No, it's what I expected. Just neat to have Reid say the quiet part out loud.

Nope, you're stuck with Jawaan Taylor for one more year.

Anyone have a handle on his character issues? Bert breer on Boston tv said he would have gambled on Simmons in the second but that Vrabel pulled him aside at either the combine or his pro day ( can’t recall which ) and had a heart to heart . Not clear if he was cussing out Simmons or reading him the riot act . A lot of nonspecific chatter on character and work ethic

So see you later today at 5pm CDT then, looking forward to it

Vrabel is a reeeeeal try hard rah rah shit head, that's why they picked ****ing Campbell when Jeanty was sitting right there. Idiots.

ROFL

You should start a thread about it!

(And you said the same thing a couple years ago and here you are again... You know you love it.)

He can be on the bench for all I care

Oh brother. LMAO

LMAO
Are you really this butthurt over this? This all seems pretty childish, but you do you.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">GOOD MORNING ������<br><br>Our newest tackle tallied 33 bench press reps, tying the combine record this year. <a href="https://t.co/jugjX7PC71">pic.twitter.com/jugjX7PC71</a></p>&mdash; Kansas City Chiefs (@Chiefs) <a href="https://twitter.com/Chiefs/status/1915766496929730692?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 25, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Yeah, I don't get the hand wringing, because if we can absorb the complete failure of CEH as a first round back, and the failure of FAU for 2 years at a position of need, then we can take a chance on a guy who has potential top 15 talent.

I don't follow what most posters say about FAU, but I wonder if the same people insisting he isn't a bust, are the same people upset about this pick.

If he’s benching that much the knee must be fine.

Agree that vrabel is an old school hardo but I think Campbell was a need pick so as not to get Maye murdered ( sound familiar) . Heard lots of character/ maturity stuff on Simmons but zero specifics . Anyone hear anything concrete ?

My dude. Your insight is much appreciated.

It’s very similar to purchasing chiefs playoff tickets pre Mahomes.

OT4 might be too high for him.

Dunno what the folks that are reaming Veach and co are expecting. It's one thing to disagree with the pick and be concerned over his medicals (which I do and I am) while citing studies about it. But to have these temper tantrums and call Veach and Burkholder idiots while they've actually worked with Simmons and actually have in depth medicals is something else entirely.

Trey Smith paid off, big time.

They used the same strategy here, but the medicals must have been more positive, or clear with Simmons, and other teams must have had him on the 2nd round radar, and Veach had to act.

But, for anyone who is upset or thinks it's too risky, who would you have taken?

I am happy with the pick, but if I was going to take a slight reach at 31 or 32, I have to say that I would love to see what Spags could do with Emmanwori, or maybe Mike Green (couldn't really be worse than FAU but is more versatile) and on offense I may have taken Arroyo/Taylor.

You don't really get 1st round talent that late in the draft usually, and we got a Top 15 talent. I hope he gets healthy, and it works out, but if it doesn't, did we really lose anything?

Is it any better to put Moore and his $21 million guaranteed on the bench? They can get out of Taylor's deal next year and absolutely will do so. They will not hesitate to sit him if Simmons/Moore is the best combo, which it likely will be.

Unless he decides to get back to his Jacksonville form, he's likely sitting on the bench.

One thing I find interesting is how literally all of the Chiefs Twitter/media guys love this pick. Whether it's Swanson, Lane, Harms, etc. they all pounded the table for Simmons.

This is ultimately where I have to get to - the team has blown a couple first round picks in the last 5 years and it's been fine.

But every time they do they get just a little closer to the pack. To where a few weeks of scattershot play cost them a bye or HFA and now they have to work just a little harder to get to where they want to be.

And as HoF throughput like Jones and Kelce age out while the home run 2022 draft class gets more expensive, they get closer and closer to being ordinary + Pat Mahomes.

