Chris Jones - Making Him the Highest Paid Defender in the League

[dlphg9]

Why couldn't we do it? Khalil Mack, the highest paid defensive player in the league right now had cap hits of $13.8 mil in yr 1 of his new deal and $11.9 mil in yr 2. Macks avg yearly salary is $23.5 mil per year.

Veach doesn't seem to like giving guys contracts past the age of 30, so I could see him doing a 5 yr $120 mil deal. That keeps Jones in KC until age 30 and we get all his prime years and don't run the risk of having to pay him a ton of money after he's 30. Him being a 2nd rounder is going to help him in negotiating.

If we structure the contract so that his cap hit is $13 mil in year 1 and $15 mil in year 2, we have him cheap when we are tight with the cap this year and then next year there should be a decent jump in the cap and we're not out $8 mil because of Eric Berrys dead money. The cap should raise significantly for the remaining 3 years of his contract and it wont burden us with trying to get other good players.

There are several factors that should allow him to become the highest paid defender in the league.

1. He is an absolute beast. I am higher on his run D than most, but no one can argue that he is not, at worst, the 2nd best pass rushing interior lineman in the league. Personally, I put him right next to Aaron Donald when it comes to pass rushing. Now someone smarter than me correct me please, but has there ever been a better pass rusher at that position than those 2? His impact in the Super Bowl will be a big bargaining chip for him during negotiations as well

2. He is only 25 years old. Veach is smart. He doesn't like giving out big money to old guys and he's not going to extend guys into the twilight of their careers and pay them tons of money. Luckily for Chris Jones he is only 25 and a 5 year deal puts him at 30 years old. Veach wants to keep guys that still have their best years ahead of him and the prime age for a DT is 28 according to PFF, so that means in theory we haven't even seen the best Chris Jones and Brett Veach isn't going to just let that walk away.

3. The new CBA. When the top paid defenders signed their deals there were only 16 regular season game and now neverything is pointing to a 17 game regular season, so contracts are going to reflect that. Prior to the news about the newest CBA coming a year early my best guess was that CJ was going to get $21.5 mil a year from the Chiefs, since Frank Clark is basically getting $21 mil a year. $21.5 mil a year breaks down to $1.34 mil per regular season game, so that extra game should pay an additional $1.34 mil a year and that alone puts CJs yearly avg to just under $23 million a year. That hasn't even taken into account the increase in the percentage of profit the players are getting.

Chris Jones is one of my favorite players on the team and is probably my favorite player on the defense. I hope we keep him even if we have to pay him more money per year than any other defender in the history of the league. My love for Chris Jones may cloud my judgement and make me irrational and I may be completely wrong in my train of thought, but I dont think signing Jones long term is detrimental to the future success of this team whatsoever. I actually believe it would be insanely stupid and detrimental to let a generational talent like Chris Jones walk because we got some draft picks for him. Chris Jones's skills are only matched by one other player at his position and those 2 may be the best pass rushers we have ever seen at d tackle and I don't think anyone else is even close. You can't replace his production and trading him is an awful idea.

[Wallcrawler]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

People will say Clark and Mathiue can still get hurt. That douche bag wallcrawler was one of those idiots.

Lol. Im sorry, I didn't realize making it through one season of a huge contract makes them invulnerable to injury, and a large chunk of our cap is unable to produce from the sideline for the duration of the injury and potentially into years that they are no longer with the team. Berry and Houstons 15 mil dead money this year was so satisfying to pay them. Cant wait to drop another 8 mil on Berry next season!! Best contract evaaaar.

My bad though. All of Clarks injuries are behind him now obviously, so its smooth sailing on that 100 mil boys!! Back up that Brings truck on Jones!

Jones' production in the divisional playoff alone helping us come back from 24-0, shows why we cannot succeed in the post season without him. WE MUST MAKE HIM THE HIGHEST PAID DEFENDER NAOWWWW!!

Idiot.

This argument isnt against any single player, you short sighted dipshit, it is about the risk associated with dropping 3-4 players worth of cash on one player.

Hasn't panned out well in the past.

Christ youre ****ing obtuse.

