When we have glaring needs at basically both DE positions and at CB? Yeah, it would be dumb.

I’m not necessarily advocating for a trade, but they can do that and still have 3 picks in the top 62 for those needs.

And they are also going to add a couple more free agents like Bradberry/Gilmore and Ingram.

They will have more flexibility than people are giving them credit for to pull of a trade up or 2.

And they will trade up at some point in the first 2 days. It’s just a matter of when.

Stay put and take Jahan Dotson and best available defensive player to drop. Take Robert Metchie with the late 2nd round pick and Mahomes will have some quality receivers to keep teams guessing. Dotson has sure hands, speed, and is an excellent route runner and he should be there at pick 29.

Edge rusher, Wide Receiver, Cornerback.

Whoever is the most badass player from those 3 positions should be what they go for. If they get a mediocre DE because that's the need but they could have got a pro bowl corner/wide receiver, that's a fail. Go for BPA from those positions. If they all equal value, prioritize DE, WR and then CB IMO.

This is where I’m at. I think they’d like to trade up for a DE but I’m skeptical the board will play out that way. If they end up trading up for a WR, I’ll say in advance it’s probably the wrong thing to do but if it looks like they’re being aggressive to get the guy they want rather than acting as a panic move, I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t excited for Mahomes to have an elite rookie WR as an option.

Gonna be one really interesting draft. There’s no running or hiding for Veach here.

As I’ve said before, I have no problem with them reading up for a WR, but they HAVE to be right.

It’s really that simple.

Ideally, if they trade up, it’s for an EDGE.

FWIW Deebo unfollowed 49ers Instagram page.

Yeah, but you can probably say the same thing if we don't trade up. I know more picks give you more wiggle room, but a straight bust at any 1-3 round draft slot is going to be a bitter pill to swallow regardless of what moves are made.

It's go time for the personnel department. There isn't much slack either way.

Paging Brandon Vasher!!!!

I’d love him in KC and he’s the kind of FA I could see Veach making a move for (age, production and still unrealized upside) but I’d rather us keep the pick and draft a guy like Skyy, Austin or Dotson to help balance the cap while adding a young playmaker on a rookie contract.

Deebo would be a monster in this offense, though.

I realise he'll be gone earlier but in the unlikely scenario he falls to 20 i can't see why people are so dead set against it. I'm completely unconvinced Karlaftis or Jermaine Johnson are more impactful players, or at least not so much more i'd totally disregard Wiliams.

It's not so much that they're more impactful players. It's that we can find substitutes at WR who might give us 2/3 of the his production while at DE those substitutes only replicate 1/2 of the production.

Our DL was the highest paid in the NFL last year and one of the absolute worst. Veach tagged it as the main issue to address this offseason and the only thing we've done is resign the guy all of us were convinced would be off the team. The team would benefit hugely from a year one impact player at that position and unfortunately it's harder to find those guys beyond 20 in the first round.

That's just not the case with WR as we've seen time and time again. Not to mention the fact that Mahomes should all else equal be able to elevate the production of any individual WR while the current personnel on our DL probably do the exact opposite for any individual DE.

Because he is hurt.

Because there's not a ton of separation amongst the top 6-8 WR's.

I could go on but let's not pretend that Williams is some can't miss prospect.

And I'll be perfectly honest here:

I was against trading up for Williams from the beginning. But the constant salivating over him and some of the ridiculous trade up scenarios just strengthened my resolve.

I'm just sick of hearing about Jameson Williams. It's like Aaron Curry all over again.

Deebo would be the best case scenario with this offense.

Wasn't he the 3rd best at Ohio State (which is why he transferred to 'Bama)? And isn't Njigba even better than both seniors? I am in the camp of "only trade up if you can get J Johnson or equivalent" if he should happen to slide, which I don't expect. WRs can produce in a number of ways besides speed: length and high-pointing, route running, communications with the QB, having great hands. If the "Avg plays per TD" goes from 7 to 9, does it matter? It's still 7. If a 6'5" receiver comes down with a long pass in double coverage, is it worse than a 5'8" receiver breaking a tackle on a crossing route and going to the house? It will look different than we are used to, but it will still be good enough to win a SB (Brady 2020) with a stout, fast D that has no gaping holes.

