading corner and was a Pro Bowl pick. Avonte Maddox was injured a lot that season, but I thought he looked pretty good in that SB.

Yes, DeJean and Mitchell have been really good as rookies. But I don't think that unit is THAT much of an upgrade from 22.

The Chiefs' WR room is also quite a bit better.

In games I've watched the Eagles play, I didn't see them moving Carter around on the inside - he lined up exclusively over the RG against the Redskins.

If the Chiefs protect the ball, they can work the short- and intermediate-range of the field.

The same stuff that worked scheme wise against the Buffalo D in the passing game will work against Philly.

They just have more talented players than Buffalo on D.

[UChieffyBugger]

So the guy who has replaced Dean for the Eagles is Burks? Word is he was the one who stepped in for the Niners in the superbowl when Greenlaw went down and Andy put him in a blender.

Another thing I want to look at is experience. As much as Dejean, Mitchell and Carter have been praised, they will be stepping onto a stage they've never been on before. Andy will see the tendencies and look to take advantage. A rookie doesn't know what they don't know.

It's a defense that also lacks speed too. Mitchell is OK but the rest? The have a thick front and Baun and Burks aren't burners. So qb runs and jet sweeps could be huge here. Lastly I think the middle of the field is the key spot. They simply cannot stop tightends and if they double Trav Juju could really go off again.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

The Eagles remind me of the Bills but better.

I mean they have more talent at literally every position but QB. WR, DB, DL, OL -- all of it. And they try to do similar things; ground and pound with some big plays in the air sprinkled in.

They're a really tough matchup.

We always wondered how that TB game would've gone had we not had so many OL injuries and I think that may be what we're going to be seeing in this matchup. The Eagles do have a raw talent advantage at most spots but we have the better QB and better coaching staff.

Will that be enough? Man...it's gonna be tough.

This is a REALLY good Eagles team.

Other than Hurts is not Allen, not even close.

[DJ's left nut]

Boy - I'm not sure I see 'liability' at all w/r/t Baun in coverage.

Yes, I think Dean helped him a fair bit in that regard, but I don't even like calling Bolton a true liability in coverage and I think Baun is fair bit better than Bolton in space.

Maybe i should go back and refresh the ol' recollection a bit regarding the Eagles in 2022. Would be curious to try to hunt up that pre-SB thread from 2023 and see what it says.

I'm sure I had opinions. I almost always do. But Slay and Bradberry, to my recollection, both seemed like they were starting to age out a bit (and Bradberry especially).

Ultimately I just think they're really hard defenses to compare since they've undergone a pretty significant scheme shift. But I like the talent on this Eagles D.

[UChieffyBugger]

Just looking at the Eagles schedule and who were the best defenses they faced? Rams, Steelers and Ravens? All of those defenses had issues throughout the season. Rams gave up 40 to Zona and Buffalo, Ravens was one of the worst defenses for a large portion of the season and the Steelers D broke down in the end.

We faced Texans twice, Denver twice, Chargers twice etc all top rated defenses.

[TheGuardian]

Barkely is the only thing that scares me about that Eagles team. Hurts has regressed a ton, and that defense is not scary.

Still, like all games, it'll probably be close.

[staylor26]

Rams would've dropped 30 on that Eagles defense easily under normal conditions.

[smithandrew051]

Originally Posted by staylor26

Rams would've dropped 30 on that Eagles defense easily under normal conditions.

If their RG doesn’t let Carter just run free, they likely put up 29 anyway.

[seamonster]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

Barkely is the only thing that scares me about that Eagles team. Hurts has regressed a ton, and that defense is not scary.

Still, like all games, it'll probably be close.

I've never seen a receiver better than AJ Brown at catching prayer balls and tracking a ball in traffic. And Goedert is one of the best tight ends in the NFL (better than Andrews and Kincade). Offense is thoroughly stacked.

[wazu]

Originally Posted by staylor26

Rams would've dropped 30 on that Eagles defense easily under normal conditions.

They only managed 20 points when playing them at home in a dome on 11/24.