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DJ's left nut 12-14-2023 09:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17278958)
I'm just not going with the drafting guessing game again. We tried, it failed, be done for a bit and use the ones that actually did hit.

Looking at the offenses really chugging this year.....Is the 3rd guy in Dallas making that go or the fact that Ceedee is just a monster and it's a contract year for Dak?
We didn't fail. We drafted Rashee Rice and that will pay dividends for a long time to come.

O.city 12-14-2023 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17278968)
We didn't fail. We drafted Rashee Rice and that will pay dividends for a long time to come.
Exactly. So lets pair him with an expensive guy on the other side and get back to business.

DJ's left nut 12-14-2023 10:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17278971)
Exactly. So lets pair him with an expensive guy on the other side and get back to business.
Let's pair him with a reliable veteran and draft another guy that complements him for a half decade and do both.

duncan_idaho 12-14-2023 10:16 AM
You can get me on board with Calvin Ridley. I like him and think he'd be a good fit. It comes down to what the deal looks like and the length of the deal for me.

I wouldn't complain a bit about a Ridley/Rice/Egbuka 3 WR set. That sounds amazing, in fact.

O.city 12-14-2023 10:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17278980)
Let's pair him with a reliable veteran and draft another guy that complements him for a half decade and do both.
That's what I'm laying out.

Mine is just a better player.

Shoes 12-14-2023 11:45 AM
Very interested to see how Xavier Worthy/Adonai Mitchell perform in the college football playoffs. Pairing Adonai Mitchell with a guy like Darnell Mooney to boost the WR room does make a lot of sense to me.

duncan_idaho 12-14-2023 12:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoes (Post 17279113)
Very interested to see how Xavier Worthy/Adonai Mitchell perform in the college football playoffs. Pairing Adonai Mitchell with a guy like Darnell Mooney to boost the WR room does make a lot of sense to me.
Adonai Mitchell is a guy I like a TON.

He's got the whole toolset. Speed, size, hands, good in key spots, he's a downfield threat who can stack DBs or high-point. Seems like he gets in and out of routes well.

Another pairing I'm interested in is Keenan Allen + rookie. That could be a perfect situation. If the Chargers cut him (And I think they might have to at this point), that would be a great bridge while Rice and a rook get fully up to speed.

I also think Mitchell is a little underrated because he played in an antiquated offense at Georgia and was one of many talented options at UT (and the last to arrive). Could really outperform where he'll be ranked coming into this draft.

staylor26 12-14-2023 12:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 17279147)
Adonai Mitchell is a guy I like a TON.

He's got the whole toolset. Speed, size, hands, good in key spots, he's a downfield threat who can stack DBs or high-point. Seems like he gets in and out of routes well.

Another pairing I'm interested in is Keenan Allen + rookie. That could be a perfect situation. If the Chargers cut him (And I think they might have to at this point), that would be a great bridge while Rice and a rook get fully up to speed.

I also think Mitchell is a little underrated because he played in an antiquated offense at Georgia and was one of many talented options at UT (and the last to arrive). Could really outperform where he'll be ranked coming into this draft.
I saw Trevor Sikkema compare Mitchell to Higgins. I think that's a really good comparison.

JPH83 12-14-2023 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17278952)
I developed a theory about a decade ago watching Mizzou football and it was essentially that your 3rd WR is what makes/breaks a passing offense. When Mizzou was at its best after Daniel, the throughput wasn't even the QB - it was the ability to run 3 dangerous receivers out there. When that fell to 2, the dropoff in productivity was dramatic. Far more than merely losing a weapon would've suggested.

Because THAT'S when you stretch a defense past its talent level. A lot of teams have 2 credible CBS - very few have 3. If you can put 3 guys out there with the ability to tax the defensive backfield, you create mismatches that are far more difficult to deal with.

I'm not content simply putting a 2nd good WR out there and calling it a day. I think we're better with Rice/Ridley/Egbuka than we would be with Rice/Aiyuk/Toney. It's that ability to pressure the worst player in their defensive backfield that I'm looking for.
I kinda said this elsewhere re 3 targets. But i think I'm throwing numbers and money at it to.make sure I've got that 3rd guy. Rice I'm happy to bank on, Kelce may well be slowing down but I'm still happy to gamble there. But if I want one more guaranteed I'm going to take about 3 shots at it. Ridley could be the guy, but he hasn't looked as good. The draft is deep but I'd take a guy in R1 and a later flyer. I'm not leaving anything to chance.