I'd rather take Pickens at 30 than trade up for anything but an edge.

Don't hate that, but I'd rather have Watson at 50 than Pickens at 30!

Don’t they HAVE to be right regardless of who they trade up for, edge or WR?

If they don't trade up? In theory...yes. But it's magnified more if they trade up and miss because they've given up more chances at being right.

Christian Watson?

Deebo would require a contract like Tyreek just got

Yea, but I think we all will be more patient in terms of development with the EDGE, because that’s our top need and the position we all want if we do trade up.

There will be more pressure if it’s a WR.

No, Tom Watson.

He's old, but he's can still find seams in a zone with the best of them.

I'm in!

It IS kind of funny that in a post where we talk about Jameson Williams "not being able to beat out" guys at Ohio State...

That we then advocate trading up for Jermaine Johnson II.

You're aware of WHY he was at Florida State, right? It's because he "Couldn't beat out guys at Georgia" for a more prominent role.

But Johnson is healthy and in a position of greater need!

Hell no, Emma Watson. I'm trying out for Right Broomstick.

Agree! Whoever they trade up for has to be week#1 starter....anything less would be detrimental to our needs!

He had 5 sacks in 2020...his last year at Georgia.

Williams had 152 yards and 2 TDs his last year at Ohio State.

They also had Jermaine listed as a LB and playing at 240 lbs. So he may have transferred because they were playing him out of position.

Joe Burrow transferred from Ohio State too... shit happens.

Yeah, I know. My main point is ... I don't find the "but he transferred because..." element to be particularly meaningful in any of these instances. I think it's a weak thing to use against Jameson Williams (as someone who does not advocate drafting him unless he falls to you at 29 or 30).

Sometimes coaches are dumb. Sometimes the system dictates their college production to a certain degree. Etc.

Your board is going to be Hella empty before long if you get cold feet over transfers.

How about both? sandwiched along with two D-linemen? I think we'd be in real good shape.

All fair, and I think you and I agree: Don't trade up, but if you do, it better be because a Top 5-6 DE or Jameson oddly slid to the early 20s (knee concerns?). I'm not anti Jameson, but I just don't like the idea of giving up another 1st because they think Hill is irreplaceable by someone that runs over a 4.3!

Not afraid of that at all...in many mocks I did, I took a sliding Ojabo at 29, Hill, Wyatt, or Watson at 30, and Ebikitie or Mafe at 50. I don't think Wyatt drops to 29/30, but when he did, I took him and then Thomas or Ebiketie at 62. I'm all for rebuilding the D and taking a shot at a falling WR at 62 or in the 3rd. I'm so god damned tired of seeing a sorry cast of strip-club bouncers out there giving up 5-play TD drives after the O does something spectacular. TIME TO BUILD A TOP 10 D...and it will likely take all the picks we have to do it.

Joe Burrow couldnt find the field at Ohio State. Entirely possible the Buckeye coaching staff are morons/play the higher recruited player/college different from NFL etc...

Don’t forget safety. That position needed help before losing starters.
People have been screaming for Sorenson’s replacement for a couple years. Losing honey badger on top of that should make it a priority.

DE
CB
S
DT
LB

WR
RB
TE
OL

Oh WOW I just realized it was Urban Meyer that kept Burrow on the bench at Ohio St. Makes you wonder what other kind of terrible personnel decisions he made over there. Although, I think he left before Williams's year there.

Of course, and let's not pretend Jermaine Johnson is a sure hit either. I mean we can say this about everyone outside of the top 10 probably and maybe some within it.

Giving Mahomes another weapon is never the wrong thing to do. If the Chiefs feel Williams is the guy and want to go get him, then they should be commended for that. We have 12 goddamn picks, and the offseason and player acquisition doesn't stop after the draft. Everyone acting like moving up in the draft is going to stop the Chiefs from filling voids. It won't.

