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Old 04-29-2022, 06:44 PM  
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Old 11-14-2022, 04:09 AM   #1786
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Old 11-14-2022, 07:24 AM   #1787
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It takes 3 years to get up to speed in this scheme.

Or two weeks if you're a legit talent, I guess.

Toney BLOWING past Moore on the depth chart and immediately making plays in this offense should go ahead and put the 'Andy Reid won't play young skill position players' myth to bed.

Moore simply hasn't forced the issue and made himself a part of the offense. In 2 weeks Toney damn sure has.

It wasn't ever Andy Reid - Moore simple isn't the talent so many of you claimed.
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Old 11-14-2022, 07:40 AM   #1788
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Yeah, I dunno. I wasn't the biggest Moore fan, but hell, even I thought he'd be getting more looks at this point.

Seems it's just a redshirt kind of year I guess.
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Old 11-14-2022, 07:42 AM   #1789
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Old 11-14-2022, 07:44 AM   #1790
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At least he's still getting kick return touches
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Old 11-14-2022, 08:00 AM   #1791
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Well, don’t care for the player at all, but seems like if he was ever going to get some action this would be the week. His skill set supposedly compares to what Juju does. Toney is more of a likeness to Hardman and was the likely clear replacement for his touches. Regardless of whether Hardman is back this week or not, Juju will be out. They have a week to gameplan for LA, theoretically this should be the week to get Moore involved. If it doesn’t happen this week I don’t see it happening at all.
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Old 11-14-2022, 08:46 AM   #1792
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Moore dominated at the collegiate level against lesser competition. Few of those guys are going to drop right in at the NFL level unless they are plus route runners. We've seen examples so far this season that show Moore is not yet one.

He isn't going to get separation and be a YAC monster at the NFL level without that... he's not playing in the MAC anymore. I don't have anything to back this up, but he seems to be a guy who will make plays with quickness and agility but isn't possessed with the kind of straight line speed that Hill had. (Not that anyone is, but I mean the sort of speed that allows him to run away from someone vs making moves)

I'm sure the team regarded Moore as a raw talent that will need to grow up, and still does.
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Old 11-14-2022, 08:50 AM   #1793
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Came from the same conference as Eric Fisher, the former #1 overall pick that struggled playing RIGHT tackle before he ever saw the field on the left.

Anybody writing off Moore at this point is just a pessimistic moron.
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:02 AM   #1794
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Came from the same conference as Eric Fisher, the former #1 overall pick that struggled playing RIGHT tackle before he ever saw the field on the left.

Anybody writing off Moore at this point is just a pessimistic moron.
So maybe the lesson is don’t spend high draft picks on players from that conference? That’s a piss poor excuse. Fisher worked out only because that draft was historically bad and there wasn’t really anyone else worth taking. There were PLENTY of better options available than Moore, both at WR and other positions. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, if a player is that raw don’t use a high draft pick on him. DJ had it right in the draft forum thread on Moore.
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Good article. Just as I suspected everything is Smitty's fault. Hope he burns in hell for all of eternity.
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:03 AM   #1795
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Moore dominated at the collegiate level against lesser competition. Few of those guys are going to drop right in at the NFL level unless they are plus route runners. We've seen examples so far this season that show Moore is not yet one.

He isn't going to get separation and be a YAC monster at the NFL level without that... he's not playing in the MAC anymore. I don't have anything to back this up, but he seems to be a guy who will make plays with quickness and agility but isn't possessed with the kind of straight line speed that Hill had. (Not that anyone is, but I mean the sort of speed that allows him to run away from someone vs making moves)

I'm sure the team regarded Moore as a raw talent that will need to grow up, and still does.
If that's the case, they made a doubly bad call, IMO.

Miss on a guy because you think he's going to be more game ready than he was and that's one thing. But to take a guy expecting him to have a steep learning curve when he also doesn't demonstrate premier athletic tools? Well lord, what makes that guy a 2nd round talent?

Which was ultimately the point I made from the beginning - it's not that he's a lousy player or someone who has no chance to produce at this level. It's that he simply wasn't a 2nd round caliber prospect. Nor was Cook, IMO. We didn't get our money's worth from those picks.

Both guys are solid prospects who could have good, productive careers. But neither one of them should've been top 100 picks and certainly not a top 60 pick in Moore's case.

{shrug} Onward and upward. We'll get what we get from him. I just found it interesting that Andy Reid's Impossible Scheme doesn't seem to be holding Toney back much...
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:06 AM   #1796
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If that's the case, they made a doubly bad call, IMO.

Miss on a guy because you think he's going to be more game ready than he was and that's one thing. But to take a guy expecting him to have a steep learning curve when he also doesn't demonstrate premier athletic tools? Well lord, what makes that guy a 2nd round talent?

Which was ultimately the point I made from the beginning - it's not that he's a lousy player or someone who has no chance to produce at this level. It's that he simply wasn't a 2nd round caliber prospect. Nor was Cook, IMO. We didn't get our money's worth from those picks.

Both guys are solid prospects who could have good, productive careers. But neither one of them should've been top 100 picks and certainly not a top 60 pick in Moore's case.

{shrug} Onward and upward. We'll get what we get from him. I just found it interesting that Andy Reid's Impossible Scheme doesn't seem to be holding Toney back much...
My tentative opinion of Moore is a slightly more moderate version of this I think.

I definitely agree that the one quantity which will most cause someone to be overdrafted is speed on film. Hardman, etc
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:07 AM   #1797
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Moore just has a thin margin for how he can find success in the NFL. He doesn’t have Toney’s tools to adjust mid-route and make jaw dropping plays by posterizing his opponent. Instead, I think Moore’s routes need to be precise, consistent, and rather “boring” for him to find success. Mahomes needs to always be able to count on where he’s going to be, and him drifting a yard or two any direction can cause a lot of problems since Moore doesn’t have the tools or size to posterize a defender nearby.

As to why Toub is so hellbent on making a guy with his tools into a returner when he’s never done it before, to that I have no idea.
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:07 AM   #1798
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So maybe the lesson is don’t spend high draft picks on players from that conference? That’s a piss poor excuse. Fisher worked out only because that draft was historically bad and there wasn’t really anyone else worth taking. There were PLENTY of better options available than Moore, both at WR and other positions. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, if a player is that raw don’t use a high draft pick on him. DJ had it right in the draft forum thread on Moore.
I'm actually fine using a high draft pick on a raw player. But if you're gonna do that, you need premium upside from that player.

Moore doesn't have it. This is a guy who's peak is as a complementary player and who, ideally, is more of a 3rd WR on a strong offense.

You don't take THAT kind of player if he's raw, no. And frankly, I think that's where the Chiefs truly missed. I don't think they ever expected him to be this raw. Nor do I think his supporters expected it. They're simply rationalizing a pick that hasn't worked out thus far.
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:09 AM   #1799
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Came from the same conference as Eric Fisher, the former #1 overall pick that struggled playing RIGHT tackle before he ever saw the field on the left.

Anybody writing off Moore at this point is just a pessimistic moron.
The issue I have is just that he was a 2nd rounder. We seem to do really well hitting on non impactful position type guys in the 2nd/3rd ish rounds, but damn we need to hit on some skill guys.

As we talked all thru the trade deadline about pass rushers, LT's etc. Yeah, sure they can be found in those spots. But so far, it doesn't seem this regime has really hit on any.
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Old 11-14-2022, 09:15 AM   #1800
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