Investing megathread extravaganza

[DaFace]

A place to talk about investing stuff.

[Iconic]

Originally Posted by Hog's Gone Fishin

What do you guys think about the government monitoring our bank accounts ? The way I heard it last night was that any account that reaches a $600 balance at any time will then be monitored by the IRS. Thus they've sent EVERYBODY a $600 stimulus check so there you go. I haven't a damn thing to hide but talk about a waste of resources ,time and money .

Lol that threshold is directly aimed at the middle class not the rich. A $600 purchase is easily broken through mortgage and car payments. ****ing ridiculous, literally just a bullshit law to let them pick and choose anyone they want - when they want them.

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by Hog's Gone Fishin

What do you guys think about the government monitoring our bank accounts ? The way I heard it last night was that any account that reaches a $600 balance at any time will then be monitored by the IRS. Thus they've sent EVERYBODY a $600 stimulus check so there you go. I haven't a damn thing to hide but talk about a waste of resources ,time and money .

I don't mind enforcement of tax laws since I pay my fair share and think others should do the same. But before this level of stuff happens, how about increasing the tax rate on wealthy people so they pay the same tax rate as the middle class?

Sorry, politics. I'll change the language to something innocuous.

I don't mind enforcement of grapes since I pay my fair share and think others should do the same. But before this level of stuff happens, how about increasing the watermelon rate on wealthy cantaloupes so they pay the same bananas as the tangerines?

[petegz28]

Originally Posted by Rain Man

I don't mind enforcement of tax laws since I pay my fair share and think others should do the same. But before this level of stuff happens, how about increasing the tax rate on wealthy people so they pay the same tax rate as the middle class?

Sorry, politics. I'll change the language to something innocuous.

I don't mind enforcement of grapes since I pay my fair share and think others should do the same. But before this level of stuff happens, how about increasing the watermelon rate on wealthy cantaloupes so they pay the same bananas as the tangerines?

Tax policy is a rouse. We always hear "pay their fair share" when it comes to the rich but it's just lip service. We have 3 paradigms when it comes to tax policy:

1. The wealthy
2. The middle class
3. The poor

We eliminate changing #3 since the poor will not pay taxes at least as income tax goes.

We eliminate changing #1 since the wealthy often have the influence over the policy makers and have the financial ability to take advantage of any and all tax breaks, loopholes, etc.

That leaves you with one paradigm left that you can constantly manipulate. The middle class makes enough to pay taxes but not enough to take advantage of tax breaks. Itemization vs. Standard deduction is where it starts. It has always been a one or the other paradigm. They want it that way. They being the politicos. If you really wanted to see tax fairness in an unorthodox way you blend the two.

For example:

Scenario:
You want to make health care more affordable for the middle class

Solution:
Allow middle class tax payers to take both the standard deduction plus write off legitimate medical expenses.

This makes health costs more affordable while increasing the spending power of the individual thus generating tax revenue through means other than direct income tax.

Scenario:
You want to make retirement more attainable and stable for he middle class.

Solution:
Allow 100% tax-free withdrawals from pre-tax accounts such as traditional 401k and IRA plans.

Again as with the medical aspect, this puts more money into the pocket of a person who will actually spend it.


The "fair share" argument comes down to not who is paying what but who is TAKING what. The Fed Gov has a habit of increasing the burden on the tax payer under the guise of easing the burden. For instance, increasing the amount you can put into a retirement plan. That doesn't make it easier on the individual. What it does is give that appearance while the Fed Gov continues to collect instead of not collecting.

It can get down to politics purely but the fact is the tax system is not being used as intended thus the means of collecting taxes is not being done as intended.

[neech]

Originally Posted by Hog's Gone Fishin

What do you guys think about the government monitoring our bank accounts ? The way I heard it last night was that any account that reaches a $600 balance at any time will then be monitored by the IRS. Thus they've sent EVERYBODY a $600 stimulus check so there you go. I haven't a damn thing to hide but talk about a waste of resources ,time and money .

Not a good idea at all.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/mone...ts/6052734001/

Excerpt from the article:

Would banks face new obligations?

Yes. Banks and other financial institutions would need to track and report all of this new transaction activity to the IRS. That could drive up their costs and possibly result in more fees being passed along to customers.

"The fact that raw data exists somewhere in a system does not mean it is easily compiled or produced," stated a letter sent to congressional leaders by the Consumer Bankers Association, the American Bankers Association and nearly 40 other financial and industry groups.

"This proposal would create significant operational and reputational challenges for financial institutions, increase tax-preparation costs for individuals and small businesses, and create serious financial privacy concerns," stated the letter from the banking and industry groups.

[lewdog]

Originally Posted by petegz28

Tax policy is a rouse. We always hear "pay their fair share" when it comes to the rich but it's just lip service. We have 3 paradigms when it comes to tax policy:

1. The wealthy
2. The middle class
3. The poor

We eliminate changing #3 since the poor will not pay taxes at least as income tax goes.