The philosophy shift on Chiefsplanet this season makes me sick to my stomach.

Bunch of ****ing Packer fans this season, i swear. "Hey lets just give him MVS! Mahomes will turn shit into salad!"

After all these years ya'll haven't figured out that that's a bullshit strategy. 1 SB win for Rodgers hasn't fleshed that out for you guys?

What happened to, "keep loading up on weapons?"

All of a sudden that turned into, "lets sign a bunch ob B/C tier guys and depend on Mahomes to be even MORE special".

All because Tyreek got traded and ya'll got scared of WR contracts. FML.

Sure....and you also can't act like Jameson Williams is the only WR in the draft.

I agree. We can get a high-ceiling weapon AND still massively improve this defence. I'm not sure why people think we're bust if we don't get a Jermaine Johnson. I don't mind the "we have lots of holes, let's keep all the picks" argument. But I'm less keen on the "I'm only moving up for a DE" position.

Keep the picks. Load up.

Wait, he isn't?

Again, if the Chiefs feel he's their guy, and that he's 1 of 3 top blue chip prospects at that position, then what's the problem with trading up 10 spots?

Jameson ain't the only WR in the draft, but lets also not act like every receiver is as good or better. There's a reason he's the consensus #1 talent.

You keep saying he’s the consensus #1 and he’s not.

Are you smoking crack? Trading up for a WR is ****ing stupid. Mahomes is a bad ass and doesn't need us to do that. What he needs is a ****ing defense. A ****ing pass rush to help him win.

He is.

The majority. Obviously there will be people here and there that disagree, but the majority of pundits have him as the top WR talent. Not the 1st off the board due to injury of course, but the top talent.

And if the Chiefs view him as such, then go get him.

Horse shit.

Yes, the Aaron Rodgers/Packers strategy.

"We have an MVP QB! He'll just turn shit into salad every year!"

Kiper, McShay and Brugler all have Wilson as their #1 WR.

Exactly who is this majority that you’re talking about?

2-3 seasons ago we talked about always keeping the offense loaded with talent. To NOT be like the Packers. To not do what other teams do and just expect your QB to make his receivers better all the time, but to instead give him blue chip talent that can take advantage of his talents and at time prop HIM up.

We won a SB with the "Legion of Zoom". Spent money on WR that was deemed a "Luxury" at the time, but people understood WHY. Because we were all on the same page in staying aggressive, and giving our MVP the best tools possible to work with.

My, my how that has quickly fallen.

Not me though. My philosophy aint shifting off that.

It was the right philosophy then, it's the right one now, and it will be the right one every season thereafter.

They have him as their #1 drafted. Because Williams is coming off injury.

I think there’s a middle ground here.

I don’t think we have to trade up for a Jameson Williams, though I’d be fine with it.

But you also can’t go full O.City and not take a WR until the 3rd round.

Make no mistake about it, WR is as big of a need as any position outside of EDGE.

Chiefs fans: Mahomes needs help.

Also Chiefs Fans: So lets get him some average to slightly above average help. Mahomes will just have to work a little harder compared to when he had Hill and Watkins etc.

I don't think a trade up is necessary, but we sure as hell better find a top tier offensive weapon over the next 1-2 drafts. No Tyreek, Kelce probably has 2 years left as an elite weapon, maybe 3 tops. We all know a rookie isn't coming into this system and lighting it up year 1, so that means someone needs to get in here sooner rather than later.

And people can say "Tom Brady had years where he had no high end targets", but he also had a top 5-10 defense nearly every year and defensive mastermind Belichick. I don't see that happening here, so it's imperative that we maintain a continual flow of quality receivers here, whether that be in the form of WR, TE, or pass catching RBs.

Long story short, doesn't have to be a trade up in the draft or an expensive FA but they better get it right.

No. Go look at their actual rankings. Wilson is ranked #1.

There doesn't HAVE to be a trade up. If they like someone that they think will fall to them as much as they like the top 3 prospects, GREAT!