JPH83 12-14-2023 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by staylor26 (Post 17279213)
I saw Trevor Sikkema compare Mitchell to Higgins. I think that's a really good comparison.
Like others I like Mitchell a lot more than Worthy. Man I'm double dipping this draft, we really can't and shouldnt miss

DJ's left nut 12-14-2023 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPH83 (Post 17279348)
Like others I like Mitchell a lot more than Worthy. Man I'm double dipping this draft, we really can't and shouldnt miss
Yeah - it would be kinda ridiculous if we don't come out of the first 3 rounds with two pass catchers.

The draft is so damn deep at WR that you really should be able to get at least 1 nice all-around option and then another that's either 1) A tight end or 2) a niche WR weapon (i.e. the burner).

Hell, it's even really good at OT.

The draft sets up really nicely for us.

duncan_idaho 12-14-2023 03:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17279583)
Yeah - it would be kinda ridiculous if we don't come out of the first 3 rounds with two pass catchers.

The draft is so damn deep at WR that you really should be able to get at least 1 nice all-around option and then another that's either 1) A tight end or 2) a niche WR weapon (i.e. the burner).

Hell, it's even really good at OT.

The draft sets up really nicely for us.

I think it’s not ridiculous if they get a clear top WR through FA.

If you give this team, say, Aiyuk or Evans, I can be ok with spending a 1st or 2nd on a WR and leaving it there.

OnTheWarpath15 12-14-2023 03:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17278958)
I'm just not going with the drafting guessing game again. We tried, it failed, be done for a bit and use the ones that actually did hit.

Looking at the offenses really chugging this year.....Is the 3rd guy in Dallas making that go or the fact that Ceedee is just a monster and it's a contract year for Dak?
Dallas' offense starting HUMMING once they quit spreading the ball around so much and started force feeding CeeDee.

Chris Meck 12-14-2023 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17278958)
I'm just not going with the drafting guessing game again. We tried, it failed, be done for a bit and use the ones that actually did hit.

Looking at the offenses really chugging this year.....Is the 3rd guy in Dallas making that go or the fact that Ceedee is just a monster and it's a contract year for Dak?
No offense, friend, but you'd be a terrible GM.

That's some Carl Peterson shit right there.

"Well, we tried to draft a QB, and failed, so let's be done for a bit. Maybe we'll just trade for the San Fran back-ups and try to work with that."

Chris Meck 12-14-2023 07:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 17279592)
I think it’s not ridiculous if they get a clear top WR through FA.

If you give this team, say, Aiyuk or Evans, I can be ok with spending a 1st or 2nd on a WR and leaving it there.
Can anyone come up with a good reason that SF would trade Aiyuk besides that we'd like to have him?

Sassy Squatch 12-14-2023 07:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 17279815)
Can anyone come up with a good reason that SF would trade Aiyuk besides that we'd like to have him?
Their cap situation is pretty sketch. Already 14 million over for 2024 and there's not much to maneuver without pushing some old guys that are already starting to decline WAY into the future.

They've only got 8 million in 2025 as is. There's just not much room to play with.

Chris Meck 12-14-2023 09:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17279836)
Their cap situation is pretty sketch. Already 14 million over for 2024 and there's not much to maneuver without pushing some old guys that are already starting to decline WAY into the future.

They've only got 8 million in 2025 as is. There's just not much room to play with.
HOLY SHIT.

I just looked at their Spotrac numbers. They're ****ed.

How the hell did they let it get that bad?

Arik Armstead almost $29m? Fred Warner $28m?

What the ****!?

O.city 12-14-2023 09:33 PM
They’ll cut armstead but they also need to replenish draft picks that they’ve traded plus they’ve whiffed on some higher picks

They aren’t gonna pay another offensive weapon

O.city 12-14-2023 09:34 PM
They’ve got 38 mil they can rollover from this year so it’s not dire

Stryker 12-15-2023 08:53 PM
Rice with Emeka Egbuka :thumb:

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Hoover 12-15-2023 08:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17265134)
Said it before, but I'd like to see us pursue a big WR.

Would be fun to have a Dez Bryant, DK Metcalf, Michael Thomas, or Mike Evans of our own.
Just go sign Evans on the FA market. Draft another WR in the 2nd or 3rd.

Evans, Rice, Toney, Moore, Rookie, KR, Cheap vet

RunKC 12-18-2023 01:39 PM
Man I really like Adonai Mitchell. I really like Jalen McMillan. I really like Emeka Egbuka.