[dlphg9]

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler

Lol. Im sorry, I didn't realize making it through one season of a huge contract makes them invulnerable to injury, and a large chunk of our cap is unable to produce from the sideline for the duration of the injury and potentially into years that they are no longer with the team. Berry and Houstons 15 mil dead money this year was so satisfying to pay them. Cant wait to drop another 8 mil on Berry next season!! Best contract evaaaar.

My bad though. All of Clarks injuries are behind him now obviously, so its smooth sailing on that 100 mil boys!! Back up that Brings truck on Jones!

Jones' production in the divisional playoff alone helping us come back from 24-0, shows why we cannot succeed in the post season without him. WE MUST MAKE HIM THE HIGHEST PAID DEFENDER NAOWWWW!!

Idiot.

This argument isnt against any single player, you short sighted dipshit, it is about the risk associated with dropping 3-4 players worth of cash on one player.

Hasn't panned out well in the past.

Christ youre ****ing obtuse.

You're using a hypothetical injury as your main reason that Mathieu and Clarks contract and Jones' potential contract might be bad, but im obtuse? I know it's literally the only possible reason you have to not sign Jones, but it's making you look like you crawled too high up a wall, fell, and the end result was a mild case of mental reerunation.

[dlphg9]

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler

Lol. Im sorry, I didn't realize making it through one season of a huge contract makes them invulnerable to injury, and a large chunk of our cap is unable to produce from the sideline for the duration of the injury and potentially into years that they are no longer with the team. Berry and Houstons 15 mil dead money this year was so satisfying to pay them. Cant wait to drop another 8 mil on Berry next season!! Best contract evaaaar.

My bad though. All of Clarks injuries are behind him now obviously, so its smooth sailing on that 100 mil boys!! Back up that Brings truck on Jones!

Jones' production in the divisional playoff alone helping us come back from 24-0, shows why we cannot succeed in the post season without him. WE MUST MAKE HIM THE HIGHEST PAID DEFENDER NAOWWWW!!

Idiot.

This argument isnt against any single player, you short sighted dipshit, it is about the risk associated with dropping 3-4 players worth of cash on one player.

Hasn't panned out well in the past.

Christ youre ****ing obtuse.

Look at a list of the best D tackles to ever play. There's something all of those guys have in common and that is they played either there whole careers with the same team or at most 2 teams. Between these guys who are arguably the best 10 DTs of all time only 3 of them played on more than 1 team.

Casey Hampton - 1 team
Buck Buchanan - 1
Warren Sapp - 2 (Played on 2nd team during his decline. Was 32 years old when he went to 2nd team. Worst years of his career)
Randy White - 1
Cortez Kennedy - 1
John Randle - 2 (went to 2nd team when he was 34)
Bob Lily - 1
Merlin Olsen - 1
Mean Joe Greene - 1
Alan Page - 2 (went to 2nd team at 33 years old)

Teams just don't let their stud D tackles go. When are all pro talent d tackles ever available for trade or in FA? Its just a position that is filled with so many busts that when you get one like Chris Jones you don't let him leave before he's even hit his prime, especially if the only reason you can come up with is that he might get hurt.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

Making CJ the highest paid defender in the NFL (IF that’s what he’s wanting) is a big risk and I wouldn’t do it.

That said, if Veach does, then I have to trust he knows something that I don’t (I.e. cap exploding in a couple years).

I can’t honestly believe that a GM like Veach would risk a potential Mahomes dynasty just to pay Jones big bank out of some misplaced sense of loyalty.

So IVIT.

[saphojunkie]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

“Big,” “calculated,” we’re arguing semantics at this point. The point is that you have to roll the dice sometimes.

No, we are not.

Big Risk: trying to light your cigarette off of a jet engine.

Calculated risk: making a move on a girl who hasn't expressed verbal consent, but you have read the room and know that it's on, provided you aren't Harvey Weinstein.

[saphojunkie]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

Yes you do have to roll the dice and to decrease the chances of a bad contract you have to calculate the risks. You do that by taking these factors into account;

Age - is the player at the end of his prime?

