No to Conley.

That guy sucked even for a WR3.

The offense had Kelce wide open over the middle twice yesterday and Pat saw it but chose to "give the deep ball a chance".

Had he hit Kelce not only does the drive continue it might start opening up the deep ball.

Instead he wants to be stubborn and try to force shit for the sake of forcing it.

I don't mind the shots down field. The timing has been just a tick off.

I don't disagree that the safe play was to hit Kelce, but meh.

I mean...it was there if Hardman doesn't pull up. He was slightly off the Tyreek throw.

You're just looking for more reasons to shit on him because you have some reeruned theory that Mahomes can't play QB.

As 12+ yard pass with a lot of green behind the receiver is not a safe play..it's the best play.

He chose to try to hit Hardman 40+ yards down field in double coverage.

That isn't timing being off. That's Pat being stubborn.

It was not there. It was never there. And when your offense is struggling you don't force shit like that when you don't have too. We had a nice gainer on a wide open pass to Kelce.

I never said Pat can't play QB so get out with that shit. I said he is being stubborn and his own words seem to prove that out.

So you're not the guy who questioned if Mahomes is just a gimmick Qb who can only play backyard football?

Uh, slow that down there a bit, Pete.

If he doesn't right the ship that would be how it would play out, unfortunately.

I didn't question anything. I merely stated the facts. I know people here think Patrick is off-limits for criticism and everything is everyone else's fault but that's not how it works.

Big difference between criticism and saying he doesn't know how to be an NFL QB LMAO

just shut the **** up already. mvp, superbowl ring, multiple afc titles & title games. definitely not a "gimmick"



youre an absolute ****ing clown

Yeah, read what I said.

I think he is a legit QB but that goes up in smoke if he can't get his shit together.

"Well we are going to see if Mahomes is a legit NFL QB"

Come on, dude. Rewatch the 95, 97, 06, 2010, 2015, 2016 and 2017 playoff losses and tell me where Bono, Gannon, Grbac, Green, Cassel and Alex were more of an "NFL QB" than Patrick was. You've become so spoiled with Patrick's standard that you've completely forgetting the generation of QB play this franchise had before him.

It was a completely idiotic statement and no amount of rationalizing is going to take your "Is Pat a legit NFL QB" comment away.

The fact that he said this: "Well we are going to see if Mahomes is a legit NFL QB or a flash in the pan gimmick. I would think the former but if he can't make the adjustment then it is not good."

is all you really need to know about pete.

I would argue that Gannon was a gamer and we probably go to the Super Bowl had we played him instead of Grbac.

Patrick is definitely more talented than any of those guys and maybe most who have ever played the game. But he doesn't seem to have it between the ears right now and that's the scary part. I guess I see mental problems as more worrisome that a mechanical or physical problem.

****ing amazing. 3 Straight AFCCG's, 2 Straight SB's, League MVP, All Pro's, Pro Bowls etc and we're now questioning if he's "legit" QB all because of a 5 game slump.

how anyone , especially a "chiefs fan" as pete clams he is would say the jury is still out as to whether mahomes is a gimmick or not is mind bottling.


year 1, he plays the last game& wins..does great in pre-season: yes jury is still out


year 2: plays a full season, absolutely shreds the league, goes to afc championship game: maybe the jury is still out, because now teams know and have the tape from a full season


year 3 : shreds the league , wins a ring, teams have had 2 full off seasons to prep and still cant stop him. case closed


year 4 : wins another afc title despite years of tape now being seen and all eyes on him. case closed and locked away


year 5: struggling and having 1st rough patch...NO SORRY you do not get to re-open the case. its closed already.

Get outta here, Pete.

Guys with mechanical issues at QB rarely ever pan out at the NFL level. They can either throw the ball like an NFL QB or they can't. Yeah, there's a handful of exceptions but by an large, guys that don't throw the ball well don't make it.

And the mental issues have to be split in two.

Sure, mental issues coming out of college, for a guy that has never proven it at the NFL level, that's a BIG red flag.

However, we have 3 full seasons of Patrick Mahomes playing, not at a Pro Bowl level, not at an All Pro level, not even at an MVP level but at an historic HALL OF FAME level. He's broken over 50 records and some of them aren't even close.

He has the yips. They absolutely can, and will, go away at some point.

Right now he is getting outplayed by

Wilson
Stafford
Murray
Dak
Brady
Rodgers
Cousins
Burrow
Bridgewater
Wentz
Mayfield
Ryan
Allen
Carr
Jackson
Garropolo


Because he can't or won't adjust to the defenses he is seeing. Saying we will see of he is "legit" is admittedly over the top but the point is, if he can't or won't adjust to a shell defense then we got problems.

