Science Space Exploration megathread - Page 114

**DaFace** · 07:17 AM

Since a number of cool things are happening in space exploration these days, we'll widen the scope of this thread a smidge. Conversation about all things space exploration are welcome, whether it be from NASA, SpaceX, ULA, Blue Origin, or anyone else. Chances are most of the discussion will still be about SpaceX since they love to make things public and fun, but nothing's off limits. I'll eventually get around to modifying the OP to include resources for other companies too, but in the meantime, feel free to post any cool stuff you run across.

Lists of Upcoming Missions

Spoiler!

How to Watch a Live Launch

Spoiler!

Where to Learn More

Spoiler!

Glossary

Spoiler!

Space discussions tend to get a little bogged down in jargon, so here's a list of terms you might encounter. (Others, please let me know of others that should be added.)

ASDS - Autonomous Spaceport Droneship - The "barges" that they sometimes land rockets on.
Dragon - The cone-shaped capsule that sits at the top of the rocket for ISS-bound launches that holds the cargo (or, in the future, humans).
F9 - Falcon 9, the name of the rocket itself.
FH - Falcon Heavy, the three-booster version.
GTO - Geosynchronous Transfer Orbit, a type of orbit that will eventually result in the satellite orbiting the earth as it turns so that it seems to be in the same spot from the ground (such as DirecTV or Dish satellites). These types of launches are particularly challenging because they require a lot of power to get them into the right orbit, leaving very little fuel left for landing.
HIF - Horizontal Integration Facility - the building near the launch pad where they put all of the pieces of the rocket together before rolling it out to the pad.
ISS - The International Space Station
JRTI - Just Read The Instructions, the name of the "barge" that they land on for west-coast launches.
LEO - Low Earth Orbit, a fairly low orbit shared by many satellites and ISS. These launches usually require less power to achieve the proper orbit, so the first stage can often be landed back on land rather than on a drone ship.
LZ1 - Landing Zone 1, basically a big open slab of concrete at Cape Canaveral where the first stage will attempt to land (for some launches).
NET - No Earlier Than, basically the date they're hoping to launch, but rocket launches have a tendency of getting delayed.
OCISLY - Of Course I Still Love You, the name of the "barge" that they land on for east-coast launches.
RTLS - Return to Landing Site, a mission where the first stage comes back and lands at LZ1.
Starship - SpaceX's next-generation rocket (and spacecraft) that will hopefully one day take us to Mars. Starship is the "second stage" that will carry cargo or people, but also refers to the whole system. (It's confusing, but think of it like the Space Shuttle, which was both the shuttle itself and the entire launch system.)
Super Heavy - The giant booster that will carry Starship to space.

**DaFace** · 02-21-2018, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molitoth

So what are the collective thoughts on how Neil Armstrong and Neil Degrasse Tyson have been so damning of Space-X?

I think those guys have been douchebags, and I'm really happy Elon keeps proving them wrong.

I think part of it is old news and part of it is people taking quotes out of context. Armstrong's comments came in 2012 before the first Dragon had ever launched to ISS, let alone all the progress with rocket reusability. Even then, he wasn't happy with the way his comments were portrayed.

Quote:

It isn't everyday that you get a letter from Neil Armstrong, yes, that Neil Armstrong. And it's particularly noteworthy when the first man to walk on the moon has a bone to pick with you. Armstrong wrote us recently about a story we did for 60 Minutes on Elon Musk and his SpaceX Corporation. ....

Armstrong wrote us to say we had not been complete in our description of his testimony. He's right. When you look at what Armstrong said to Congress, you see that while he was "not confident" that the newcomers could achieve safety and cost goals in the near term, he did want to "encourage" them. We should have made that clear in our 60 Minutes report and in our story on The CBS Evening News. Also, we should have spelled out that his concerns were directed toward the "newcomers" in general and not SpaceX in particular.

Scott Pelley Managing Editor, The CBS Evening News Co-Editor, 60 Minutes

June 21, 2012

As for NGT, he has a tendency of trying to be a bit controversial for the publicity IMO. Even then, his actual stance is just that SpaceX won't get to Mars without NASA's help. And I don't disagree with that. NASA's role is obviously shifting, but they're still critical to space exploration.

Quote:

"I'm simultaneously one of SpaceX's biggest critics and supporters," he said in response to a question about how advances such as SpaceX's reusable rockets will affect humanity's efforts to get to Mars in the near future.

Projects "that are hugely expensive and dangerous, with uncertain returns on investments, make poor activities of profit-driven companies," Tyson added. "Governments do these things first, allowing private enterprise to learn what to do and what not to do, then come next with a plan that involves us all. So my read of history is that private companies will not be the first to send humans to Mars unless government actually pays for it.