Which is still a damn nice place to be. But it makes your margins week to week and season that much tighter.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This didn&#39;t age well, haha. Chiefs got Josh Simmons at 32. If his knee returns to full health ... this could be an absolute steal.</p>&mdash; James Palmer (@JamesPalmerTV) <a href="https://twitter.com/JamesPalmerTV/status/1915772721793036316?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 25, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I hope it's because the true believers want to dunk on all of those fools who didn't believe Simmons could be the first player in NFL history to be good after this injury. Just shame them right into the ground for their foolish ways!

Can't tell if serious...

Power leg looks good to me.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/JHmXZ...giphy.gif&ct=g

Let me help you then, I'm not.

There is absolutely the high risk/reward factor...that is why he lasted to 32.

If...and that's a big "if" he pans out, it's doing the impossible. Getting a franchise LT without moving up.

They did more research on his patellar than anyone here...with updates in medicine and his age...who knows. They know where his recovery is at.

It'll be interesting to track the players they passed on in a year or two...

Wait and see for me...I guess they obviously thought it was worth a calculated risk. Have to factor in what becomes of the 5th round pick too..

Can we bring in a better offensive line coach? I think Heck sucks.

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

Welp....

I guess you could look at it as....if you wanted them to take a chance to get a high end LT this is about the only way to do that, outside of a big trade up.

I think if they can get him and Moore both starting at tackle at a quality level, this will be delightful.

I am also very glad we did not move up and lose other picks to make this gamble. In addition, I am glad we didn't draft some ****ing limpdick Guard.

Between his knee and his biggest cheerleaders are the mouth breathers of CP, is enough pause for concern.

A couple of years ago, I said I was leaving for good. I'm not saying I'm leaving here now.

What's frustrating is that if you put in the time to find and share information and content here anymore, nobody really looks at it. If you formulate an opinion based on that information, you'll only be ridiculed, chastised, and rejected if it goes against what the Chiefs do.

It's kind of sad that the fanbase has become a "succumb to what Veach does" group that never questions anything for any reason. It wasn't that way when Carl was around. Hell, it wasn't that way when Dorsey was here, and he's the one who built the true core of this team. Hey, I love Veach. I hope he continuously rebuilds the core of this team that John Dorsey handed to him and keeps it this competitive for a long, long time. But does that mean I'm required to like all of his decisions, despite proof that some of those have been downright awful? One can't be vocal against Veach and get along here, so it really becomes a choice against wanting to put in any effort related to having an opposing opinion.

As for the content, it really does take a significant amount of time to put out a lot of content, even if it's not great content. And, I'm not even doing anything special. There are plenty of resources out there to gain information from that are as good or better than anything I have time to put out. It just might not be so easily accessible. I'm not accomplished enough nor do I have the substantial time to put shit up behind a paywall, like some have suggested, and have a following. I'm not about to do a podcast. I have 6 kids in my house, how good would that work out? Those guys that do them have far less credibility than the best posters here, and yet they get respected and their opinions are admired even when they cut against the grain. Why put in that time for no gain only to have it shit on routinely? Doesn't make much sense, does it?

If Matt from KCSN said it or whoever on Twitter said it or dickwad on his podcast said it, it'd be gold. If DJ, duncan, or Crow say it, they don't know shit, can't read studies, etc. ****, I have an undergrad dual major in Mathematics and Physical Education (which is about 60% PT coursework BTW) and I don't know statistics or how to read a study or anything about the human body. It's like **** right off.

Who knows, it might be best to just start spending a little more time with my kids and my fiancé in the winter and spring instead of drafturbating and reading medical studies on sports injuries and the like.

I can still pop on and spew bullshit about my next meal at Taco Bell or something, bitch about what happened in the Week 9 loss, or whatever. I just don't think I really want to put in the effort, and that might be a good thing.

I really do hope the pick works out. It would be quite the coup.

At what point are we going to actually fix LT?

The offense has cratered the last 2 years mostly bc of LT. They’ve had 7 of these guys start at LT since Fisher ruptured his Achilles, including a LG.

How many games have we seen the last 2 years where Mahomes is getting his ass kicked bc the LT is getting destroyed?