Right now I say **** trading our 1st rd pick. In this WR class it's way too valuable. You're very likely getting a very good plug-n-play WR2 caliber player for pennies

O.city 12-18-2023 02:13 PM
After all that's happened this season, you think they're gonna just plug a rookie in and go?

JPH83 12-18-2023 02:21 PM
Draft 2, Brown in FA, I reckon we're good. Assume one of the draftees is a dud but man it is SOOOO deep this year we've got to find someone. I'd happily "waste" a pick on a second WR this year. If we swing twice and miss on both, yeah, people can s*** on Veach at that point, because it would be pretty bad.

Chris Meck 12-18-2023 07:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17287980)
After all that's happened this season, you think they're gonna just plug a rookie in and go?
To be fair, the rookie is the only guy that has worked out, so yeah, why not?

Couch-Potato 12-18-2023 08:36 PM
Arrowhead Addicts recent 3-RD Mock has the Chiefs trading down:

Spoiler!

Couch-Potato 12-18-2023 08:40 PM
I see a lot of Mocks giving DET a 1st RD WR, I wonder if Jameson Williams could be our next reclamation project similar to Toney. Worth noting they have the cap space to absorb Chris Jones' contract as well.

Abba-Dabba 12-19-2023 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPH83 (Post 17287999)
Draft 2, Brown in FA, I reckon we're good. Assume one of the draftees is a dud but man it is SOOOO deep this year we've got to find someone. I'd happily "waste" a pick on a second WR this year. If we swing twice and miss on both, yeah, people can s*** on Veach at that point, because it would be pretty bad.
I'm not very interested Brown. Not interested in Mooney at all.

Give me Tee Higgins and maybe a lower end WR like Van Jefferson or Parris Campbell. With a draft pick like Jermaine Burton who has speed to stretch the field and the moxie ready for NFL DB's.

duncan_idaho 12-19-2023 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abba-Dabba (Post 17290102)
I'm not very interested Brown. Not interested in Mooney at all.

Give me Tee Higgins and maybe a lower end WR like Van Jefferson or Parris Campbell. With a draft pick like Jermaine Burton who has speed to stretch the field and the moxie ready for NFL DB's.

The Bengals are almost assuredly tagging and trading Tee Higgins. Who else are they going to tag, Reader?

I see a lot of Chiefs fans lusting after him. They’re setting themselves up for disappointment.

It’s interesting you’re not interested in Mooney but very interested in Campbell.

Abba-Dabba 12-19-2023 08:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 17290212)
The Bengals are almost assuredly tagging and trading Tee Higgins. Who else are they going to tag, Reader?

I see a lot of Chiefs fans lusting after him. They’re setting themselves up for disappointment.

It’s interesting you’re not interested in Mooney but very interested in Campbell.
I would rather be disappointed and entertain the option than not entertaining it as an option entirely. If they tag him oh well, moving on.

It's not interesting at all. Mooney projects to be 3 times the price of Campbell. I'll take a hard pass on Mooney for 10m per year.

duncan_idaho 12-19-2023 10:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abba-Dabba (Post 17290238)
I would rather be disappointed and entertain the option than not entertaining it as an option entirely. If they tag him oh well, moving on.

It's not interesting at all. Mooney projects to be 3 times the price of Campbell. I'll take a hard pass on Mooney for 10m per year.

I think Spotrac is way, way off on what Mooney will actually get, but time will tell.

smith11 12-20-2023 04:37 AM
would steelers george pickens be worth pursuing in a trade---great talent but seems to have a real diva attitude...

Couch-Potato 12-20-2023 09:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smith11 (Post 17290488)
would steelers george pickens be worth pursuing in a trade---great talent but seems to have a real diva attitude...
Maybe, but then you'd have to deal with his diva attitude.

I wonder if we couldn't pry Jameson Williams from DET.

What other realistic trade candidates might be out there?

-Jameson Williams, DET
-George Pickens, PIT
-?
-?
-?

kccrow 12-20-2023 09:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17290640)
Maybe, but then you'd have to deal with his diva attitude.

I wonder if we couldn't pry Jameson Williams from DET.

What other realistic trade candidates might be out there?

-Jameson Williams, DET
-George Pickens, PIT
-?
-?
-?
I think Rashod Bateman, Hunter Renfrow, and Jerry Jeudy, though not sure we'd want to entertain Jeudy.

Abba-Dabba 12-20-2023 09:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 17290353)
I think Spotrac is way, way off on what Mooney will actually get, but time will tell.
That's fine. You are more than welcome to think that. I will lean on those that have a little more insight into potential contract numbers than what my feels as a fan are. But like you say, only time will tell.

