Chiefs focused on Mahomes, McCaffrey, and Cunningham in RD1

[pugsnotdrugs19]

SEE POST #11 FIRST

... the word in the Chiefs building is that they would like to trade up for QB Patrick Mahomes or RB Christian McCaffrey in the first round. If this falls through, he said they like ILB Zach Cunningham a lot as well.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by MahiMike

I don't think you are seeing the big picture here as well as Dorsey is I'm sure. Average time frame for a WR to be at his peak is 3 years. I'm sure they know this and I'm sure we'll have seen the last of Alex by then.

So...if Corey Davis were to fall to us...GRAB him!

3rd year of Marvin Harrison's career (as a full-time starter in all 3) he was such a difference maker that the Colts had the worst record in football.

It's a TERRIBLE comparison. Absolutely miserable.

Peyton Manning made Marvin Harrison, just as he made a whole slew of weapons like Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne. The quarterback made the difference, not the WR.

If Corey Davis were to fall to us, what are the odds that his peak is appreciably better than Jeremy Maclin's? And what the hell good is Jeremy Maclin if he doesn't have a passer that will attack? Corey Davis will be a good WR, but he's not a Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones or even Odell Beckham kind of player.

He's not event he best WR in this class. Hell, he may not even be the 2nd best WR in this class.

[Chief Northman]

Draft pundits answer me this:

Why is Kizer getting shit on for a lack of success in South Bend last season when he was clearly surrounded by less talent, and his head coach played mind games with him? You look at Mahomes who garnered hyper-Madden stats last season but the Red Raiders finish 5-7, and Mahomes had a chance to win a couple of those games late but could not. Please spare me the "bad defense" argument.

The same arguments used to tear down one prospect are being ignored to apply to another.

This must be a super tough qb class to evaluate and project. I've been on the fence with Kizer. He might have the highest ceiling of the bunch, but there is something about his character that turns me off. His measurables and ability to throw the ball are fantastic and he is intelligent as well. But I am at a loss as to what type of leader this guy will be.

On the other hand you have Mahomes who intrigues people with his arm talent and athleticism. He seems to be a bright enough kid, but when you watch game tape, for as many times as he excites with the plays he makes, you are also cringing at some of the decisions and 50-50 balls he puts up. His mechanics are not pretty and he evidently needs a ton of refinement. There seem to be little to no concerns about his ability to lead.

In the end I think you have two promising prospects that are unfortunately being treated very differently by media types.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by Chief Northman

. Please spare me the "bad defense" argument.

Why? Because you don't want to hear it? When your defense allows 60+ points in 3 different games, yeah you're gonna lose. Not even Peyton Manning would be winning.

You're basically saying, "Sure, our offense/Qb put up 50+ points, but it's their fault we lost".

Pretty shitty argument you have there.

Fact is, Kizer has ONE season of starting experience and it was very average. That's why he's not talked about as much.

And while Mahomes has some cringe worthy throws, he also has a ton of "wow" moments. He has some traits are unique and and stands out. Kizer rarely ever "wows" you.

[Chief Northman]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Why? Because you don't want to hear it? When your defense allows 60+ points in 3 different games, yeah you're gonna lose. Not even Peyton Manning would be winning.

You're basically saying, "Sure, our offense/Qb put up 50+ points, but it's their fault we lost".

Pretty shitty argument you have there.

Fact is, Kizer has ONE season of starting experience and it was very average. That's why he's not talked about as much.

And while Mahomes has some cringe worthy throws, he also has a ton of "wow" moments. He has some traits are unique and and stands out. Kizer rarely ever "wows" you.

Not a shitty argument at all. The point is, what will happen when Mahomes has to face a competent defense? - because he never did in college. He had some opportunities to win games with the ball last. Success at times, not others. My point is a big knock on Kizer is the team record. Not sure why this does not apply to Mahomes. Yes his defense was shit, but they had oppotunities to win despite that defense.

Kizer was a starter for two seasons btw - even if he wasn't named as such last season, he carried the mail for a far less talented group compared to his 2015 team.

[Sandy Vagina]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Exactly.

Our quarterback in 4 years is going to be one of two things - a physically limited guy we got in the 3rd/4th round who will be little more than a continuation of Alex Smith (i.e. Nate Peterman) or a guy with a ton of tools who has warts that the staff will have to either fix or work around (Mahomes, Webb).

There's not really an in-between for teams drafting late. You're not getting Andrew Luck yet with Mahomes you're getting a guy with that kind of arm talent who simply needs to learn to harness it.

He might fail. It's still worth the risk to find out.

... and Andrew Luck is the high-water mark because he has accomplished... what exactly? oh, that's right. No SB wins... which is.. the ONLY actual accomplishment by CP standards.. so to this point.. Luck has been nothing but a massive failure.

or are we simply changing the rules as we go now?

[O.city]

He's using Luck as a prospect. Not what he is now.