I’d say about 20% of the games were ruined on offense bc of that. Broncos, Raiders at Arrowhead both times, Chargers both times, Eagles and Texans playoff games. All games where Mahomes was pressured so much we couldn’t run anything. Half of the playbook was thrown out at least.

I’d say about 70% of the other games were checkdowns, short passes and horizontal passes. People blame Nagy for this all they want, but it’s because of the LT. They’ve had zero trust in Wanya to hold up. None.

Our generational QB went from a fun gunslinger to Alex ****ing Smith because of the OL destroying everything.

Listen man. I don’t like the pick based upon injury, but I completely understand the risk. This shit has to end. It’s affecting Mahomes and the offense too damn much. There is not a better LT prospect this team could get than this kid. It’s not even close.

Missing on this pick is not gonna ruin the team. They gave up no assets to get him. In fact, they got a 5th moving back to get him.

We’ve got 3 picks in the meat of this draft to improve the team. Everybody knows day 2 was going to be the best time to improve this football team. We’ve known that for 2 months.

This was probably one of the few ways the Chiefs were going to acquire a franchise caliber prospect at LT.

Also remember the complaint we've had about Draft Grades for years, though.

They love the picks when they're right.

Draft Grades are nothing more than "How close to MY board were you..."

Gets back to McDuffie getting a C grade because draft twitter thought we'd take Johnson and decided Spags doesn't like smaller corners. It's an exercise in confirmation bias.

And about half of Chiefs Twitter had the nature of his injury wrong. I mean I haven't expected Locked On to get anything right for years - they didn't. Nate Taylor had it COMPLETELY wrong until bout 2-3 weeks ago. But by then, their minds had been made up.

And then it became their exercise in confirmation bias.

So yeah - if they're going to blow by the only concern that those of us opposed to the pick had because they didn't understand WHY we were opposed to the pick...um...okay.

But I think ultimately Reid might have made the point that A) explains why so many draft folks were on this and B) why I'm no less nervous.

They went into the draft with a focus on a single position group in the first round. And nobody expected Campbell, Banks or Membou to fall. Nor were were guys like Ersery first round possibilities (and by all accounts, Jackson is a guard).

So that really did leave them with Conerly and Simmons. So yeah, I suspect they did a shitload of homework on BOTH those guys.

But I do think this is where they've gotten themselves in the most trouble. They did it with Speaks. They did it with Moore. They did it with FAU. Granted, I don't think that's what happened with MEH and that still didn't work out. But the majority of their worst picks have been picks made based on a pre-determined decision to attack a specific position at a specific spot.

When you do that, you're just so very prone to seeing what you wanna see. And I just don't know how folks can be so eager to just dismiss that.

The problem is that we can’t absorb ceh , fau, skyy etc . Picks like these are why the eagles total roster is so much better than ours . In two of the last three SBs we got our bent over by teams with better rosters . Having the best QB only does so much . Looms roster top to bottom also better than ours if 3/4 of their D isn’t on the IL .

So will it be Nagy next that will be the issue with Mahomes playing bad or?

We drafted a fatty that doesnt look fat

And that's what I have to say about that

I totally agree with all of this. But I also think you can flip this view around and it argues for this exact pick.

Veach likely isn't going to recreate the 2022 draft outcome again. That was a master class. So rather than assuming that all the picks are going to be contributors and that the balance of the class will be its saving grace, you're going to need to find some blue chip talent along the way to make up for the inevitable misses. And when picking in the 30s, you're going to have to take some swings on guys that are high ceiling/low floor prospects.

And here we are with Simmons.

FYI... Eric Berry chose to be day to day...

Plenty of folks here disagree with the pick. Speaking like it's already a foregone conclusion that the pick is a failure, Simmons will never be a good player, and Veach is a ****ing idiot that will only be vindicated if the Chiefs get lucky is where I'm kind of taking pause.

So I'm reading it was a partial tear of the patella tendon....can anyone clarify?

No Willie Gay references please...