Molitoth · 02-21-2018, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeyis4dcats.

yeah, the cost of SpaceX is shockingly cheap compared to NASA.

https://www.airspacemag.com/space/is...ion-132285884/

Nice article!

I thought this was awesome:

Quote:

Significantly, the Merlin engines—like roughly 80 percent of the components for Falcon and Dragon, including even the flight computers—are made in-house. That’s something SpaceX didn’t originally set out to do, but was driven to by suppliers’ high prices. Mueller recalls asking a vendor for an estimate on a particular engine valve. “They came back [requesting] like a year and a half in development and hundreds of thousands of dollars. Just way out of whack. And we’re like, ‘No, we need it by this summer, for much, much less money.’ They go, ‘Good luck with that,’ and kind of smirked and left.” Mueller’s people made the valve themselves, and by summer they had qualified it for use with cryogenic propellants.

“That vendor, they iced us for a couple of months,” Mueller says, “and then they called us back: ‘Hey, we’re willing to do that valve. You guys want to talk about it?’ And we’re like, ‘No, we’re done.’ He goes, ‘What do you mean you’re done?’ ‘We qualified it. We’re done.’ And there was just silence at the end of the line. They were in shock.” That scenario has been repeated to the point where, Mueller says, “we passionately avoid space vendors.”

Molitoth · 02-21-2018, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

I think part of it is old news and part of it is people taking quotes out of context. Armstrong's comments came in 2012 before the first Dragon had ever launched to ISS, let alone all the progress with rocket reusability. Even then, he wasn't happy with the way his comments were portrayed.

As for NGT, he has a tendency of trying to be a bit controversial for the publicity IMO. Even then, his actual stance is just that SpaceX won't get to Mars without NASA's help. And I don't disagree with that. NASA's role is obviously shifting, but they're still critical to space exploration.

Thanks for some of that clarity DaFace! Good details to redirect judgement.

eDave · 02-21-2018, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

What makes you think it isn't real?

It looks awesome. Thought it might have been shopped together.

aturnis · 02-21-2018, 02:08 PM

Thought this was cool. A little short on specifics, but something fun to think about.

https://gizmodo.com/falcon-heavy-may...1823116009/amp

**Donger** · 02-21-2018, 03:05 PM

Maybe a Max-Q, but:

Not enough ignition fluid to light the outer two engines after several three engine relights. Fix is pretty obvious.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) February 12, 2018

**DaFace** · 02-21-2018, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDave

It looks awesome. Thought it might have been shopped together.

It's pretty clear that they at least considered the angles for photos when they built out the structure. Elon absolutely considers the marketing aspects of everything he does. (See: Roadster on a rocket.)

Molitoth · 02-21-2018, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

Maybe a Max-Q, but:

Not enough ignition fluid to light the outer two engines after several three engine relights. Fix is pretty obvious.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) February 12, 2018

So for us non-rocket engineers, does anyone know the obvious fix? lol

More ignition fluid?

**DaFace** · 02-21-2018, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molitoth

So for us non-rocket engineers, does anyone know the obvious fix? lol

More ignition fluid?

Yep.

**Donger** · 02-21-2018, 07:33 PM

GloryDayz · 02-21-2018, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

It may be getting routine, but it never gets old...

SPchief · 02-21-2018, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

Had they ever landed 2 at the same time? Even at different sites?

allen_kcCard · 02-21-2018, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPchief

Had they ever landed 2 at the same time? Even at different sites?

That was the first time they even launched more than one at a time I think... but definitely the first time landing multiple

SPchief · 02-22-2018, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by allen_kcCard

That was the first time they even launched more than one at a time I think... but definitely the first time landing multiple

That's what I thought. But it's so spectacular that maybe it had been done before

**DaFace** · 02-22-2018, 08:05 AM

Webcast is live.

