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Old 03-28-2024, 08:39 AM  
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***Official 2024 STL Cardinals Thread ***
I'll update the rosters and opening day lineup when its officially released.

2024 Opening Day roster.
Spoiler!

For the new Cardinal fans that joined the Planet since last year, here are some of the historical threads going back to 2006.
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Old 10-01-2024, 09:45 PM   #736
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***Official 2024 STL Cardinals Thread ***
https://www.scoopswithdannymac.com/b...ill-dewitt-jr/

Bernie has been rightfully negative towards Mo and ownership but he has high hopes for the new guy.
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Old 10-01-2024, 10:30 PM   #737
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https://www.scoopswithdannymac.com/b...ill-dewitt-jr/

Bernie has been rightfully negative towards Mo and ownership but he has high hopes for the new guy.
Bernie was 5 years (at late) to the party.

I'm well beyond giving a shit what that guy has to say. With all the access he has, the best he could do for the better part of a half-decade has been to scold the fans for not recognizing how great we have it.

**** him.

This is just another excuse for him to chastise the fans. I'm sure he'll be pissed that we're simply not being patient enough for the next 3 seasons.

Miklasz been a worthless weathervane since I could be bothered to notice him.
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Old 10-02-2024, 05:45 AM   #738
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One guy won 2 pennants and WS while working for the team for almost 3 decades.

The other didn’t do shit.
Stop
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Old 10-02-2024, 05:50 AM   #739
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So weird to keep Mo a year while he "mentors " the new guy? Seriously? That's the play? This organization is completely out of touch with what made it successful.

Mo s fluke World Series win with a mediocre team that had a charmed phoney run really torpedoed this franchise
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Old 10-02-2024, 06:50 AM   #740
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So weird to keep Mo a year while he "mentors " the new guy? Seriously? That's the play? This organization is completely out of touch with what made it successful.

Mo s fluke World Series win with a mediocre team that had a charmed phoney run really torpedoed this franchise
I think it is partially because they are lowering salaries at the top level to use those same monies to improve player development at the lower levels of the organization.
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Old 10-02-2024, 06:57 AM   #741
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There isn't much hope in the pipeline. It's unbelievable how bad he destroyed this organization
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Old 10-02-2024, 06:58 AM   #742
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I also feel like dj was baiting me a bit with Shildt comments
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Old 10-02-2024, 08:33 AM   #743
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There isn't much hope in the pipeline. It's unbelievable how bad he destroyed this organization
And the 'young talent' ain't that young. Or ain't really talent.

I mean Donovan is 28 next season, Nootbaar 27. Both of them have probably hit their ceilings and those ceilings are complementary players. Nootbaar could be your 3rd best OFer if you're getting good power production elsewhere so you can use him as a solid defender and plus source of OBP.

Donovan should really be getting about 500 ABs as a super-utility sort; that's absolutely how the Dodgers would use him and probably get 5 WAR out of him.

Burleson is 26 next season - still a little time to develop, but a .735 OPS in a 'breakout' season is...iffy. Guy hit 20 homers and still only managed a .150 ISO? I stlil believe he's a hitter but his profile was so weird this season. He maybe had a little bad BABIP luck but that's been his career. So lets say some of that regresses a bit -- is a .275/.325/.445 guy really all that valuable when he doesn't play any defense at all to speak of? What does that make you? Ryan Mountcastle? Nate Lowe? That's, what, a 2-3 WAR player?

Gorman is a trash heap. I'm sorry, but the hit tool just doesn't seem like it's ever going to become anything and he's no sort of 2b. Maybe if they find a way to move Arenado and open up 3b for him so he can focus on fixing his bat instead of playing a position he's ill-equipped to play, that may help. I have little confidence in that regard.

Victor Scott is a bench player. Ivan Herrera has talent and time, but I'm not sure they can play him at catcher without a defensive re-set and his offense doesn't profile anywhere else.

I still believe in Walker. He's a hell of a talent. Perhaps the new direction can fix him. And I think Winn can probably be the 3rd best player on a contender unless he really gooses that OBP and his SB figures in a way that allows him to become a truly dynamic leadoff hitter in Jose Reyes mode. But a .314 OBP is a 9 place hitter, not a leadoff man. He has some raw pull power that could develop a little more so maybe more of a 7th place hitter. But as currently constructed, he's just not the star they're putting him out there as.

