Cassel > Cutler by Mel Kiper Jr.
 

Tuesday with Mel Kiper Jr.

Mel says Cassel is better than Cutler


<!-- end mod-article-title --> <!-- begin story body --> <!-- isa photo --><!-- isa photo --><!-- template inline -->This week, Jay Cutler's moaning has distracted Mel Kiper Jr. from his usual draft content. "Talk about whining and complaining -- this is at the top of the list," Kiper says.
Kiper: Cassel > Cutler

Cutler's complaining came about because the Denver Broncos tried to trade Cutler in a three-team deal that would have brought over Matt Cassel from New England. But when the trade fell through, Cutler started to complain. <!-- INLINE NFL.com Video (BEGIN) -->

<!-- INLINE NFL.com Video (END) --> Kiper says Cassel would have been an "upgrade" over Cutler and that Cutler is, to put it mildly, overrated. "[Cutler] throws one pass, he's a Hall of Famer," Kiper says. "I've seen the media put him in the Hall of Fame. I had to run to the bathroom quick. It was making me ill. I've been hearing this overhype. "This guy was overhyped at the combine, he was overhyped at Senior Bowl week, he's been overhyped before he was drafted. The media, they love Jay Cutler. Jay Cutler can do no wrong. I've been saying he's overrated since day one. Everyone's been pounding their chests saying, 'Oh, I love Jay Cutler, I'm a genius.' They have egg on their face now." Kiper points out that Cutler has yet to lead the Broncos to a winning record or a playoff appearance. Also, Kiper says, "[Cutler] makes throws that leave you scratching your head, which I said on draft day when he was picked. Yeah, he's got a strong arm, but my daughter knew he had a strong arm. She could've written that report."

<!-- start podcast --> ESPN First Draft: 3/10

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Mel Kiper Jr. and Todd McShay tell Ryen Russillo all about players with buzz and those without it. Plus, the Scouts Inc. crew has a couple of mid-round steals for you to consider.
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<!-- end podcast --> Kiper compares Cutler to Jeff George. "Jeff George had a great arm, and Jeff George had a lot of great games in this league, and people were putting Jeff George in the HOF early in his career," Kiper says. "So I'm just telling you, this is ridiculous." Also, Cutler once said he had a better arm than John Elway. Not surprisingly, Kiper isn't a big fan of that comment, either. "So what? Who cares? Why would you make a comparison to John Elway? That could be taken like you're in a position to critique the quarterback that is a legend."
Cornerbacks

Back to discussing the draft. "There isn't that one true shutdown cornerback available this year," Kiper says. "And after the subpar 40 times run by the defensive backs at the combine workout, this position isn't really as strong or as deep as originally anticipated." Michael Jenkins, Ohio State: "Jenkins is barely maintaining his spot as the No. 1 cornerback," Kiper says. Although Kiper points out that Jenkins "brings a ton of experience and sound technique to the position," he ran a 4.55 40-yard dash at the combine, which makes Kiper worry whether he's worthy of first-round consideration. Vontae Davis, Illinois: Davis is on Jenkins' heels as the top cornerback in this class. But "he lacks the necessary consistency and is still a work in progress," Kiper says. "But physically, he has the awesome physical talent you look for to warrant a first-round grade." D.J. Moore, Vanderbilt: Kiper says he has impressive cover skills, good return skills, smooth hips and good ball skills, but he lacks good recovery speed. Alphonso Smith, Wake Forest: "The 5-9, 193-pounder would be a first-round lock if he were a few inches taller and a bit faster," Kiper says. Darius Butler, Connecticut: Butler is a multiskilled athlete with outstanding recovery speed, Kiper says. Butler also saw action on offense, with nine receptions, and is a solid kick returner.

Underrated: Donald Washington, Ohio State: Washington left school early, a move that many people questioned, but Kiper says he is a solid second-rounder and will draw consideration in the latter portion of Round 1. "He has the physical skills you look for," Kiper says.