We eliminate changing #1 since the wealthy often have the influence over the policy makers and have the financial ability to take advantage of any and all tax breaks, loopholes, etc.

That leaves you with one paradigm left that you can constantly manipulate. The middle class makes enough to pay taxes but not enough to take advantage of tax breaks. Itemization vs. Standard deduction is where it starts. It has always been a one or the other paradigm. They want it that way. They being the politicos. If you really wanted to see tax fairness in an unorthodox way you blend the two.

For example:

Scenario:
You want to make health care more affordable for the middle class

Solution:
Allow middle class tax payers to take both the standard deduction plus write off legitimate medical expenses.

This makes health costs more affordable while increasing the spending power of the individual thus generating tax revenue through means other than direct income tax.

Scenario:
You want to make retirement more attainable and stable for he middle class.

Solution:
Allow 100% tax-free withdrawals from pre-tax accounts such as traditional 401k and IRA plans.

Again as with the medical aspect, this puts more money into the pocket of a person who will actually spend it.


The "fair share" argument comes down to not who is paying what but who is TAKING what. The Fed Gov has a habit of increasing the burden on the tax payer under the guise of easing the burden. For instance, increasing the amount you can put into a retirement plan. That doesn't make it easier on the individual. What it does is give that appearance while the Fed Gov continues to collect instead of not collecting.

It can get down to politics purely but the fact is the tax system is not being used as intended thus the means of collecting taxes is not being done as intended.

This is spot on in every aspect for the middle class.

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by petegz28

It's a scary overreach. Yellen says there's a lot of tax cheating going on. I suggest they start monitoring the accounts of Congress first along with one Hunter Biden. But we are getting into politics here and it's not the place.

I'd agree. But let's not go there.

From a practical perspective, a giant amount of fraud comes from refundable tax credits. Which, largely affect the poor.

IMO, renovate the welfare system, and get it out of the tax code. That will cut down on a ****ton of the fraud.

[MTG#10]

I think we to just go ahead and lock this thread from new posts for everyone except pete.

[eDave]

Originally Posted by MTG#10

I think we to just go ahead and lock this thread from new posts for everyone except pete.

"I don't want to get political but I'll say it anyway."

[lewdog]

Originally Posted by MTG#10

I think we to just go ahead and lock this thread from new posts for everyone except pete.

Nah.

I need your AMC tips on when this is supposed to explode. We’re past July you know?!?!

[MTG#10]

Originally Posted by lewdog

Nah.

I need your AMC tips on when this is supposed to explode. We’re past July you know?!?!

Did I say it would happen by the end of July? I don't believe so.

[scho63]

Originally Posted by Pointer19

Anybody here into physical precious metals? I'm intrigued by the stacks these guys have. https://www.reddit.com/r/Wallstreetsilver/top/

I see no big value in holding precious metals anymore.

The inflation hedge is Crypto coins, not precious metals.

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Originally Posted by lewdog

Nah.

I need your AMC tips on when this is supposed to explode. We’re past July you know?!?!

Originally Posted by MTG#10

Did I say it would happen by the end of July? I don't believe so.

Let's put it on Trey's shoulders. He expects next leg up in 2-4 weeks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cf5LA0WSVFQ

[petegz28]

Price action looks good today. We are up against the 50 day SMA again, however. That was resistance last time we hit it and volatility appears to be trying to pick back up a bit which for the SPY is never a good thing. A break through the 50 day SMA would confirm a short term head and shoulders pattern but we really need to see a break through the highs on 9/23.

[MTG#10]

I talked about this a while back but need some clarification from the retirement plan experts here.

My company was bought out recently, so my existing 401k is being terminated. I've been given several options by some financial adviser that came over with the new company...rollover to a Roth and pay taxes, rollover to a traditional, or leave it where its at and it will automatically roll over to an American Funds IRA and invested into a money market fund.

I asked the guy about just straight cashing it out. I understand the tax implications since 401k's are pre-taxed, but other than tax there should be no other penalties assessed, correct? He strongly discouraged that choice and said there would be penalties on top of the tax.

I thought since the plan is being terminated and that is out of my control the cash-out penalties would be waived? We're not talking about a huge sum of money, this particular 401k has less than $20k.

[Munson]

Originally Posted by MTG#10

I talked about this a while back but need some clarification from the retirement plan experts here.

My company was bought out recently, so my existing 401k is being terminated. I've been given several options by some financial adviser that came over with the new company...rollover to a Roth and pay taxes, rollover to a traditional, or leave it where its at and it will automatically roll over to an American Funds IRA and invested into a money market fund.

I asked the guy about just straight cashing it out. I understand the tax implications since 401k's are pre-taxed, but other than tax there should be no other penalties assessed, correct? He strongly discouraged that choice and said there would be penalties on top of the tax.

I thought since the plan is being terminated and that is out of my control the cash-out penalties would be waived? We're not talking about a huge sum of money, this particular 401k has less than $20k.

I believe you have to pay a 10% penalty on top of any taxes for an early withdrawal.

If it was me, I'd just roll it over, preferably into a Roth IRA. Tax free growth!