Essentially what you are saying in your 2 posts to me is that Spotrac is overvaluing Mooney at 10m while at the same time undervaluing Tee Higgins at 16.5m without any evidence other than your own internal feelings. I'm just not going to get that emotional about it and not to let my feelings get in the way.

My feelings says Mooney isn't worth 5m. But that is just my feelings and has no real insight into that belief. Unless I have been in privy to any internal discussions within any organziation on Mooney, I'm going to rely upon a resource other than my feelings.

Other than that, considering that MVS may not be back. The need for someone to fill that role is needed. Those at the top, like Harrison, Nabers, Oduze, Egbuka are all likely out of reach in our present draft position. That leaves us with Worthy, Franklin, Burton, maybe Thomas Jr. as potential late day 1 or day 2 targets.

Couch-Potato 12-20-2023 10:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17290675)
I think Rashod Bateman, Hunter Renfrow, and Jerry Jeudy, though not sure we'd want to entertain Jeudy.
I like Pickens or Williams as trade candidates.

I like Ridley and Brown as FAs.

I like Coleman or Legette in the draft.

Currently.

Couch-Potato 12-20-2023 10:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17290675)
I think Rashod Bateman, Hunter Renfrow, and Jerry Jeudy, though not sure we'd want to entertain Jeudy.
Wish GB would part with oft injured Christian Watson, but I don't see why they would.

Coogs 12-20-2023 01:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17290640)
Maybe, but then you'd have to deal with his diva attitude.

I wonder if we couldn't pry Jameson Williams from DET.

What other realistic trade candidates might be out there?

-Jameson Williams, DET
-George Pickens, PIT
-?
-?
-?
I think I would give Minnesota a call and see about Justin Jefferson. He is 24. Will be on his 5th year option next year. And they weren’t able to come to a deal this past summer. Might be a quick “no” from the Vikes. But if they seem even remotely interested, I’d make him priority number one.

DJ's left nut 12-20-2023 02:23 PM
The more I look at the class, the more evenly situated I think most of these guys are after Nabers.

I think you have 2 guys at the top and then probably Odunze nearer them than he is everyone else. But then i think I see maybe 6 guys who are a little different in the margins but nobody is clearly BETTER than the rest.

Egbuka is probably my favorite of that group but I could be talked into Coleman on physical attributes. Worthy seems like Jameson Williams 2.0 but I didn't expect Williams to be lousy; Mitchell may actually be better than Worthy in his own right. Thomas may be like Olave - overlooked because of a better teammate but still damn good in his own right. Legette may be better than all but Harrison if he's a true late bloomer rather than flash in the pan. Then you have a guy in Corley who looks genuinely explosive out there - a sort of Deebo (or maybe Alec Burks, if you're down on him) sort of player.

It's just an awfully deep WR class.

O.city 12-20-2023 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17291310)
The more I look at the class, the more evenly situated I think most of these guys are after Nabers.

I think you have 2 guys at the top and then probably Odunze nearer them than he is everyone else. But then i think I see maybe 6 guys who are a little different in the margins but nobody is clearly BETTER than the rest.

Egbuka is probably my favorite of that group but I could be talked into Coleman on physical attributes. Worthy seems like Jameson Williams 2.0 but I didn't expect Williams to be lousy; Mitchell may actually be better than Worthy in his own right. Thomas may be like Olave - overlooked because of a better teammate but still damn good in his own right. Legette may be better than all but Harrison if he's a true late bloomer rather than flash in the pan. Then you have a guy in Corley who looks genuinely explosive out there - a sort of Deebo (or maybe Alec Burks, if you're down on him) sort of player.

It's just an awfully deep WR class.
You could also have a situation where once you get past the top 2/3 it just kinda ends up being an also ran normal blah kinda thing.

I dunno. I like the top 2 a whole lot. After that it's kinda dealers choice to me.

kccrow 12-21-2023 12:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17290730)
I like Pickens or Williams as trade candidates.

I like Ridley and Brown as FAs.

I like Coleman or Legette in the draft.

Currently.
I don't see Veach signing Ridley. He's going to be 30.

O.city 12-21-2023 07:50 AM
I wouldn’t trade for anyone just draft a guy

Nightfyre 12-21-2023 08:35 AM
How do we feel about Gabe Davis? He definitely has the speed. A lot of people were riding him for not showing up earlier in the year, but I feel like he was open a lot and simply overlooked.