But if they feel they need to trade up, i sure as **** ain't scoffing. I'm celebrating.

They aren’t going to ignore the position either way.

They have a ton of draft capital. I don’t understand why some people (not you or anybody specific except for O.Shitty) talk about it like it’s not a need, or that they can’t afford to take one early.

Williams won’t be there at 29.

Good chance that if he’s there at 20, we’re moving up.

Fully on board with this line of thinking. Have too many needs beyond WR and DE, both for starters and depth, to trade multiple picks for a single player that isn't guaranteed to be a hit. Spread the wealth around on multiple players and increase your chances on finding multiple starting caliber players. Don't reach, but if we get to the late 3rd and a WR and DE haven't been taken then something probably went wrong.

I don’t think you understood the point.

I didn’t mean that we can get him at 29/30.

Yeah?

Where?

Not on Oline.

RB has enough depth and talent to not need anything more than a mid-round flier.

WR lacks a true #1

TE is set, and there's talent behind him worth developing.



DE is an obvious need.

DT is fine.

LB is in a pretty good spot.

S is fine. Don't NEED one per se.

CB is lacking a starter, but mostly its lacking depth. And of course adding a new starter would address the depth.

Need, in order is probably something like:

DE
CB
WR

Those are the only 3 positions where we could reasonably expect to draft a starter. Everything else will be depth for the upcoming season.

Agree to disagree, I guess?

DT is definitely a need. Jones and Wharton are the only ones here next year and Jones has a $29M cap hit. He could just as easily be moved next offseason like Hill.

And I'm not arguing that WR isn't a need because it definitely is. I just don't think that spending multiple draft picks to move up for a WR with a torn ACL is the best use of what we have.

For this season DT isn't a need, thus any DT taken (unless it's a 1st round pick) will likely be a depth or rotational player. I'm not saying they shouldn't draft one for depth/future/rotation etc, i'm saying there isn't really a need for a starter this season.

Again, there's only so many starting spots available. Jones, Wharton, Nnadi, Stallworth is a fine group to start the season with. Surely they'll add another guy or two into that, but it's not a group that stands out as, "Oh we're ****ed" if the season started tomorrow.

A quick Google search shows that he is not "clearly" or a "consensus" #1 WR in the draft. Many people rank Garrett Wilson above him. And even London is ranked higher than Williams on several places I have seen.

I will defiantly agree that he is top 5 WR in the draft even go with top 3. Mahomes doesn't need the fastest WR in the NFL to be deadly... he needs some WRs that will catch the damn ball and not need perfect throws to do it.

This is just my opinion.

I don't define need as just a "starter".

Yes, need DE. Actually need multiple DEs.

Need WR, multiple WRs for beyond 2022.

DT could use some additional talent. Not much here long term and Jones is too expensive, need alternatives in case they decide to move on from him.

Need CB, not necessarily a starter but IMO need more than the usual 4th-5th round pick we usually invest here.

Need S. Thornhill is a FA next year and we use 3 safeties a lot of the time, we have little depth here.

Might need a RT, although not sure about that one. Still could use some decent OT depth if the right opportunity presents itself.

RB isn't necessarily a pressing NEED, but could use some more competition here.


When you have as few players as KC has under contract you absolutely have multiple needs, both this season and long term.

You could draft Travis Jones in the 2nd and he would start over Nnadi.

Is it a glaring need over DE? **** no.

Sure, if that's the route they decide to go. They don't HAVE to, is all i'm saying.

Sure. Just like they don't HAVE to trade up for a WR.

I HAVE to take a shit

Here is my main issue with the whole thing. A majority of Chiefs fans, either on here...or Twitter...or wherever are in this mindset that it's either WR in the first or the draft is an F and Veach has failed.

That's ****ing stupid as shit. The idea that trading up into the 10-15 range at whatever cost to draft Jameson Williams is the only way this draft is a success is shortsighted and stupid.

Does that mean that it can't happen? No. Does that mean that I think Veach is an idiot if he does it? No. I'll always have the thought that we could have better utilized the resources that we had in other ways. But I'll understand why they did it.

