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Originally Posted by DRM08
I think Burrow is great, but you are not telling the full story here. Burrow’s defense has played a massive role in helping win games or even lose close games instead of getting blown out. Cincy defense has never given up more than 23 points in 7 playoff games the last two seasons. They’ve given up less than 19 points per game in the playoffs. That is extremely helpful to any QB.
Allen’s defense has given up 36 points per game in Buffalo’s last 3 playoff losses. Mahomes’ defense has given up an average of 32 points per game in 3 Playoff losses. Last year Patrick needed 36 just to make it to overtime with Buffalo. He needed 31 just to make it to overtime against the Patriots 4 years ago. Burrow has not dealt with this scenario in his career so far. I am curious to see how long Cincy’s defense can keep playing at such a strong level.
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I think they'll probably have some drop off in a year or 2 when Burrow's contract hits. It'll be more interesting to see what happens with their offense though as they can't afford Higgins/Chase/Boyd long-term. I think they should move on from Mixon sooner than later.
Also, going by eye test, Burrow hasn't played like shit like Allen did in his 2 PO games this year. He looked like ass vs Miami and he looked like ass vs Cincy. His play vs Miami would have likely cost them the game (along with their defense) if Miami had a QB with a pulse.
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Originally Posted by tredadda
Ryan does have a MVP and Eli does not. But Eli has two SB rings and two SB MVPs. More than Ryan and Rivers combined. Ryan will also be remembered for the epic 28-3 collapse. Ryan is 0-1 against Brady in SBs. Eli is 2-0. Again not a good comparison.
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Nick Foles is 1-0 vs Brady in the SB, but when you look at the #s, Brady actually outplayed Foles by a large margin. I'd also argue Eli shouldn't have won either SB MVPs (Tyree and Manningham deserve more credit, IMO, with their catches).
Yes, 28-3 is awful. But how much on that is on Ryan vs the defense/Shanahan going conservative on offensive playcalling?
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Originally Posted by mr. tegu
So are they elite or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
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Rivers played on a torn ACL in the AFC Championship game losing by 9 against a team that went 16-0 and had another season end because Schottenheimer went full Schottenheimer vs the Patriots at the worst possible time in 2006 along with a DB fumbling an interception to give Brady a chance to tie the game.
To me, to be considered elite, a QB's play has to elevate those around him. I'd argue Rivers and Ryan both did that.
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Originally Posted by mr. tegu
One 300 yard game. 0 fourth quarter passing TDs. 0 30 point games. Huge drop in rating in 4th quarter. 0 drives in fourth quarter leading to TDs. There is no debating his defense has carried him in the playoffs.
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His defense has helped, yes. But Burrow hasn't played well. He's put the Bengals in a situation to win. As I said, his #s last year were comparable to Jimmy G in the POs. I recognize the defense has been opportunistic and is a large part of their success. But acting as if Burrow is like Trent Dilfer is inaccurate.
If your argument is that Burrow isn't Mahomes, fine. I agree. But if you're going to discredit him, you'd have to day the same with a guy like Brady or Roethlisberger who had good defenses/supporting casts.