Who's to say we hadn't already? There's a lot to like about Jaylon Moore.

Or, from a different angle, who's to say we have NOW?

I mean if you think either guy is a 50/50 proposition at the LT spot, you've still only put together a 75% chance that you've finally found a starter there. Better, but by no means ironclad. And if you were starting with 50/50 on Moore, the odds that you've locked it down didn't go from zero to 75% with the Simmons get -- they went from 50 to 75%. Moreover, 50/50 is what you'd have with a Simmons who DIDN'T get injured. But we've done this math already. Ultimately, adding Simmons to Moore might move that needle from 50% likely to have a solution to 60% likely to have a solution.

That's...not a lot of marginal return.

Which is why at some point your STAFF needs to perhaps consider something that ISN'T a dogmatic refusal to change up your offense to help your LT.

{shrug}

It's done. And the 'why' of it isn't even in argument. Everyone has acknowledged why (many of whom would've even supported the why for someone like Conerly).

We'll see. Guy might be a genetic marvel. Might be the 1 of 1 that comes out of this as good as ever. Or maybe he's not and it's just another 1st round pick that didn't work out very well no differently than MEH or FAU.

What else is there but to wait and see?

But if y'all wanna come out here and 'call out' folks that don't like the pick, don't get all pissy when they....still don't like the pick.

Burkholder has 30+ years experience doing this… and has actually seen Simmon’s injury/recovery up close.

That informed insight vs people here whose “knowledge” of the patellar tendon is what they have read on Wikipedia.

His knee broke apart midair.

The misses add up, yeah.

Truly, what they do, is they make you go into FA. More and more often. And FA yields diminishing returns.

A missed 1st, or 2 or even 3 don't have direct, immediate catastrophic impacts to your roster. But they start to put you in binds on the cap because of what you have to do in FA to make up for them. And as our 2022 class gets more expensive, that's going to get harder and harder to do.

So you have to start nailing FA. And maybe that's exactly what will happen. But it starts to close off avenues and like I said, just makes your margins for error smaller and smaller and smaller.

Yeah, gives me a bit of hope that Veach insinuated Burkholder had the same initial reaction that a ton of folks here did and only after a bunch of due diligence assumedly gave his blessing.

Just have to hope it was justified and they aren't YOLOing this in a desperation bid to solve LT long term.

I think even the biggest critic would like to see this be a ten year answer at LT.

The irony of YOU of all people citing the 'wisdom of the experts' ought not be lost on you.

What do you think about that Fauci fell, Eh Florida?

I'll tolerate that particular bullshit argument from some folks. You, good sir, are one person on this entire board with absolutely no standing to make it.

I am not sure it was totally a decision to attack the position group. I think a number guys were in play. But ultimately the thinking is the 1st round DT DB's we liked are gone, we can get an edge and RB later. Really came down to him or Burden. If he has 15% chance to be back to all pro and never addressing LT as long as Pat's a pro, 35% to give us average LT for 4 years it is worth the pick. Not sure there was a totslly safe pick and definately not a pick with as high upside at a coveted position.

I also believe that post surgery they believe he is doing better then expected. But they know it is a high risk high reward pick.

LMAO We gonna get the Josh Simmons thread sent to DC.

C'mon - you know how I view these picks.

Every single one of them is nothing more than a review of their respective ceilings and floors. I'd say 8 of 10 'reviews' I do on ANY of these guys focus specifically on the ceiling and the floor.

And on this particular prospect I've even said that the only way I could see the Chiefs taking him is if they think the ceiling is adequately high enough to justify a floor of, effectively, zero.

I'd have said that they do until I read Reid's quote saying they wanted to take an OT in the first round.

Now my worry is that they just didn't consider the floor because they were so focused on the position group. And that sort of approach just so very very rarely works out.

Yeah - I'm done on that point and am fine with the Mods tossing that post.

But the **** if I'm gonna listen to FloridaMan say "This medical expert has been doing it for 30 years...where'd you get your Virolog....I mean medical degree?"

