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-   -   Movies and TV Val Kilmer RIP (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=357684)

Garcia Bronco 04-03-2025 12:10 PM

Tombstone is the most entertaining but the Wyatt Earp movie is the better film.

Frazod 04-03-2025 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco (Post 18018638)
Tombstone is the most entertaining but the Wyatt Earp movie is the better film.

I never have an issue watching either one. But I completely agree with your assessment. They are very different films for covering much of the same ground, but when actual people/events are portrayed, I tend to prefer stories that stick closer to the truth.

Tombstone is a straight up action movie, while Wyatt Earp is a far more accurate character study. Wyatt and Doc were not nice, likeable guys. Kostner's cranky, sullen Earp is far more grounded in reality. Wyatt simply lived long enough to create his own legend while hobnobbing with early Hollywood western stars. And while everybody (including me) loves Kilmer's Doc, Quaid plays him as he was - a bitter, angry, terminally ill alcoholic. Quaid even looks the part - people calling Kilmer "skinny" didn't make him thin.

The main area where Wyatt Earp suffers is the lack of a strong villain - there simply aren't any. Curly Bill is nothing more than a background character and Johnny Ringo is only seen when Doc shoots him and doesn't even have a line a dialogue. Obviously Boothe, Biehn and Lang put Tombstone way over the top in the antagonist department. Tombstone in general has a far superior supporting cast.

scho63 04-03-2025 02:33 PM

I don't remember any recent stories about his health taking a turn for the worse.

He went through a lot of shit. Sad at 65

Pennywise 04-03-2025 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco (Post 18018638)
Tombstone is the most entertaining but the Wyatt Earp movie is the better film.

Kilmer is also in Commanche Moon as Inesh Skull. It's the prequel to Lonesome Dove and he's great.

Bowser 04-03-2025 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pennywise (Post 18018875)
Kilmer is also in Commanche Moon as Inesh Skull. It's the prequel to Lonesome Dove and he's great.

I enjoyed Thunderheart back in the day, as well.

Frazod 04-03-2025 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 18018917)
I enjoyed Thunderheart back in the day, as well.

I love that movie. Kilmer and Graham Greene made a great team.

Garcia Bronco 04-03-2025 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 18018860)
I never have an issue watching either one. But I completely agree with your assessment. They are very different films for covering much of the same ground, but when actual people/events are portrayed, I tend to prefer stories that stick closer to the truth.

Tombstone is a straight up action movie, while Wyatt Earp is a far more accurate character study. Wyatt and Doc were not nice, likeable guys. Kostner's cranky, sullen Earp is far more grounded in reality. Wyatt simply lived long enough to create his own legend while hobnobbing with early Hollywood western stars. And while everybody (including me) loves Kilmer's Doc, Quaid plays him as he was - a bitter, angry, terminally ill alcoholic. Quaid even looks the part - people calling Kilmer "skinny" didn't make him thin.

The main area where Wyatt Earp suffers is the lack of a strong villain - there simply aren't any. Curly Bill is nothing more than a background character and Johnny Ringo is only seen when Doc shoots him and doesn't even have a line a dialogue. Obviously Boothe, Biehn and Lang put Tombstone way over the top in the antagonist department. Tombstone in general has a far superior supporting cast.

I agree. I like both. The scope of Wyatt Earp is much bigger too, it's not a film largely about the villains per se and the Cochise County War. I love the end scene with the lynch mob. I believe in actual events that Johnny Ringo organized that lynch mob (which is loosely depicted Tombstone in the turn your head a canoe scene).

Garcia Bronco 04-03-2025 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 18018917)
I enjoyed Thunderheart back in the day, as well.

I don't think much has changed in Reservation life.

Frazod 04-03-2025 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco (Post 18018957)
I don't think much has changed in Reservation life.

I've been there. It's just as nasty as portrayed in the movie. Right up there with the west side of Chicago and rural Mississippi.

Deberg_1990 04-03-2025 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 18018860)
I never have an issue watching either one. But I completely agree with your assessment. They are very different films for covering much of the same ground, but when actual people/events are portrayed, I tend to prefer stories that stick closer to the truth.

Tombstone is a straight up action movie, while Wyatt Earp is a far more accurate character study. Wyatt and Doc were not nice, likeable guys. Kostner's cranky, sullen Earp is far more grounded in reality. Wyatt simply lived long enough to create his own legend while hobnobbing with early Hollywood western stars. And while everybody (including me) loves Kilmer's Doc, Quaid plays him as he was - a bitter, angry, terminally ill alcoholic. Quaid even looks the part - people calling Kilmer "skinny" didn't make him thin.

The main area where Wyatt Earp suffers is the lack of a strong villain - there simply aren't any. Curly Bill is nothing more than a background character and Johnny Ringo is only seen when Doc shoots him and doesn't even have a line a dialogue. Obviously Boothe, Biehn and Lang put Tombstone way over the top in the antagonist department. Tombstone in general has a far superior supporting cast.

Tombstone is more pulpy and fun.

Wyatt Warp is more downbeat.


They are both entertaining in their own way.

Deberg_1990 04-03-2025 05:02 PM

Forgot he did the Saint remake. That was a better than decent mid 90s action flick.

Stryker 04-03-2025 06:10 PM

R.I.P Val you will be missed.

Top Gun movies
Heat
Batman & Robin
Real Genius
The Doors
Top Secret
Tombstone

Tombstone Doc Holliday and Johnny Ringo

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tredadda 04-03-2025 07:13 PM

No love for Willow I see.

Frazod 04-03-2025 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tredadda (Post 18019159)
No love for Willow I see.

I really, really disliked that movie. It being a shameless, almost point-for-point ripoff of Star Wars, with a dwarf Luke and Kilmer as Han Solo, and a baby being carried instead of Death Star plans. At least Lucas ripped himself off.

I was in my 20s when I saw it. Perhaps I would have enjoyed it more had I seen it as a child, but instead I just left the theater angry.

tredadda 04-03-2025 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 18019186)
I really, really disliked that movie. It being a shameless, almost point-for-point ripoff of Star Wars, with a dwarf Luke and Kilmer as Han Solo, and a baby being carried instead of Death Star plans. At least Lucas ripped himself off.

I was in my 20s when I saw it. Perhaps I would have enjoyed it more had I seen it as a child, but instead I just left the theater angry.

I get it, but Kilmer was still very good in it.


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