Oh I agree they can go away and I hope they do and think they will. But when I see him saying things like hits are taking him out of his rhythm or he just had to give the deep ball a chance it starts getting worrisome.

He had an incredible 3 years because he made throws no one else could, I agree. Teams have shut that down now. They aren't letting him run all over and sling the ball 50 yards downfield to elite speed receivers.

They are forcing him to play more ball control and thus far he hasn't been up to the challenge.

Never go full Petard.

Thanks for sharing. Andy backs his QB and I agree with them you have to take your shots.

He forced the ball for the sake of forcing it. Andy isn't going to bag on him publicly but when your offense has been a complete shit show I would think taking an easy 15-20 yard gain and keeping the chains moving would be the decision you would go with.

Teams have played to take away the deep threat and it's like we are just determined to show them they can't. Except they are and we aren't.

I counted 13 between the tackles, some not really in the pocket but not rolling out.

12 that were full on scrambling.

So I would say about 50/50 really.

Incredible throws from everywhere is what he does. But yes he can throw just fine from the pocket.

Patrick, not Andy.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I know it&#39;s 3rd-long, but you&#39;re up 2 scores in the 4th Q. Take your checkdown (the 4x1 formation actually messes up the coverage responsibilities, and the checkdown flat will probably convert the first anyway). <a href="https://t.co/45UzPIFOFz">pic.twitter.com/45UzPIFOFz</a></p>&mdash; Josh Cohen (@JCohen_NFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/JCohen_NFL/status/1457838179508269062?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 8, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

On the first one Kelce is still running if he throws it to him. Never mind Hardman was double covered from the start.

On the 2nd, the TE leaks out late and probably converts as he was left with a lot of green in front of him.

So a person in that tweet made a good point Both Hill and Hardman are stopping on their routes because they don't expect to get the ball when double covered.

They should keep running but that also says Patrick should be going elsewhere too....

On that first video (and I’m not privy to the options on that route), if Hardman just keeps sprinting, that’s 6.

Yes the middle was open, and it would have been a nice pickup, but holy **** I had no idea it was due to Hardman’s slowing down.

Remember when Hardman did that as a rookie out of camp and we all knew he'd learn to keep sprinting with Mahomes?

Yeah.

Those two plays are really frustrating. Easy first downs both times.

Not sure if the route is for Hardman to keep sprinting to the corner, but yeah that would have been nice too.

Hardman was double covered and probably thought there was no way he was getting the ball. Both him and Patrick are to blame there.

There were already 2 guys on Hardman and 3rd closing.

It was a bad decision by the QB. Plain and simple.

Why would a wide receiver ever give up on a play when Backyard Football Patrick is the QB?

The 2nd one is the more frustrating. The deep ball to Hardmand I believe was on 1st down.

The 2nd one was on 3rd and long in your own end. He has to hit that.

But when we did this short stuff....
Mecole got saved by the reps from a dipshit fumble
Two third down drops
Mecole almost lost a first down because of a dumbass shove at the end
Gordon doinked a first down off his hands

These are the types of mistakes that lost us games the first few weeks even when mahomes was up for the challenge and doing well playing this style of offense. This approach requires the supporting cast to not make mistakes and I don't think mahomes trusts them at all right now.

Yep. No excuses on the 2nd one. None. He had two open options and still went with the spot on the field that had blanket coverage.

Probably because Hardman knows if he is doubled then someone else isn't and the ball should probably go there????

I agree though you keep running your route regardless but just saying....

The pass to Hardman wasn't even a particularly well-thrown pass, almost an up-for-grabs throw. Or 'arm-punt,' if that makes you happy.

Meanwhile, Kelce was WIDE THE **** OPEN WITH SOME ROOM TO RUN.

Put another way: Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Steve Young, Joe Montana, heck, probably even Brett Favre throw to Kelce there. 100% of the time in that situation.

In the 2nd video, whoever that is that runs into the flat (Jerrick?) has the first down at the very least right there. If it was Mckinnon, he could've gone for 30+ yards if Pat gets him the ball early enough. There's no one in a GB uni anywhere near him. Closest defender looks like he's 12-15 yards from the receiver. And again, the pass downfield was poorly thrown, well behind the receiver. Never mind that Hill was just never open. Not for even a fraction of a second.

But the whole play design drags the entire defense off to the right side of the field. If Pat hits Jerrick right there, there's practically no one for GB in any kind of position to catch him. Put another way, if that was Damien Williams there, and Pat throws him the ball, that's practically a sure TD.

This is pressing in the worst way. Patrick needs to get his head/neck/shoulders out of his ass and take what the play-call and the defense seems so willing to give him.