06-01-2014, 09:40 AM
DaFace Kind of a mod Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Donkey Land Casino cash: $116899	Space Exploration megathread Since a number of cool things are happening in space exploration these days, we'll widen the scope of this thread a smidge. Conversation about all things space exploration are welcome, whether it be from NASA, SpaceX, ULA, Blue Origin, or anyone else. Chances are most of the discussion will still be about SpaceX since they love to make things public and fun, but nothing's off limits. I'll eventually get around to modifying the OP to include resources for other companies too, but in the meantime, feel free to post any cool stuff you run across. Lists of Upcoming Missions Spoiler! General lists: https://nextspaceflight.com/ http://spaceflightnow.com/launch-schedule/ SpaceX specific list: https://spacexnow.com/upcoming.php How to Watch a Live Launch Spoiler! SpaceX: https://www.spacex.com/launches/ ULA: https://www.youtube.com/user/UnitedLaunchAlliance RocketLab: https://www.youtube.com/user/RocketLabNZ NASATV will also cover some launches (primarily ISS resupply missions): https://www.youtube.com/user/NASAtelevision Where to Learn More Spoiler! Some cool pics... https://www.flickr.com/photos/spacex/ https://www.instagram.com/spacex/?hl=en Twitter feed is usually interesing... https://twitter.com/SpaceX https://twitter.com/elonmusk The SpaceX sub is a great source of info... https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/wiki/index And for a more forum-style discussion board... http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php#c17 And there are plenty of YouTube channels with great content... Joe Scott - Lost of "future" discussion. Some about rockets and space. Much that goes beyond. Scott Manley - Super smart dude (engineer) who reviews a lot of major events in space exploration. Frazer Cain (Universe Today) - Podcast-style videos that go in-depth into space topics. Tim Dodd (Everyday Astronaut) - A "random dude" who got really into space (particularly SpaceX). He's a great resource for simple explanations of this stuff, as well as live hosting launches. USLaunchReport - Lost of videos of the more mundane stuff (e.g., booster recovery operations). Not a ton of commentary. NASASpaceFlight - Live hosting of most launches including a ton of video of Starlink operations. Glossary Spoiler! Space discussions tend to get a little bogged down in jargon, so here's a list of terms you might encounter. (Others, please let me know of others that should be added.) ASDS - Autonomous Spaceport Droneship - The "barges" that they sometimes land rockets on. Dragon - The cone-shaped capsule that sits at the top of the rocket for ISS-bound launches that holds the cargo (or, in the future, humans). F9 - Falcon 9, the name of the rocket itself. FH - Falcon Heavy, the three-booster version. GTO - Geosynchronous Transfer Orbit, a type of orbit that will eventually result in the satellite orbiting the earth as it turns so that it seems to be in the same spot from the ground (such as DirecTV or Dish satellites). These types of launches are particularly challenging because they require a lot of power to get them into the right orbit, leaving very little fuel left for landing. HIF - Horizontal Integration Facility - the building near the launch pad where they put all of the pieces of the rocket together before rolling it out to the pad. ISS - The International Space Station JRTI - Just Read The Instructions, the name of the "barge" that they land on for west-coast launches. LEO - Low Earth Orbit, a fairly low orbit shared by many satellites and ISS. These launches usually require less power to achieve the proper orbit, so the first stage can often be landed back on land rather than on a drone ship. LZ1 - Landing Zone 1, basically a big open slab of concrete at Cape Canaveral where the first stage will attempt to land (for some launches). NET - No Earlier Than, basically the date they're hoping to launch, but rocket launches have a tendency of getting delayed. OCISLY - Of Course I Still Love You, the name of the "barge" that they land on for east-coast launches. RTLS - Return to Landing Site, a mission where the first stage comes back and lands at LZ1. Starship - SpaceX's next-generation rocket (and spacecraft) that will hopefully one day take us to Mars. Starship is the "second stage" that will carry cargo or people, but also refers to the whole system. (It's confusing, but think of it like the Space Shuttle, which was both the shuttle itself and the entire launch system.) Super Heavy - The giant booster that will carry Starship to space. Last edited by DaFace; 10-13-2024 at 07:17 AM..
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02-21-2018, 02:08 PM	#1700
aturnis MVP Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Iowa Casino cash: $9975811	Thought this was cool. A little short on specifics, but something fun to think about. https://gizmodo.com/falcon-heavy-may...1823116009/amp
Posts: 13,873

02-21-2018, 03:05 PM	#1701
Donger "Think BOOM!" Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: 33.675° N 106.475° W Casino cash: $8559900 VARSITY	Maybe a Max-Q, but: Not enough ignition fluid to light the outer two engines after several three engine relights. Fix is pretty obvious. — Elon Musk (@elonmusk) February 12, 2018 __________________ I think the young people enjoy it when I "get down," verbally, don't you?
Posts: 187,111

02-21-2018, 07:33 PM	#1705
Donger "Think BOOM!" Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: 33.675° N 106.475° W Casino cash: $8559900 VARSITY	__________________ I think the young people enjoy it when I "get down," verbally, don't you?
Posts: 187,111	2 0

02-22-2018, 08:05 AM	#1710
DaFace Kind of a mod Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Donkey Land Casino cash: $116899	Webcast is live.
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