Others with early-round potential

• Jairus Byrd, Oregon
• Keenan Lewis, Oregon State
• Brandon Hughes, Oregon State
• Captain Munnerlyn, South Carolina
• Sean Smith, Utah
• Asher Allen, Georgia
• Jerraud Powers, Auburn

Safeties

Because USC's Taylor Mays opted to return to school, there isn't a true star at safety in this draft, Kiper says. William Moore, Missouri: After his junior season, in which he made eight interceptions, he was considered a first-round pick. But Kiper says a foot injury early in his senior season caused him to have just one pick last season. However, he ran an "impressive" 4.5-second 40-yard dash at the NFL combine. "He could turn out to be a steal in Round 2," Kiper says. Louis Delmas, Western Michigan: "A true ball hawk at free safety." Rashad Johnson, Alabama: "Had a spectacular year in the SEC, evidenced by his three-interception performance against LSU back in early November," Kiper says. He adds that Johnson is smart and instinctive, with his only weakness being a lack of ideal size (5-foot-11, 202 pounds). Others with early-round potential

• Emanuel Cook, South Carolina
• Patrick Chung, Oregon
• Sherrod Martin, Troy
• Darcel McBath, Texas Tech
• Chip Vaughn, Wake Forest
• David Bruton, Notre Dame
• Michael Hamlin, Clemson

Outside linebackers

"While there are several high-profile inside linebackers, there's no question the outside linebacker spot is much better when it comes to talent and overall depth," Kiper says. He predicts that as many as four outside linebackers could be chosen in Round 1 of the draft. Aaron Curry, Wake Forest: Curry is the top player on Kiper's draft board. The multidimensional linebacker gets "high grades in all aspects of outside linebacker play." Kiper says he is destined to be a perennial Pro Bowler. Brian Cushing, USC: Kiper says Cushing is able to perform effectively in a 4-3 or 3-4 scheme. Also, he is more "proven and battle-tested" than his teammate Clay Matthews. Clay Matthews, USC: Matthews is in the Mike Vrabel mold and excels as a pass-rusher, Kiper reports. He is rocketing up draft boards after one season as a starter at USC. Larry English, Northern Illinois: "He was a force to be reckoned with with the Huskies." Clint Sintim, Virginia: "He has the talent and wingspan to operate on his feet or shift to a down defensive end position." He likely will be drafted in the second round. Inside linebackers

Rey Maualuga, USC: "He ranks as one of the hardest-hitting tacklers you will ever come across." James Laurinaitis, Ohio State: "He isn't flashy and lacks awesome computer numbers, but he gets extremely high grades in the consistency department." Kiper believes he needs to be protected by quality defensive tackle play. Others with early-round potential

• Jason Phillips, TCU
• Scott McKillop, Pittsburgh
• Jasper Brinkley, South Carolina
• Gerald McRath, Southern Mississippi
• Darry Beckwith, LSU

T.O.'s replacement?

With Terrell Owens gone, Kiper thinks Roy Williams will have to step up and be the No. 1 receiver in Dallas. "When he was at [the University of] Texas, he had great talent -- he flashed it time and time again." But Kiper believes Williams needs to be more assertive. "Don't be necessarily T.O. or Randy Moss. But you've got to go out there and have a little bit of an attitude -- a little chip on your shoulder," Kiper says. So who will play opposite Williams? Kiper says the Cowboys could find a quick slot receiver in the second round, like Brian Robiskie from Ohio State or Juaquin Iglesias from Oklahoma. Or they could roll the dice and go for Pat White from West Virginia, a quarterback whom many teams view as a wide receiver. Kiper says White could be the next Antwaan Randle El. But those are the Cowboys' options only if Hakeem Nicks (North Carolina) and Kenny Britt (Rutgers) are off the board by the time the Cowboys make their first pick of the draft in Round 2.








LOL. Cutler fans have egg on their face.... hahaha what a great insult.

Oh, here's the article link:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft...ory?id=3966885

I love how Kiper really lays it into Cutler. Like he's a Jeff George... man, if Whitlock reads this, he's going to want us to go after Cutler now!

This offseason just keeps getting better and better.

I hope "BOB" posts this over at the mange.

LOL. I just love how KC is on the lips of everyone. Pioli is a marketing guru.

Cassel > Cutler by McDaniels

Mel Kiper - is he still relevant?

Wilford Brimley is going to invade Kiper's house and stab him in his sleep.

The donks are going through a rough patch for sure but with their signings in free agency I expect them to be better than us this year.

Really?

I listen to ESPN Radio while I'm working, and the week after the Cassel trade all the talk was about how Cutler was pissed about his name coming up in trade talks.

The Chiefs were basically just mentioned in passing as the team that got Cassel instead of the Donkeys.