OKchiefs 12-21-2023 08:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17291934)
I don't see Veach signing Ridley. He's going to be 30.
I think the results from this year should hopefully show Veach that he just needs to fix the room, no matter what. If part of fixing the room means drafting a guy and then signing an older veteran like Ridley, Evans, or Boyd to a 2-3 year deal then so be it. I'm not sure we can rely on past results in this case to predict what Veach will do.

OKchiefs 12-21-2023 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightfyre (Post 17292003)
How do we feel about Gabe Davis? He definitely has the speed. A lot of people were riding him for not showing up earlier in the year, but I feel like he was open a lot and simply overlooked.
Feels like a slightly better MVS. He's gone catchless in 4 games in the past 6 weeks, although yes he did have one 6 catch 105 yard effort in the middle there. Overall this season he has 8 games with 2 or less catches. Unless he comes at a serious discount I don't see how he's much of an improvement here.

O.city 12-21-2023 08:44 AM
With the Rice output I hope it shows Veach to just draft good ****ing players and let them play.

OKchiefs 12-21-2023 08:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17292018)
With the Rice output I hope it shows Veach to just draft good ****ing players and let them play.
Easier said than done, even the best prospects out there can bust in the NFL. There are no guarantees in the draft which is why they should hedge their bets with multiple shots at the position. 1 decent FA and ideally 2 draft picks, 1 in the 1st/2nd and another possibly on day 3. We've had success double dipping at CB in the draft, should do the same at WR.

O.city 12-21-2023 09:47 AM
They need to hit the DL in the draft as well and a G wouldn't be the worst idea.

O.city 12-21-2023 09:52 AM
Franklin paired with Rice would be really nice I think.

Chris Meck 12-21-2023 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17292018)
With the Rice output I hope it shows Veach to just draft good ****ing players and let them play.
yeah, I'm sure that wasn't part of his thought process before.

O.city 12-21-2023 09:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 17292090)
yeah, I'm sure that wasn't part of his thought process before.
They don't need to go out of their way to fix the WR room at all costs, that's why we're here in the first place.

They blasted the OL and the defense with money and picks and tried to go cheap somewhere. It backfired.

Don't go overboard. Just keep adding everywhere and let the chips fall where they may.

raybec 4 12-21-2023 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17291973)
I wouldn’t trade for anyone just draft a guy
You were the engineer on the Aiyuk train a couple of weeks ago. Do you only want him if they cut him?

O.city 12-21-2023 10:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raybec 4 (Post 17292115)
You were the engineer on the Aiyuk train a couple of weeks ago. Do you only want him if they cut him?
No I meant trade for a recently drafted guy like some were talking. I'd trade and pay Aiyuk and show my bare ass to all you guys in a second.

OKchiefs 12-21-2023 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17292092)
They don't need to go out of their way to fix the WR room at all costs, that's why we're here in the first place.

They blasted the OL and the defense with money and picks and tried to go cheap somewhere. It backfired.

Don't go overboard. Just keep adding everywhere and let the chips fall where they may.
I guess it depends on how you define "overboard". IMO drafting a guy in the 1st, signing a decent FA, and then maybe getting another WR either later in the draft or a budget FA isn't going overboard, it's a reasonable correction based on having one of the worst WR corps in the NFL.

Now, trading up to the top 10 to get Odunze and then trading our 2024 1st for Aiyuk (or something along those lines) would absolutely be overkill.

Chris Meck 12-21-2023 11:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17292092)
They don't need to go out of their way to fix the WR room at all costs, that's why we're here in the first place.

They blasted the OL and the defense with money and picks and tried to go cheap somewhere. It backfired.

Don't go overboard. Just keep adding everywhere and let the chips fall where they may.
'Where we are' is defending Super Bowl Champions, AFCW division winners for the however many years in a row and still in the mix for the #1 seed in the AFC.

The NFL is hard, it's not a ****ing video game.

Whatever happens from here out this year, 'where we are' is just fine. You're not going to win every year.

I'd take our chances in '24 without even knowing how this season ends.

Couch-Potato 12-21-2023 12:27 PM
I'm still holding on to a glimmer of hope that Ross breaks out for the rest of the season.

JPH83 12-21-2023 02:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17292092)
They don't need to go out of their way to fix the WR room at all costs, that's why we're here in the first place.

They blasted the OL and the defense with money and picks and tried to go cheap somewhere. It backfired.