Chris Jones is just now getting into his prime. This was the first year where he looked like an absolute stud and took games over. He's just gonna get better and you don't just get rid of that type of game changing ability

Injury history - Football is extremely physical and most players get hurt and miss games, but has the player missed multiple games every season and constantly has nagging injuries that keep him at less than 100% when he actually does play?

This was the first year CJ has had injury problems. He has been very healthy his whole career and isnt constantly on the injury report.

Loves the game - Does the player love to play football or is he just looking for his big pay day?

Chris Jones is very vocal about his love of the game and is constantly trying to get better.

Does the player want to be here? Does he love the city, fans, and most importantly loves his teammates?

This is another thing that Jones has been very vocal about. He loves everything about Kansas City and the Chiefs.

So if someonw wants to spew off about calculating the risk and how Chris Jones is a risky signing Id love to see their reasons why. This whole Berry and Houston got hurt bullshit isnt a reason. Give me a legit reason that signing him long term would br bad. Give me some of the negatives when calculating the risk. The money isnt a reason either because you can keep his cap bit low until the cap is crazy high.

Because the defense overall will be significantly worse by losing multiple starters, having no depth, and being unable to upgrade positions of weakness. That's a reason.

It's just one that you - and all the other Chris Jones absolutists - are determined to ignore or dismiss.

[staylor26]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

Because the defense overall will be significantly worse by losing multiple starters, having no depth, and being unable to upgrade positions of weakness. That's a reason.

It's just one that you - and all the other Chris Jones absolutists - are determined to ignore or dismiss.

Who are the multiple starters we will be losing?

Mathieu, Clark, Nnadi, Ward, Thornhill, Hitchens, Wilson, and Kpass will all be back. Counting Jones that’s 9 of 11. You’re losing Breeland and Ragland in terms of starters.

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Per the NFLPA, the #Chiefs have $21,787,634 in cap space.

— Matt Conner (@MattConnerAA) March 12, 2020

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Originally Posted by staylor26

Who are the multiple starters we will be losing?

Mathieu, Clark, Nnadi, Ward, Thornhill, Hitchens, Wilson, and Kpass will all be back.

Okafor will be back as well!

[R Clark]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

Look at a list of the best D tackles to ever play. There's something all of those guys have in common and that is they played either there whole careers with the same team or at most 2 teams. Between these guys who are arguably the best 10 DTs of all time only 3 of them played on more than 1 team.

Casey Hampton - 1 team
Buck Buchanan - 1
Warren Sapp - 2 (Played on 2nd team during his decline. Was 32 years old when he went to 2nd team. Worst years of his career)
Randy White - 1
Cortez Kennedy - 1
John Randle - 2 (went to 2nd team when he was 34)
Bob Lily - 1
Merlin Olsen - 1
Mean Joe Greene - 1
Alan Page - 2 (went to 2nd team at 33 years old)

Teams just don't let their stud D tackles go. When are all pro talent d tackles ever available for trade or in FA? Its just a position that is filled with so many busts that when you get one like Chris Jones you don't let him leave before he's even hit his prime, especially if the only reason you can come up with is that he might get hurt.

I want to keep Jones and I think we need to ,also tired of reading wall climbers shit on an on about it lol. But isn’t the list you put up almost entirely of people who played before the cap?

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

No, we are not.

Big Risk: trying to light your cigarette off of a jet engine.

Calculated risk: making a move on a girl who hasn't expressed verbal consent, but you have read the room and know that it's on, provided you aren't Harvey Weinstein.

Hahaha, what the hell? Let's pretend I'm not using your suggested parameters of what a "big risk" entails, how about that?

My implied version of a "big risk" is shall we say less reckless than trying to light a smoke off the exhaust plume of my aircraft.

Let's try this instead: when I was a kid for a few years I raced downhill (skiiing) in NASTAR (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASTAR).

In that discipline there were basically three different 'lines' one could take on any given course. There was a fast line, a safe line, and a compromise line, which was basically between the two. The fast line was the riskiest, steepest line, but would get you across the finish line in the shortest time IF you could stay on your skis all the way down. The problem was that the odds of staying on your skis and on your edges through the entire run on the fast line was always a low percentage route. Kind of skiing's version of a 60-yard Hail Mary pass.