As near as I can tell, no one is talking about the Chiefs, still.

I'm sure this will do wonders for Cutler's already sunny disposition.

BWAAHHAAHHAA LMAO

As relevant as anyone on here.

I dunno, I heard about the Cassel/Vrabel trade nonstop. And I guess I was talking about this offseason in general. I've heard tons about the Chiefs on ESPN. It's not all about the Pat's for once.

Donxs implosion nothing could be finer.

I think Cutler is an overrated whiner, but Kiper is trying to make himself look good. He (I'm almost positive) said Matt Leinart was the steal of that year's draft, and that Cutler was the third best QB prospect behind Vince Young and Leinart. So he can toot his own horn about Cutler if he wants, but so far Cutler is still far better than Vince Young or Matt Leinart.
He's saying people have egg on their face. Mel has egg on his face more than they do, he needs to shut his pie hole.

And what did he say about Cassel coming out? :)

Come on now ... I am excited as much as the next guy about Cassel and the Broncos troubles but seriously Mel?

I have big hopes for Cassell, but to say he's better than Cutler right now is just plain stupid.

Mel Kiper? Brotha' please.

I think Mel Kiper, and Mecca are the same guy.

Both overvalue their own opinion, and are wrong more often than they will ever admit.

espn has been showing that little blurb about all of this and comparing Cassel and Cutler based on last seasons numbers and Cassel comes out ahead. And right now I think Jay is hurting himself more with the "whining" that he is doing. Not returning phone calls from Bowlen..the owner...He is starting to make himself look like a problem.

The fact is that Cutler needs to grow up, but he has tons more upside than Cassel.

We've yet to see Leinart play in a system that really suits his arm strength. Sure, that arm strength is a big negative, but it's not the only thing that's important in a big-time QB. Intangibles have alot to do with it, and whether or not Leinart has those is yet to be determined.

The thing is, Kiper is right about Cutler. People are enamored with his physical tools, but nobody (other than Kiper apparently) had ever stopped to examine whether or not this guy has the mental makeup to be a champion. I said at the time he was drafted that I didn't think he did, and so far, he's done nothing but prove me (and Kiper) right.

Upside = hoping that he pans out.

I would say assessing a player based on upside is pretty equal to drafting for need. Not the same, but similar. It happens every single year in the MLB draft where half of the first rounders(or more) are high school kids drafted on potential. When all is said and done, a small percentage of them turn out being big time MLBers.

Like I said, not the same, but quite similar.

Wow. Hard hitting analysis right there.

Does he? He's got ALL of the physical tools. There's very little that he can develop on the physical side. And mentally, it's not something that even CAN be developed. He's either a winner, or he's not.

I think Cutler is, right now, what he's going to be. THIS is Jay Cutler.

It also possible that he will be like George and never get it.

But I don't think you can completely rule out the possibility that he'll mature.

If he does mature, that combined with his physical tools would make him an elite QB.

I can't completely rule it out, no.

But he actually seems to be regressing, so to say I've seen anything to even suggest that he might be able to turn the corner would be exaggerating.

I just don't see him being anything more than he is today - a very good QB with a great arm that won't ever win anything of significance.

He may be right about Cutler, but that doesn't exuse the fact that he's telling other people how wrong they were when Leinart has done nothing and Vince Young is a train wreck- both of whom he claimed were better. If he wants to bash Cutler, that's cool, but for him to be deriding other people because they liked him is ridiculous. Look in the mirror, Mel. As far as Leinert yet to be determined- he couldn't earn his way onto the field so I don't see any way anyone could claim he's anywhere near Cutler yet.

Pro-Bowl >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bench

A young all-pro QB being a hot head? Who ever heard of such a thing? Cutler, like a lot of twenty-something ultra-competitve athletes, needs to grow into his role. He is a smart guy that doesn't appreciate the new kid-coach ****ing with him and isn't afraid to say so.
Is that the mature thing to do? No. But I bet it feels good.

Leinart hasn't displayed the motivation or commitment to do much more than hold a clip board and knock back beer bongs. I live in Phoenix, I see and hear the reports. Don't be surprised to see Matty continue to accept the back-up role behind Kurt instead of trying to force a trade so he can play. Matty knows when he has it good.

Him being a hot head isn't the issue, it's a symptom. He's had mental lapses, on and off the field, since high school. I fully understand where you're coming from, but it's not out-of-the-question to wonder if the kid has what it takes upstairs to take his game to the next level. It was plastered all over his scouting reports.