Don't go overboard. Just keep adding everywhere and let the chips fall where they may.
If we went with your Aiyuk trade what would you expect to give up, and how would that allow you to add good players across the board?

kccrow 12-21-2023 06:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 17292004)
I think the results from this year should hopefully show Veach that he just needs to fix the room, no matter what. If part of fixing the room means drafting a guy and then signing an older veteran like Ridley, Evans, or Boyd to a 2-3 year deal then so be it. I'm not sure we can rely on past results in this case to predict what Veach will do.
He might need to fix the room but they've never picked up an old vet during Reid's tenure that I can recall. Watkins, JuJu, and Watson were all 26 when they were signed. Richie James might be the oldest at 28. I'd say the chances of signing a 30-31 year-old WR is pretty slim at best and probably null.

I'd say this is the list we're looking at (I'll highlight the ones I personally think they'd be most interested in):

Curtis Samuel (28)
DJ Chark (28)
Parris Campbell (27)
Marquise Brown (27)
Noah Brown (28)
Tee Higgins (25)
Michael Pittman Jr (27)
Laviska Shenault (26)
Trent Sherfield (28)
Chase Claypool (26)
Nick Westbrook-Ikhine (27)
Equamineous St. Brown (28)
Olamide Zaccheaus (27)
Scott Miller (27)
Jalen Guyton (27)
Devin Duvernay (27)
Lil'Jordan Humphrey (26)
Miles Boykin (28)
Jalen Reagor (25)
Gabriel Davis (25)
Darnell Mooney (27)
K.J. Osborn (27)
Donovan Peoples-Jones (25)
Quez Watkins (26)

Higgins and Pittman are going to cost some money that I don't know that we'll go for signing.

OKchiefs 12-22-2023 10:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17292733)
He might need to fix the room but they've never picked up an old vet during Reid's tenure that I can recall. Watkins, JuJu, and Watson were all 26 when they were signed. Richie James might be the oldest at 28. I'd say the chances of signing a 30-31 year-old WR is pretty slim at best and probably null.

I'd say this is the list we're looking at (I'll highlight the ones I personally think they'd be most interested in):

Curtis Samuel (28)
DJ Chark (28)
Parris Campbell (27)
Marquise Brown (27)
Noah Brown (28)
Tee Higgins (25)
Michael Pittman Jr (27)
Laviska Shenault (26)
Trent Sherfield (28)
Chase Claypool (26)
Nick Westbrook-Ikhine (27)
Equamineous St. Brown (28)
Olamide Zaccheaus (27)
Scott Miller (27)
Jalen Guyton (27)
Devin Duvernay (27)
Lil'Jordan Humphrey (26)
Miles Boykin (28)
Jalen Reagor (25)
Gabriel Davis (25)
Darnell Mooney (27)
K.J. Osborn (27)
Donovan Peoples-Jones (25)
Quez Watkins (26)

Higgins and Pittman are going to cost some money that I don't know that we'll go for signing.
In many cases I can see the merit of not sinking money into older FAs, and maybe they'll stick to their guns on that, but I think it's a mistake to be so stubborn that they won't waiver at all. In hindsight it's pretty clear that DeAndre Hopkins absolutely should have been acquired either through trade or FA. IMO it would show a lot of hubris and arrogance to not do some self-reflection and change how they go about certain aspects of their strategy.

OKchiefs 12-22-2023 10:24 AM
Also, the Chiefs have never drafted a WR in the 1st rd under Reid, but we're very possibly expecting that to change this coming year. KC had never drafted a CB in the 1st prior to McDuffie. Can't always rely on the past to predict future results.

DJ's left nut 12-22-2023 10:32 AM
Curtis Samuel is still only 28?

Didn't he sign with Washington like 7 years ago? Time has no meaning for me anymore...

Couch-Potato 12-22-2023 11:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17292733)
He might need to fix the room but they've never picked up an old vet during Reid's tenure that I can recall. Watkins, JuJu, and Watson were all 26 when they were signed. Richie James might be the oldest at 28. I'd say the chances of signing a 30-31 year-old WR is pretty slim at best and probably null.

I'd say this is the list we're looking at (I'll highlight the ones I personally think they'd be most interested in):

Curtis Samuel (28)
DJ Chark (28)
Parris Campbell (27)
Marquise Brown (27)
Noah Brown (28)
Tee Higgins (25)
Michael Pittman Jr (27)
Laviska Shenault (26)
Trent Sherfield (28)
Chase Claypool (26)
Nick Westbrook-Ikhine (27)
Equamineous St. Brown (28)
Olamide Zaccheaus (27)
Scott Miller (27)
Jalen Guyton (27)
Devin Duvernay (27)
Lil'Jordan Humphrey (26)
Miles Boykin (28)
Jalen Reagor (25)
Gabriel Davis (25)
Darnell Mooney (27)
K.J. Osborn (27)
Donovan Peoples-Jones (25)
Quez Watkins (26)

Higgins and Pittman are going to cost some money that I don't know that we'll go for signing.
How about Rashid Shaheed? He's 25 years old and his contract is up at the end of the season, Saints have a total of 35 FAs. He can catch the deep ball and would be a nice low cost 3rd option after Rice and a 1st round WR IMO.

