*****The Patrick Mahomes Thread*****

[Dante84]

IT ****ING HAPPENED



OP UPDATE:

Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy!

[smithandrew051]

Originally Posted by DRM08

Nah, I think it's poor evaluation. Other teams around the league are finding dudes later in the draft that are way more competent in route-running & catching the ball than the likes of Skyy Moore & Mecole Hardman. And it should not take a rocket scientist to see the red flags on MVS when Green Bay wasn't exactly desperate to keep him. The red flags on Toney were glaringly obvious too.

It can be both though.

Targeting a guy early who sucks (Skyy Moore) is evaluation.

Teams that draft guys late who become great are probably a little lucky and draft a bunch of busts along the way. If they loved those players so much, they’d take them earlier.

The draft is a bit of a crapshoot. Have to evaluate those guys better but also need to take more swings at receiver. Like we’ve done with DB.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by DRM08

Nah, I think it's poor evaluation. Other teams around the league are finding dudes later in the draft that are way more competent in route-running & catching the ball than the likes of Skyy Moore & Mecole Hardman. And it should not take a rocket scientist to see the red flags on MVS when Green Bay wasn't exactly desperate to keep him. The red flags on Toney were glaringly obvious too.

Most teams that have a lot of weapons have put in a lot of investment in the position.

The Chiefs weapon investment in the last 4 years is CEH, Skyy Moore and Rashee Rice.

I know people hate this, because it was pointed out when it was brought up but when you use top 3 round picks on 3 LB's, a center, a RB who was a miss and you have the highest paid guard in the league..there is an argument about money and draft pick allocation along with positional value.

[smithandrew051]

Originally Posted by AdolfOliverBush

He'll certainly try. He's also going to have to work to avoid losing so many guys on defense that the D regresses.

The D will likely regress a bit, but it might have to.

The goal should probably be to create an elite offense around Mahomes with a 10-15 defense. The defense just can’t be bad if we’re elite on offense.

[DRM08]

Originally Posted by smithandrew051

It can be both though.

Targeting a guy early who sucks (Skyy Moore) is evaluation.

Teams that draft guys late who become great are probably a little lucky and draft a bunch of busts along the way. If they loved those players so much, they’d take them earlier.

The draft is a bit of a crapshoot. Have to evaluate those guys better but also need to take more swings at receiver. Like we’ve done with DB.

I think evaluation has been bad outside the Draft too. MVS & Toney are examples of that. Frankly, so is Sammy Watkins. They signed him to a $16M salary when the top end of the receiver market was $20M. He missed about 50% of the games with injury, so you basically had a $32M receiver who didn't perform anywhere near that level. Everyone knew his injury problems before they signed him, and the injuries continued after he joined the team.

Toney is like a boneheaded version of Sammy. At least Sammy ran good routes and caught the ball when he wasn't on the sidelines with injury. Toney is injured a lot, runs poor routes, can't catch the ball, and apparently can't line up correctly without penalty as well. Lol

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by DRM08

I think evaluation has been bad outside the Draft too. MVS & Toney are examples of that. Frankly, so is Sammy Watkins. They signed him to a $16M salary when the top end of the receiver market was $20M. He missed about 50% of the games with injury, so you basically had a $32M receiver who didn't perform anywhere near that level. Everyone knew his injury problems before they signed him, and the injuries continued after he joined the team.

Toney is like a boneheaded version of Sammy. At least Sammy ran good routes and caught the ball when he wasn't on the sidelines with injury. Toney is injured a lot, runs poor routes, can't catch the ball, and apparently can't line up correctly without penalty as well. Lol

Veach has an a hardon for guys he had high draft grades on, so if they fail somewhere else he'll bring them.

Ronald Jones and Karious Toney are 2 examples of this.

[RunKC]

I think keeping Sneed and one of Tranquill/Gay is fine on defense. Losing Chris won't make us the Bob Sutton defense again.

I think they've got resources to get some quality weapons at WR and RB in FA. I just don't know what they will do at LT.

Good news is this is a really deep WR class. If they choose to load up on weapons in FA they could take a LT in rd 1 and a WR in rd 2 and not have to rely heavily on him like they are Rice this year.

[Chiefspants]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Veach has an a hardon for guys he had high draft grades on, so if they fail somewhere else he'll bring them.

Ronald Jones and Karious Toney are 2 examples of this.

That strategy has worked on the other side of the ball, but it's been a bad miss when it comes to receivers.

Charvarius Ward and Tranquil come to mind about where it works on defense.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by RunKC

I think keeping Sneed and one of Tranquill/Gay is fine on defense. Losing Chris won't make us the Bob Sutton defense again.

I think they've got resources to get some quality weapons at WR and RB in FA. I just don't know what they will do at LT.

Good news is this is a really deep WR class. If they choose to load up on weapons in FA they could take a LT in rd 1 and a WR in rd 2 and not have to rely heavily on him like they are Rice this year.

Boy if you wait till round 2 you aren't getting the type of WR this team needs.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by RunKC

I think keeping Sneed and one of Tranquill/Gay is fine on defense. Losing Chris won't make us the Bob Sutton defense again.

I think they've got resources to get some quality weapons at WR and RB in FA. I just don't know what they will do at LT.

Good news is this is a really deep WR class. If they choose to load up on weapons in FA they could take a LT in rd 1 and a WR in rd 2 and not have to rely heavily on him like they are Rice this year.

Tranquill has probably played himself into a pretty good contract...Gay is a superb athlete. Mix that with whatever Nick Bolton wants and you have to ask yourself, in a league where you have a really high paid QB, do you want the LB contracts too?

[AdolfOliverBush]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Boy if you wait till round 2 you aren't getting the type of WR this team needs.

Yup, I'd rather take my chances with Prince Oongaboonga at LT, and draft a WR in round 1. Waiting until after the 1st is part of what got KC into this situation.

[Hammock Parties]

Really bad game.

He had a really good game against New England so hopefully he resets.

Let's talk about what we see on this play.

It's 2nd and 15. The Chiefs run a zone-beater with Rashee Rice on a dig. He breaks open behind the second level. Potenially huge play.

However, Mahomes feels pressure and bails. Would like to see him step up into the pocket and fire.… pic.twitter.com/iFJLWIb7qm

— Matt Verderame (@MattVerderame) December 27, 2023

[Shaid]

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

Nobody's open. pic.twitter.com/69foMoWqUU

— Bill Barnwell (@billbarnwell) December 25, 2023

Has been happening all season long. A combination of having no WRs and Kelce decline.

Watson is open on the comeback. Otherwise, maybe Kelce when crossing midfield but it's tighter and you have to drop it in.

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by Shaid

Watson is open on the comeback. Otherwise, maybe Kelce when crossing midfield but it's tighter and you have to drop it in.

No he’s not. He doesn’t come open until well after Pat bails.

[Shaid]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

No he’s not. He doesn’t come open until well after Pat bails.

yes, after he bails but before he goes past the line of scrimmage

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by Shaid

yes, after he bails but before he goes past the line of scrimmage

When considering whether a player is 'open,' it's standard to consider just the initial patterns. once the play breaks down, that's a separate play.


Also, that's not a comeback route; that's a go route that Watson is never open on, then he comes back because Pat is scrambling.



edit: That's not even a good go route by Watson. he allows himself to get driven into the boundary; there's nowhere for Pat to throw the ball even if he did stack the DB. Watson cancels himself out on that route.