Jake Plummer Part II ??

I see what you mean. We're on opposite sides of the fence here so we see the same thing differently. I feel like you can coach poise in the pocket and progression reads but you can't coach a cross-body 45 yard laser.
We'll see what happens with him. If he stays, losing B-Marsh is not going to help.

So far I think the kid-coach McDaniels has had a great run in the FA market but has pissed me off.
Wanting Cassell is just plain stupid. He only wanted him because he was a Patsy. McKid also cut our long-snapper and locker room leader so he could sign NE long-snapper.
I hate that shit.

You must have missed the part where he said "great arm".

I think he was comparing the general attitude of both players.

Exactly. This is nothing more and the 3rd article in the past week about Kiper slamming into Cutler who has nothing to do with the upcoming draft. Kiper is a sad little man.

You can coach poise and progression to a certain extent, but only to a guy that CAN and WANTS to learn. It remains to be seen if Cutler is that guy or not.

We really don't see it all that differently on the surface. The difference is that you're a Bronco fan so you hope he pans out. I'm a rival so I hope he doesn't. It's that slight emotional color in the argument that causes the difference in viewpoints.

You'd be incorrect about that. Cutler until his vacation started was at Dove Valley everyday pouring over his performance from the prior season. He gets better every year.

That's what I was trying to say but didn't state so clearly.

Just curious: Assuming you like all the changes (upgrades) that KC has made in HC/Front Office personnel: When was the last pre-season year you were as optimistic about the direction of your Chiefs as you are this year?

Plummer didn't have a ROCKET for an arm but he could deliver the ball down field at times. Especially when he played the Chiefs. :cuss:

Pretty much.

I think htismaqe has been dead on with most of his assessment so far IMO.

It seemed to me Plummer had an al dente noodle for an arm compared to Cutler. If he found a gun against KC it was only once a year and if you think that's bad try having your team lose to a team whose HC is Goonther ****ing Cunningham. Christ how embarassing.

The thing is, it's not his job to evaluate talent at the NFL level. I"ts his job to evaluate prospects and teams looking at prospects. He has to try and predict where players will go and when. That's it. And with this, he does a pretty decent job.

Honestly, I can't remember far enough back to be able to answer that.

I think they've done just about everything they could have so far.

But he's inviting the further conversation, and how well his forecasts panned out by bringing the topic up and beating his chest about how right he was, while at the same time ignoring his own errors.

Jay Cutler

17-20 record as starter in NFL, 0 playoff wins
5-27 record as starter at Vanderbilt, 0 bowl appearances.

Yeah, Cutler is AWESOME!! But... but... he has a great arm!!!

****. This is Kiper. Meaning it's probably 180 degrees from reality.

I agree. He should stick to the draft evaluation only.

You are aware of Vandy's standing, athletically and academically, amongst the other SEC schools correct?

You are aware that a QB can't play defense correct?

Gonzalez played on the shittiest team in football last year; does that make him a bad TE?

You do know that Cutler is a Pro-Bowl QB correct?

This.

1998

It's stupid? Why because he knows McDaniels' play book and Cutler wouldn't have to learn a new system?

A patsy? Is that what a QB who knows his OC's system is? I think that's just a strange statement.

jay cutler sucks.

1978

And personally I'll take mental makeup over a 100 yard laser arm any day. Joe Montana was anything but a strong armed guy. Its accuracy and mental makeup that is everything in a QB.

Cutler has shown that he can win games. He is definitely a competitor. Vanderbilt won a lot games because of him. And the broncos have too. He does need to improve his attitude, but the guy does show up to work and trains hard and competes and wins games with his arm. how high was the broncos offense rated?

While last year was a good sign how can anyone realistically say they know what Cassel is going to become? The guy was less than a rookie last year because he hadn't played a game since HS. He may become the next Tom Brady or he may become the next Steve Bono. Who knows? :shrug:

One thing we do know is Cassel is not going to be a whinney bitch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ari Chi3fs View Post
Jay Cutler

17-20 record as starter in NFL, 0 playoff wins
5-27 record as starter at Vanderbilt, 0 bowl appearances.

Yeah, Cutler is AWESOME!! But... but... he has a great arm!!!