Couch-Potato 12-22-2023 11:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17293373)
How about Rashid Shaheed? He's 25 years old and his contract is up at the end of the season, Saints have a total of 35 FAs. He can catch the deep ball and would be a nice low cost 3rd option after Rice and a 1st round WR IMO.
Never mind...

Shaheed will be an exclusive-rights free agent in 2024, so while you’ll see him included on these kinds of lists his only option will be to play for the Saints on a low-cost tender next season. He won’t have the opportunity to entertain offers from other teams or sign a multiyear extension until 2025 (as a restricted free agent) or more realistically 2026 (when he would have unrestricted status).

Couch-Potato 12-22-2023 01:11 PM
Egbuka seems to be falling on draft boards to top of the 2nd, would be a good get for us maybe.

Ultimately, I think Franklyn' our guy if he's there.

JPH83 12-22-2023 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17293495)
Egbuka seems to be falling on draft boards to top of the 2nd, would be a good get for us maybe.

Ultimately, I think Franklyn' our guy if he's there.
Would not hate either. I think both immediately make our WR group better

duncan_idaho 12-22-2023 04:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abba-Dabba (Post 17290687)
That's fine. You are more than welcome to think that. I will lean on those that have a little more insight into potential contract numbers than what my feels as a fan are. But like you say, only time will tell.

Essentially what you are saying in your 2 posts to me is that Spotrac is overvaluing Mooney at 10m while at the same time undervaluing Tee Higgins at 16.5m without any evidence other than your own internal feelings. I'm just not going to get that emotional about it and not to let my feelings get in the way.

My feelings says Mooney isn't worth 5m. But that is just my feelings and has no real insight into that belief. Unless I have been in privy to any internal discussions within any organziation on Mooney, I'm going to rely upon a resource other than my feelings.

Other than that, considering that MVS may not be back. The need for someone to fill that role is needed. Those at the top, like Harrison, Nabers, Oduze, Egbuka are all likely out of reach in our present draft position. That leaves us with Worthy, Franklin, Burton, maybe Thomas Jr. as potential late day 1 or day 2 targets.
Spotrac has a track record of being way off on its market value assessments.That, not my feelings, is more the source of my disbelief of that figure.

Mooney has been less consistent and productive than players who got less than $10M/AAV in last year's free agent pool. Higgins has a track record that lines up with guys llike D.J. Moore and Terry McLaurin while blowing the doors off of guys at that $16.5M figure.

O.city 12-23-2023 09:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPH83 (Post 17292534)
If we went with your Aiyuk trade what would you expect to give up, and how would that allow you to add good players across the board?
It would cost our 1st

Chris Meck 12-23-2023 11:01 AM
I just fundamentally disagree with trading a #1 pick for the right to pay a player a top of the market salary.

You're spending precious resources twice.

And ****ing your cap.

I don't like it.

Couch-Potato 12-23-2023 11:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 17294256)
I just fundamentally disagree with trading a #1 pick for the right to pay a player a top of the market salary.

You're spending precious resources twice.

And ****ing your cap.

I don't like it.
I like Ayiuk, but agree with Meck here...If you want to sign a top expense WR, Evans or Pittman are there.

If you want to spend a 1st on a WR, we'll have plenty of options. I do wonder who we could get for a 3rd or 4th, though, similar to Toney. I threw out Jamison Williams as a reclamation project, or Hopkins should TEN want to go younger, but there's others that probably make more sense.

I think if you want an Ayiuk type you'd have to figure out some kind of Chris Jones sign and trade to get me on board, although wouldn't work for Ayiuk specifically bc they wouldn't want to take on a CJ contract.

Couch-Potato 12-23-2023 11:52 AM
I've heard rumors that....

1. There could be a record number of QBs taken in the 1st.

2. There could be a record number of OTs taken in the 1st.

3. There could be a record number of WRs taken in the 1st.

Sounds like talking heads just stirring the pot a bit, but interesting notes on where the talent lies in the top of the draft. I've also heard there's a lot of talent in the DB class as well.

JPH83 12-23-2023 12:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17294192)
It would cost our 1st
He's probably a top 5 WR right now, I think they'd ask for more than a late 1st wouldn't they?