He, specifically, can **** right off with that horseshit.

They need FAU to atleast be.....good. Not elite/great whatever. But he's just gonna need to be a solid DE.

Outside that.....the misses are about what you would expect no?

To top it all off, Josh Simmons is MAGA!

Nice non-answer/deflect.

You are embarrassing yourself here by acting like you know more than Rick Burkholder.

It’s one thing to disagree with the talent evaluation of a player… but in this case you are arguing that the medical guidance/assessment of Burkholder… and his 30+ years of experience doing this… is incorrect.

Post your sports medicine credentials so we can compare them to Burkholder’s.

Fauci knew he was straight up lying. He knew that the jab did not prevent transmission and he knew it came from China.

The Chiefs Dr's are not looking to mislead. Now he can be wrong,. But I am guessing he knows the risks with this surgery, examined Simmons and reported his findings. Maybe wrong, maybe right time will tell. We also do not know what was relayed. It could be "I think he has a decent chance to be back at 100%" I doubt it was "I am 100% certain" SO are you saying it is 0% that he will ever be healthy enough to play?

I asked for the link and you shared it. And I appreciated that and legitimately went through the study and read a good portion of it. Hand to god.

But I understand statistics and sample sizes too. And I don't think that a study like that is entirely representative of the situation of this player as the Chiefs are evaluating him (I've already shared why that's the case earlier).

Do you really think the Chiefs aren't aware of this study? Has Andy Reid never come across it? And to be clear, this is an Andy Reid decision more than anyone else's.

We're not talking about evaluating a football player. We're not even really talking about an evaluation of the medicals.

We're talking about the process of Andy Reid and Brett Veach and whether they're foolhardy gunslingers caked in hubris who have a history of these longshot gambles. Or whether they have had as much success building a team as any other in the NFL. And whether they are capable of balancing the overall historicals around this injury, the Simmons-specific case, and the risk/reward.

I think they are and am fine with the pick regardless of the outcome.

But the blown picks weren't actually the top choices by Veach. Mahomes was banging the table for CEH and it was at the time a "luxury" pick to many, so they did it. FAU was taken in the draft in KC and Lamar wanted a pick and nobody would trade down, so we took the local kid. This isn't the case with this, it's a calculated risk by Reid, Veach and the medical staff. A far cry from the other two.

KC has won 2 of the last 3 Super Bowls so I don't see how they got bent over by teams with better rosters in 2 out of the last 3 Super Bowls.

Everyone writing of FAU as a bust of a first round pick is jumping the gun a little bit. CEH is the only true black eye on Veach's record when it comes to 1st round picks.

At what point is the HOF offensive genius HC and his GM gonna be held accountable?

How many tackles have been duds now? 7 of these guys plus Jawaan?

Or electing to roll with Skyy Moore and Kadarius Toney as WR1/WR2?

How about doing jack shit at RB all offseason except bringing in Alligator Boy and old slow Perinne after the Broncos cut him in August?

How about drafting an extremely raw LT and throwing him out there only to watch him get prison raped in his 2nd game and benched?

Blaming this on Mahomes is hilarious. This sabatoging of our generational QB is personnel and coaching malpractice.

I love those guys, but they need to take their medicine on this. They have made some catastrophic decisions the last 2 years and it’s affected everybody on offense.

Reid doesn't seem at all concerned. Guess we will have to trust them.

Well I've already spoken to this sweetheart. Multiple times. In multiple threads. Over multiple weeks.

So you're welcome to keep making the exact argument you've blasted people for making while simultaneously ignoring the fact that myself, and Crow, and Duncan, have already answered you.

Evidently your hypocrisy truly does know no bounds.

Not trying to get this to DC, but man DJ has this guy by the balls with his Fauci reference. He’s lawyered him down and pinned him in a corner with no way out LMAO

Its incredible to watch this poster “trust the medical professionals with decades of experience to their name” in one part of the board and on have the complete opposite approach to distrust medical professionals with decades of experience on another side of CP

Well they rolled with, in your words "that fat piece of shit" OBJ and Wiley at T in 2022 and had an MVP QB and won a SB.