In perfectly ideal conditions you might consider that line. But if the weather was bad, or the surface wasn't ideal, or whatever, you tended to ski closer to the safe line. That might be right on the compromise line, or it might be a little to the fast or slow side depending on the exact situation.

Now what I learned in the short time I competed was that if you wanted any real chance to win, you ignored the safe line almost completely. It was like it didn't exist. Instead the medium or compromise line was your 'safe' line. You skied as close to that fast line as you could and never skied slower than the compromise line. Otherwise you just had no chance to win.

So when I say taking a "big risk" what I'm really saying is aim for as close to that fast line as we can get without losing your edge.

Make sense?

Another example would be pool. I still play pool, though I'm not at the top of my game anymore. But I've played more than a half a million games since I started playing competitively, played in more than a thousand tournaments, and I still play a few local sanctioned tournaments, I just don't play to go to Vegas or Atlantic city or wherever, anymore. So of the things I could say I'm proficient or expert in performance-wise, 8- and 9-ball pool would be among them.

And what I know for a fact is that you can't win in the big tournaments unless you're willing, and more importantly, comfortable taking risks. Some of those risks are just calculated risks of course, but if you want to win a regional qualifier (such as the Desert Classic here in AZ) or if you want to beat the best players in the country you have to be ready to "go all in" every once in a while. Yes, you have to pick your spots; you can't just go all in on every shot or even every game, but there's always that moment in a game or in a match or whatever, when you can try to play conservative and hope to come out on top later, or you can just push all your chips in, so to say, and go for the win. But if you always pick the conservative play, I guarantee you'll never win the big money. That player always ends up some kind of runner-up.

P.S. Some dipstick will think I meant that I won the Desert Classic because of what I posted above. No, I never won the Desert Classic qualifier, but I have placed high enough to qualify for Vegas, which is all I meant.

[OrtonsPiercedTaint]

Originally Posted by MAHOMO 4 LIFE!

Per the NFLPA, the #Chiefs have $21,787,634 in cap space.

— Matt Conner (@MattConnerAA) March 12, 2020

I thought I heard last week. There would be about 22 mil in roll over money. Must have said about 22 mil with the rollover. Tweaks not explained

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

XFL just cancelled their whole season however they will still fully pay their players their base salaries and benefits and all ticket season holders will be issued refunds. They will restart in 2021

[Wallcrawler]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

Look at a list of the best D tackles to ever play. There's something all of those guys have in common and that is they played either there whole careers with the same team or at most 2 teams. Between these guys who are arguably the best 10 DTs of all time only 3 of them played on more than 1 team.

Casey Hampton - 1 team
Buck Buchanan - 1
Warren Sapp - 2 (Played on 2nd team during his decline. Was 32 years old when he went to 2nd team. Worst years of his career)
Randy White - 1
Cortez Kennedy - 1
John Randle - 2 (went to 2nd team when he was 34)
Bob Lily - 1
Merlin Olsen - 1
Mean Joe Greene - 1
Alan Page - 2 (went to 2nd team at 33 years old)

Teams just don't let their stud D tackles go. When are all pro talent d tackles ever available for trade or in FA? Its just a position that is filled with so many busts that when you get one like Chris Jones you don't let him leave before he's even hit his prime, especially if the only reason you can come up with is that he might get hurt.

The level of fail here is ****ing spectacular.

There was no ****ing Salary Cap until 1994.

Are you even ****ing aware of when Free agency where players had any ****ing unrestricted decisionmaking about where they played became an actual thing? When teams no longer had to not only get the team to give up right of refusal, but settle on draft compensation for the right to sign them?

1993.

Pease, tell me the story about how the Chiefs were able to keep Buck Buchanan from going elsewhere, by paying him a huge deal knowing they just couldnt let him entertain offers, while taking care of their "cap space". Lol. Jesus.

Half of these men you listed never even had an option to leave. The only way out was through trade. If the player was good, youd never trade them, and they played for peanuts. If they sucked, nobody was gonna give you shit for them in trade. LMMFAO. They were basicly indentured servants. You want to play, you play here. Or you retire.

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Running Away From Corona Like �� pic.twitter.com/LTsNkvT9m8

— Demarcus Robinson (@Demarcus) March 12, 2020