I agree. Cutler has played well. Using those stats is like saying Dan Marino sucked because he never won the superbowl. Fans like that are annoying.

And here's the most important part:So some of my buds on here need to chill with that "I'd rather have Cutler" shit.
And if Cutler is upside comparable to Stafford, I don't want Stafford either.

<!-- start podcast -->
<script language="Javascript" type="text/javascript"> var podplayer = new flashObj(); podplayer.flashFile = "http://assets.espn.go.com/swf/espnradio/09/audio_player_circular.swf"; podplayer.flashVars = "&soundLink=http://podloc.andohs.net/dloadTrack.mp3?prm=1920xhttp://query-origin.andohs.net/8000A6/content-root3.andomedia.com/origin/mp3/espnradio/firstdraft/firstdraft090310.mp3"; podplayer.width = "86"; podplayer.height = "70"; podplayer.scale = "noorder"; podplayer.salign="lt"; podplayer.wmode = "transparent"; podplayer.allowScriptAccess = "Always"; podplayer.allowNetworking = "All"; podplayer.DenyIEdl = "TRUE"; podplayer.FlashVer = 8; podplayer.cabVersion = "8,0,0,0"; podplayer.altTxt = ""; podplayer.ID = "flashPodcastSwf"; podplayer.render(tr</script>Somewhere in KC, a large and lonely sports writer sits weeping quietly.LMAO

Well, you just got done saying Cutler won a lot of games for Vanderbilt. Guess who is the annoying fan?

THE reason I prefer Sanchez over Stafford. The ONLY reason, actually. See below.

We have the ability to look back in hindsight on the entirety of Marino's career. We don't have that with Cutler yet. Furthermore, Marino won an AFC Championship, even if he never won it all. Cutler has yet to get there.

Everybody bitches about not wanting a "game manager". Well, what's the difference between Cutler and the proverbial "system QB"? The great QB's elevate their game mentally. Cutler hasn't yet proven he can do that.

Vanderbilt won 5 games while Cutler was there. Please.

Furthermore, offensive statistics don't win anything.

Let's be fair here. The Pro-Bowl is 100% unequivocally a popularity contest and really nothing more.

Take off the donkey goggles for a minute and look at reality:)

Yep! That arm can get better and better with the right training and coaching, but stand-up leader, mechanics that would make a T-2000 jealous, mastery of misdirection, and the ability to inspire and push your team effectively can't...be...bought.

Viva' la Revolution!

Stupid to piss off your franchise QB on a trade that didn't happen. Stupid to want a back-up QB over a Pro-Bowler. Cassell is a serviceable back up so long as he has a strong defense keeping the game close. Cassel would have to learn how to play with B-Marsh and Royal and the other WRs while Cutler is in sync with them.

Patsy=New England Patriot.

Very true. IMO, Cutler should've been at home watching Rivers play.

This.

How many playoffs Marino went to and how many playoff games won? Division titles?

Cutler 0

I thought that was brilliant!ROFL

Cassel = 11-5 and knows the system
Cutler = 8-8 and knows how to throw a hissy fit that would make a 2 year old proud

Yes, it's clear that only Cutler can get the job done in Denver.

:) Oh I'm sure you all did.
****ing McKid. He better show something early on or Bowlen could dump him for a coach that already has hair on his balls.

In fairness McKid and Xanders have put together a nice FA season. We'll see.

In the mean time by all means enjoy the turmoil in Bronco land.(IMHO the real problem is B-Marsh's almost sure suspension)

Now all we need is a defense.

The Patsy system is no secret. Cutler mastered Shanny's offense which is leaps and bounds more complex than the NE "use the TE as a third WR and work for YAC instead of long downfield strikes" offense. Both QBs can master the system, why choose the one with inferior physical skills who has no rapport with the WRs?

Yeah, I'm surprised it hasn't been talked about more.

The Cutler-McKid drama is soap opera stuff for the idiotic masses (Planet company excluded, of course).
B-Marsh and that psycho bitch of his have once again pinged the police radar and The Commish is sure to bring the hammer down.

:deevee:

Dance, FailAss; dance for us! :LOL:

Someone needs to let B-Marsh know that there are a LOT more fish in the sea. Sounds to me like this bitch has some kind of mojo working over him?

What do we expect this time? 4 to 8 games? This is what his fourth arrest IIRC...I really haven't paid too much attention.

Abso-frigging-lutely.