The difference is that if it happens....I'll understand. If the Chiefs, however, choose to not take a WR in the first round....a majority of fans are going to lose their collective minds. They're in the WR in the 1st or bust category and that thinking is how you get Breeland Speaks on your team.

They don't understand that there might be 5-6 WRs slotted to go in the first round but 3 of those WRs might not fit your scheme. One might be off their board because of medicals or off the field shit. So if you only have 2 WRs as first round grades and they go well before you're up....it's not just reach on a WR that's next on your list because you need one.

They don't. But if they do, i won't sit here and call it waste of draft capital either. I'm not going to sit here and vehemently argue against it like what's been happening around here these last two weeks.

Giving Mahomes blue chip weapons has never been, and never will be a bad strategy. Matter of fact, it's a strategy i fully embrace and I hope Veach sticks to his word, as it's what he said he'd do several seasons ago.

If they do, I won't call it a waste of draft capital either.

You do realize the ONLY reason it's a discussion is because the draft isn't for 3 more weeks and there's not one other god damn thing to talk about right?

I'm right there with you. I might not be happy with what they gave up but I also realized along time ago that the Chiefs don't give a **** what I want when it comes to the draft. Right or wrong...my opinion holds no weight.

The only reason I'm bringing this up is because of the people screaming "give up whatever to trade up for Jameson Williams". He's not the only WR in the draft.

It entirely possible (for some of us, at least) to talk about good and bad ideas without getting into whether we like it or hate it.

I won't HATE anything they do. That still doesn't make whatever they do a good move.

Oh for sure.

The draft is going break the way it breaks and the Chiefs will respond accordingly. As i said a day or two ago, you don't take a WR just to take one and i do not believe the Chiefs would do that anyway.

Seems like we're both arguing from opposite extremes here.

While your concern is regarding these hard line, "MUST" take a WR in the 1st guys, my argument is against all this silly talk about how drafting one in the 1st, or trading up is a waste of resources because Mahomes is some miracle man that will make shitty WR's good.

That's such a ridiculous line of thinking.

The Chiefs already put so much on Mahomes, and that won't ever change. He's the goddamn franchise QB.

It's seems silly to me to say, "well, we're going to put everything on Mahomes and give him LESS to work with" Dafuq?

If we're going to be a team built around Mahomes, (we are) then we should be throwing as many resources at him to help him be the best Mahomes he can be.

This whole, "we don't need to spend draft capital on a blue chip WR" is completely counter to what's made the Chiefs and Mahomes so successful all these years, and it's what's held GB and Rodgers back.

You're right, the Chiefs don't HAVE to draft a WR in the 1st. But if they do, and even if they have to trade up to do it, it's certainly not a waste. It's not something they should be looking to avoid just because we have Mahomes, like a WR is a goddamn 1st round RB or something.

It's not a waste of resources. It's building upon your strength.

Actually don't disagree with any of this really.

My argument against trading up is almost exclusively against Jameson Williams and it has nothing to do with whether or not we NEED to draft a WR. It's that there's a half dozen guys all jammed into the same group and people want to target a player out of that group that probably won't even play to start the season.

No matter how you slice it, that IS a waste of resources, at least in the immediate term.

That being said, it's also not going to piss me off. NOTHING they could do will piss me off.

I don't think the Chiefs are looking at Mahomes and telling him to go succeed with absolute shit at WR. I think they're changing directions away from this need to have a top 3 WR on the team. It's more of a..."we're going to surround you with a multitude of weapons" and then tailor fit the offensive scheme to that.

Hill and Kelce were awesome but when you have literal shit behind them...it becomes easy to figure out how to stop that offense. And teams did that last year. Now they've transitioned to Kelce and Juju in the short to intermediate areas, Hardman as the gadget and MVS as the deep threat.

Even if they draft a WR in the first round....they aren't getting some magical WR1 that is going to come in and hog targets. I'm assuming they have an idea of a WR that they can fit into a role for the first year and then expand that moving forward in their career.