Meh, on the 2nd one if he actually made a good throw it's picked off. The CB had great position.

I agree, I love Mahomes and wouldn't trade him for anyone else, but he isn't above criticism as some on here think...

TROOF

You have to wonder on that 3rd down play if he had decided he was going to Reek before the ball was even snapped? It's either that or he can't read a defense for shit or he didn't know where McKinnon was going to be or something.

I'd like to think it was he was going to Reek no matter what because the other reasons are not good.

Dan Marino, who like Mahomes took the NFL by storm immediately at the start of his career, began to experience his first significant career regression in his fourth season when he threw his then career high 23 INT’s in a season.

No matter how great you are, the league will catch-up and then you respond accordingly.

They know what he WANTS to do, and they take that away and make him do what he DOESN'T want to do.

And he hasn't been mature enough to adjust to that yet. It's that simple.

He will, it's just a matter of whether he's going to burn this year before he does or not.

That pass to Hardman I can see what he was looking at. Hardman had inside leverage and if would have kept going might have completed it.

The 2nd pass he definitely should have thrown it to Mckinnon in this situation. That was an easy 30 yd play at least.

Back to the first video you can see the coverage perfectly and maybe why we are struggling. 4 deep on 2 WR's, a CB on Kelce, and a spy watching Mahomes. When Mahomes was about to throw the CB was breaking on Kelce though he could have easily hit him earlier.

It only messed with us because Patrick chose not to take the 15+ yard gain they were giving us with Kelce.

The defense isn't messing with us. Patrick is being stubborn.

On that second pass, he may have struggled to see McKinnon over gigantic Orlando Brown.

This is one disadvantage of standing still in the pocket. If something is blocking your view you might miss what's behind it.

Maybe there is room for Mahomes to move around enough to get his vision, but w/o backpeddling into danger.

I signed up for GamePass trial and yesterday's game isn't up for All-22 yet so I have been watching the Giants game.

This is the 4th play on the opening drive. First who designs a play where Pringle and Kelce are right on top of each other and there is 6 defenders vs 3.

That's extremely poor route combination design or someone ran the wrong route.

So here is Mahomes scrambling because literally no one is open. Maybe Hardman could break to the back pylon...

Patrick is not turning into a dump off QB no matter how much they try to make him that way.

Andy should have kept calling plays like we have in the past instead of trying to neuter this offense and our QB.

The slump starts with Andy. There is zero rhythm in the play calling. Our receivers were all graded poorly yesterday and the running game sucked when we needed it.

Need either more pics in sequence or the actual clip. Hard to tell what's really going on here. But based on just the pic, I'd agree with you, everyone is covered.

They were all day. I was at the game with a great view of the field. Kelce was off, dropped passes. Mecole dropped a HUGE pass and had a fumble. Gordon did nothing, Pringle and DROB ran right into coverage every play.

Chiefs need to play their game- the offense that won the SB- and stop bowing down to this "take what the defenses give you shit". It is just not Mahome's style to dump off 25 times a game.

You don't take a Ferrari and make it into a mini van.

He dumped it to Williams

Here near the endzone Mahomes just throws it in the dirt. You can see why

Josh Allen can admit when he sucks, Prescott the same...when can Pat admit he missed some throws and its not all penalties and turnovers? Maybe its just not in his makeup?

He literally ate a metric ****ton of shit after Tennessee. LMAO

do you have that clip? I bet it was a Jethro sized bowl

I think I went fishing that day, so I missed most of that game.

here's the thing though:

If Pat takes those short shots to kelce and/or whoever repeatedly for first downs, and doesn't turn the ball over inside the RZ so we score and score TDs, the defense will eventually have to bring a safety down, which would open up things downfield, right? We'll skip the run game argument for now, as we don't really have a RB1 right now and no one is scared of any of our RBs this season.

But if we're picking up 1st downs all the way down the field AND scoring TDs, no DC will keep both of his safeties high forever. They'll have to change things up, so Pat should be taking those short shots over the middle instead of trying to force things downfield every three plays.

Think about it: if Pat hits Jerrick on that one play, that's a 1st down at least, 20 yards at least, and we're out of the shadow of our posts and have a legit shot at burning down the clock. Instead w take three consecutive shots down the field for no gain and no time off the clock.

It's not a sustainable way to play football.

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Are you some kind of Patriots-turned-Bucs fan ****tard?

Teams are playing this way against explosive offenses across the league. It gave the Rams problems and the Bills

They’re gonna do it til you beat it

Mahomes is playing like absolute shit right now.