But he needs to have better tackle play....sure.

And also trust the medical expertise of an athletic trainer with 30+ years experience.

But DJLN read about patellar tendon injuries on WebMD, so he’s supposedly more qualified to have an informed opinion on this than Burkholder.

:facepalm:

Sorry . Correction . Bent over by eagles and bucs . You recall those right ?

I specifically noted that MEH wasn't an example.

FAU is mushy middle -- I'm not real sure who to believe there.

The two most direct analogues, though, were Speaks and Moore. In both cases we were looking to attack a specific position group in a specific range. We panicked and moved up when that position group dried up in that range so we took the last guy we had in Speaks.

And in Moore we saw a group of 3-4 guys we liked AT the position group and were willing to trade down to take whoever was left.

And that's not speculating, that's a matter of public record. Veach has said as such. Both directly and indirectly (with Moore he said it specifically and then re-stated it in a different way when discussing the Cook pick and how they didn't think they could get the WR where they took Cook so they took WR first even though they had Cook ranked higher).

They have absolutely demonstrated a willingness to do this in the first round or two and I just don't think it's worked out for them well at all when they have. McDuffie they traded up for because the TALENT and not the position. And Karlaftis was said to be a bit of a combination of both -- they badly wanted a DL there but saw enough of them on the board that they were reasonably confident one would fall.

I think there's a fair argument to make that you could fit Karlaftis into this 'approach' and call it a win. I don't think that's right, but it's makeable. That still puts them at least 2-1 down, though.

Explain for everyone here why you think your medical opinion on Simmons’ injury is more informed than Rick Burkholder’s professional assessment.

You’ve thrown a temper tantrum for 12+ hours in this thread now… put your credentials out there so we can compare them to Rick Burkholder’s.

I promised I was done. So I shall be done.

But yeah - there's really no reason to engage that particular bit of nonsense any further.

And I didn't really do anything there - he just led with his chin.

I mean the counter argument to this is 31 other teams who have teams of medical professionals passed on Simmons when it was widely regarded that at Simmons peak in the 2024 season that he was the most talented LT in the draft. If his medical concern wasn't that big of an issue, he would have been taken much higher. Anyone trying to downplay the injury isn't being objective.

Fellas it is what it is- a high risk/high reward draft pick. Neither side is correct or wrong, only time will tell if the gamble pays off.

You know who has the med records and medical expertise and didn’t take Simmons . 31 other teams . But we know better . Ok . I stand corrected

The KC media needs to ask Veach and Reid why they think Simmons will be different than all the studies on this. It definitely is concerning when you look at those and see the history of NFL players that are never the same.

Exactly this. And pick 32 is a perfect spot to do this.

Yes any injury presents risk… which affected his draft stock… but to argue that he’ll never be an effective player or recover from this injury… is directly disagreeing with the medical assessment of the Chiefs athletic trainer with 30+ years experience.

That’s a strange flex.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Several teams agree: Josh Simmons had best tape of any OT last year. And they aren&#39;t very concerned with recovery on the torn patella tendon. More of the concern is maturity/character. But he&#39;s going to the ideal, veteran-laden place.</p>&mdash; Jeremy Fowler (@JFowlerESPN) <a href="https://twitter.com/JFowlerESPN/status/1915612949214908901?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 25, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Sure, the Bucs loss wasn't due to them having a better roster. If you recall, KC lost both of their All-Pro tackles during the season (one in the AFC Championship game). No team is equipped to deal with injuries concentrated in one area like that late in the season.

I will applaud the consistency of this board on this player.

Most people who didn’t want him are sticking to that.

Most that deferred to the Chiefs are staying with that.

Most that wanted him are celebrating it.

I get kinda annoyed when someone just finds a way to love or hate something.

If I'm reading what I can find on the net correctly, Simmons had a different type of surgery than you would normally see with a complete patellar tendon tear.