[dls6501]

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks

... and Andrew Luck is the high-water mark because he has accomplished... what exactly? oh, that's right. No SB wins... which is.. the ONLY actual accomplishment by CP standards.. so to this point.. Luck has been nothing but a massive failure.

or are we simply changing the rules as we go now?

It seriously baffles me why you cant see that team success and how good a QB is are not one and the same. It is possible for a shit team to have a good quarterback and a good team to have a shit quarterback.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by O.city

He's using Luck as a prospect. Not what he is now.

That seemed fairly clear to me.

Guess not.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by Chief Northman

Not a shitty argument at all. The point is, what will happen when Mahomes has to face a competent defense? - because he never did in college. He had some opportunities to win games with the ball last. Success at times, not others. My point is a big knock on Kizer is the team record. Not sure why this does not apply to Mahomes. Yes his defense was shit, but they had oppotunities to win despite that defense.

Kizer was a starter for two seasons btw - even if he wasn't named as such last season, he carried the mail for a far less talented group compared to his 2015 team.

Well, it's a crap shoot. We don't really know how any of these QB's will respond to an NFL defense.

All we can do is take their positive traits and ask if they're NFL suitable, and take the negative traits and ask if they're coachable.

Personally, i don't think a knock on Kizer is his team record. I don't recall ever actually reading or hearing that either.

Seems your concern is about Mahomes' attention and Kizer's lack thereof.

Remember who Mahomes' agent is: Leigh Steinberg.

There's a reason you're seeing Mahomes' face plastered all over T.V.....the man has a promotion master, super agent.

[Mr. Laz]

I don't see any way that the Chiefs are actually after Mahomes. This has to be a smokescreen. If the Chiefs really do want Mahomes then they need to plug some leaks because they can't keep a secret worth a ****.

If every team in the league knows what you are going to try to do, then you are doing it wrong.

[Bewbies]

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

I don't see any way that the Chiefs are actually after Mahomes. This has to be a smokescreen. If the Chiefs really do want Mahomes then they need to plug some leaks because they can't keep a secret worth a ****.

If every team in the league knows what you are going to try to do, then you are doing it wrong.

Let's say maybe the 1st round or two, how many picks do you think NFL front offices get wrong in their mocks? There can't be many.

I'm sure they all know, or have a really good idea, where each team is going to go with their first pick. On the outside we may be in the dark, but I highly, highly doubt any front offices are surprised all that often...

[RealSNR]

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks

... and Andrew Luck is the high-water mark because he has accomplished... what exactly? oh, that's right. No SB wins... which is.. the ONLY actual accomplishment by CP standards.. so to this point.. Luck has been nothing but a massive failure.

or are we simply changing the rules as we go now?

You are a confused person.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by Mr. Laz

I don't see any way that the Chiefs are actually after Mahomes. This has to be a smokescreen. If the Chiefs really do want Mahomes then they need to plug some leaks because they can't keep a secret worth a ****.

If every team in the league knows what you are going to try to do, then you are doing it wrong.

I agree that the Chiefs won't end up with Mahomes. I think they'll end up with a 3rd round+ prospect.

[Chief Northman]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Well, it's a crap shoot. We don't really know how any of these QB's will respond to an NFL defense.

All we can do is take their positive traits and ask if they're NFL suitable, and take the negative traits and ask if they're coachable.

Personally, i don't think a knock on Kizer is his team record. I don't recall ever actually reading or hearing that either.

Seems your concern is about Mahomes' attention and Kizer's lack thereof.

Remember who Mahomes' agent is: Leigh Steinberg.

There's a reason you're seeing Mahomes' face plastered all over T.V.....the man has a promotion master, super agent.

That is a great point about Steinberg.

The Kelly comments about Kizer have not helped him either and I'm baffled as to why he was so negative regarding Kizer's readiness. You can say a prospect could have used another year in college all you want, but to add that he was immature on and off the field is probably better discussed in private conversations with management types. Kelly likely hurt his own ability to recruit prospects by making comments like that public.

I have heard and read a few draft analysts use a lacklustre season at Notre Dame as a reason to knock Kizer - more specifically compared to his 2015 season. They see it as a regression, which it was, but to counter that there is not as much talk about a huge drop in talent surrounding him last season.

Marketability is a big thing. I get the impression sometimes that the league wants certain prospects to end up in certain cities to be their face. One attraction I have with regards to DeShaun Watson is that Papa John's has already signed him up! Doesn't that guarantee you a Super Bowl appearance somewhere down the line?

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by Bewbies

Let's say maybe the 1st round or two, how many picks do you think NFL front offices get wrong in their mocks? There can't be many.

I'm sure they all know, or have a really good idea, where each team is going to go with their first pick. On the outside we may be in the dark, but I highly, highly doubt any front offices are surprised all that often...

No, the teams do not share with the league office or with other teams

nobody knows what the patriots are going to do

Shitty teams are predictable


The better the teams keep it quiet.