The other problem with the 'Young Players" song is that their best player is Willson Contreras and he'll be 33 next year. Even if the young guys improve, some of that will be offset by him simply getting worse. I do wonder if we see him moved to 1b next season with Herrera and Pages taking over behind the plate.

That would seem to (again) bury Burleson in a position he's ill-suited to play (and Walker) but Marmol's still on the bench and Mozeliak is still upstairs, so they're still going to be remarkably stupid. As such, it's probably something they'll try.
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Old 10-02-2024, 08:36 AM   #744
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I also feel like dj was baiting me a bit with Shildt comments
Weird how the team that hired Shildt looks really similar to how we looked when we had him, eh? And how our big-league development fell to absolute shit the moment he left.

You're just flat wrong w/r/t to Shildt. Guy was a good manager. This is a FAR worse organization for having lost him. There are maybe a dozen guys out there better at the job than he is.

And that may not be giving him enough credit.

Pat Murphy may end up getting the MOY award, but it should be Shildts to lose.
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Old 10-02-2024, 08:45 AM   #745
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Look at the talent the Padres lost from last season.

Juan Soto, Seth Lugo, Michael Wacha, Josh Hader and Blake Snell. That's an MVP, the reigning CY young winner and 2 excellent middle of the rotation pitchers. What is that, 20 WAR lost from last years roster?

Cease and King have effectively been 1 for 1 replacements for Snell and Lugo, so we'll cancel those out. He STILL lost Soto, Hader and Wacha from that team, not to mention the Darvish weirdness and they got better over last year.

I will never understand why you refuse to give that guy credit. All he's ever done is win ballgames and all you care about is that time he couldn't lead a team that shouldn't have been in the playoffs to begin with (but was because Shildt is awesome) past Max Scherzer, Mookie Betts and the 105 win Dodgers. It's seriously crazy town.
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Old 10-02-2024, 09:41 AM   #746
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Old 10-02-2024, 09:54 AM   #747
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Oh thank God.

Does that mean I can finally get rid of this god-awful ****ing FUBO package and go back to YouTubeTV?

Because the Blues (and at the time, Cardinals) were the only reason I made that switch and lord almighty is this an awful product. If that means Diamond isn't going to be broadcasting the games, I can move along.

And again - just aces ****ing work by DeWitt and company getting into bed with these idiots and then citing their demise as the root of every problem the franchise has.

I still can't believe these guys want us to believe they're the Rays. "Oh we just don't have the attendance to field a quality big league team AND a genuine player development system. Because Cable. Poor poor us..."

**** you, DeWitts.
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Old 10-02-2024, 11:43 AM   #748
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At least someone finally agreed about Noot the rest of you can apologize
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Old 10-02-2024, 12:05 PM   #749
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At least someone finally agreed about Noot the rest of you can apologize
No one agreed with you.

Someone said he has potentially peaked. That peak being a 3rd best outfielder in a complimentary role. He's an above average baseball player. No one has ever said he's a star.

You on the other hand, think hes absolutely terrible and would dump him for salary relief.

You look at this https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savan...-r-hitting-mlb and think he's trash. No one is apologizing to you, dumbass.
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Old 10-02-2024, 12:35 PM   #750
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No one agreed with you.

Someone said he has potentially peaked. That peak being a 3rd best outfielder in a complimentary role. He's an above average baseball player. No one has ever said he's a star.

You on the other hand, think hes absolutely terrible and would dump him for salary relief.

You look at this https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savan...-r-hitting-mlb and think he's trash. No one is apologizing to you, dumbass.
Yeah - I still think Nootbaar is a valuable player when healthy; a poor man's Brandon Nimmo.

That said, he's running out of runway in a hurry. If he can't stay healthy, you have to move on. Next season is a shit or get off the pot year for him.

If he can stay on the field, he has 16-20 homer raw power (mostly pull power, but a little to straightaway). He can run a little, 10-12 steals. A smart baserunner, a good fielder especially in the corners. But he's a guy who ROUTINELY puts up a BB rate in the 12-14% range and that's hugely valuable, especially if he can keep that K rate in the 18% range. At that point you're looking at a guy who should hit around .260 with an OBP about 100 points higher than his BA and a SLG about .170 pts higher.

.260/.360/.430 is an OPS just shy of .800.

That's not Aaron Judge, no. But it's offensive production about 20% better than league average. And if you can do that while also playing plus defense, you're a 3-4 WAR player.

Nothing there is even remotely out of bounds for him.

That's a big league starting outfielder every time.

But health is a real issue.
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