But if anyone here thinks a guy with a 3 year track record of being the best quarterback in the league won't figure it out sometime in the next 8 games plus the playoffs then I don't know what to tell you.

It's a matter of when, not if he gets it going. And when he does we instantly are the most dangerous team in the league again.

Brady is the dump off king. Nobody hits the RB in the flat like Brady. His ability to read D's pre-snap is elite.

I've been waiting to see Mahomes step up in this department. It's not necessarily being a check down QB. It's being efficient by extending drives by being a first down QB. It's not like Mahomes can't do it at all. KC has several long drive TD's this year. (The first series against GB was awesome!) We just need a lot more consistency.

In a nut shell keep that defense on the field and they will wear down. The big plays will come!

He also was able to throw the intermediate stuff very well. And he was able to look off defenders. Lots of things that he's struggling with right now. He's just in a slump. He will be fine. So stfu!

No but thanks

This is really dumb. They're literally leaving EVERYTHING else open EXCEPT the deep ball, and you think they should keep firing the deep ball. Into double coverage. While Patrick gets crushed by the pass rush. Bad idea.

Run the ball and hit the outlet passes, eat them alive, death by a thousand cuts until they start cheating up. Then you can hit the deep ball some.

Patrick hasn't been mature enough, or patient enough to hit these short and intermediate throws. The tape doesn't lie; they're there. They're open. He's just being stubborn.

exactly, Brady would take those those outlet passes all day long until boom

Here is a 2nd quarter play where Pat should have let it rip to Hill. He ended up scrambling right and throwing it out of bounds. Hill was plenty open going across the field.

One thing I am noticing is Kelce is getting mugged alot.

Mahomes will never be Alex Smith.

But until he can make defenses pay for basically leaving everything open EXCEPT the deep ball, he doesn't get to do Mahomes things. He needs to learn to be patient, and be a little more mature about taking what's available. And the Chiefs need to make a real commitment to running the ball too. It's that simple. It's not complicated. It's a defense that's been around for decades. It just plays against this new breed of young QB's tendencies, and until they grow up, they're not going to stop running it.

Mahomes isn't getting the help from YAC or help from the refs that he's got in seasons past. A throw that was 6 yards and 40 more for a TD in the past seem to be 6 yards and tackled immediately the last few weeks. 3rd and 7 incompletions last year we got a ton of def holding and PI. This year they just turn into punts and fgs.

Here is a bad decision. Everyone is at least double covered except for Hardman standing over there by himself. He throws it Hill for the long ball incomplete.

Did you guys fix this piece of shit yet?

Such hyperbole- I didn't say any of this. Pat did throw it short last week- check his targets-lots behind the line because that is what the defense gave him.

He threw short this week too- and Kelce along with Mecole dropped the ball.

My point was- you don't take the most dynamic QB in history and try to make him Alex Smith. We had that kind of QB and he sucked.

15 to 20 play drives are Not sustainable. Chiefs need to play their game and force the defense to change, not the other way around.

When the game was on the line- we won because Mahomes did what he does. Alex would have checked down short, punted and hoped to hang on.

maybe thats whats up until he figures it out and comes out of his funk

This is what every radio sports guy keeps repeating. Except it is not that easy. 1 dropped pass, 1 bad run, a holding penalty, then we are forced to take those middle-of-the-field chances where the defenses are waiting.

Andy is so dammed predictable-that is the problem. When the running back gets 7 yards on 1st down, he calls deep shots instead of keeping running until they stop us. His gadget plays have been embarrassing. The NFL has caught up with Andy not Mahomes.

Mahomes is getting 95% of the blame and the rest of the shitty offense, play calling, dropped passes, bonehead receivers not doing shit, dumb penalties at crucial times--are all getting a pass.

Mahomes is stepping up and putting it all on his shoulders. That is what leadership is about.

So yeah, until the rest of the team stops handing the other team INT's, fumbles and easy coverage assignments- it is going to be tough going for Mahomes.

Yeah man the receivers and the tackles are totally getting a pass right now. No one's talking about them at all. Totally.

You're literally saying exactly this.

The reason an 'Alex Smith' sucked is because he wouldn't take the deep shot when it was there. That will never be a problem with Mahomes. But the deep shot is NOT there, and he's throwing it anyway, when there are receivers open short with a lot of green in front. It happens multiple times a game now.

Defenses know he wants to chuck it deep so bad he will do it no matter what. You have to make them pay for that.

I enjoy watching this team bounce back from adversity and make people like you look foolish that's what I enjoy.


I've said it before and I'll say it again under Andy Reid this is a resilient team and 2015 we were 1-5 and all but calculated out of the playoffs but we wheeled off 10 wins and a playoff win. **** you cry babies.