It's a realy nice looking WR draft class. I think this is the year to double dip and play the numbers game. It's just too good value to hit on a WR and get them cheap for years. That's my preference. If it all still looks like ass next year then we can trade for a proven commodity.

Couch-Potato 12-23-2023 12:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPH83 (Post 17294318)
He's probably a top 5 WR right now, I think they'd ask for more than a late 1st wouldn't they?

It's a realy nice looking WR draft class. I think this is the year to double dip and play the numbers game. It's just too good value to hit on a WR and get them cheap for years. That's my preference. If it all still looks like ass next year then we can trade for a proven commodity.
Is he? Idk... Evans has out produced Ayiuk over the course of his time in the NFL and is available without giving up a 1st.

JPH83 12-23-2023 01:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato (Post 17294336)
Is he? Idk... Evans has out produced Ayiuk over the course of his time in the NFL and is available without giving up a 1st.
I think he's probably there or thereabouts yeah. But I don't disagree in going after a guy in FA rather than trade. I keep saying it but i want a guy in FA that's at least a top 50 type. Brown etc. Then 2 WRs in the draft. We need an overhaul.

duncan_idaho 12-23-2023 11:04 PM
I'm becoming more and more of a fan of Egbuka. Hope he does fall to 32...

Scouting reports and eye tests show a guy who is savvy working into soft spots of zones, who also has the twitch and suddeness to separate against man, with good hands, long arms, enough speed to be a 3-levels receiver, and some contact balance to help with YAC.

kccrow 12-24-2023 01:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 17295305)
I'm becoming more and more of a fan of Egbuka. Hope he does fall to 32...

Scouting reports and eye tests show a guy who is savvy working into soft spots of zones, who also has the twitch and suddeness to separate against man, with good hands, long arms, enough speed to be a 3-levels receiver, and some contact balance to help with YAC.
We'll have to see what happens with how teams grade him out. For me, he's the 3rd best WR in this class behind Harrison and Nabers. Some have Odunze and Coleman over him but even if that is the case he's probably gone by 23-ish if I'm guessing. I think we'd have to move up some no matter what. I hope and dream we get the kid but I'll settle for Franklin.

duncan_idaho 12-24-2023 10:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17295355)
We'll have to see what happens with how teams grade him out. For me, he's the 3rd best WR in this class behind Harrison and Nabers. Some have Odunze and Coleman over him but even if that is the case he's probably gone by 23-ish if I'm guessing. I think we'd have to move up some no matter what. I hope and dream we get the kid but I'll settle for Franklin.

Agree about him being #3.

Odense and Coleman are going to test really well and I think that may move 5hem ahead.

I’m expecting the Bengals to tag and trade Higgins and replace him in the draft. Will be interesting to see what they go for if they go that route.

Another big physical guy to be a weapon on YOLO deep balls when Chase is doubled? Or someone more like Boyd, who is also a FA?

JPH83 12-24-2023 10:57 AM
I'd prefer Odunze to Egbuka, I just think he's a better athlete, even if there's a little less polish there. But yeah, he's going a fair bit earlier I suspect. I don't like Coleman half as much

I'll be sick as a dog if the Bengals steal a top target of ours.

O.city 12-24-2023 03:56 PM
2 1s for ceedee

kccrow 12-24-2023 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPH83 (Post 17295491)
I'd prefer Odunze to Egbuka, I just think he's a better athlete, even if there's a little less polish there. But yeah, he's going a fair bit earlier I suspect. I don't like Coleman half as much

I'll be sick as a dog if the Bengals steal a top target of ours.
Egbuka ran a 4.42 in 2019 in the high school all-star shit. There's a legitimately high probability he runs in the 4.3s. Odunze hasn't put that mark up, but his coaches have reported he's running 4.3s, though I don't necessarily trust it. Egbuka certainly looks faster on tape to me. Neither is bad in the size department. I'd be happy if either got into our range. I don't suspect it. I think Coleman will be the one to drop.

JPH83 12-25-2023 01:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 17296184)
Egbuka ran a 4.42 in 2019 in the high school all-star shit. There's a legitimately high probability he runs in the 4.3s. Odunze hasn't put that mark up, but his coaches have reported he's running 4.3s, though I don't necessarily trust it. Egbuka certainly looks faster on tape to me. Neither is bad in the size department. I'd be happy if either got into our range. I don't suspect it. I think Coleman will be the one to drop.
Could well be right. Funny thing I find is that I can look at a guy's tape from one year and see a totally different player to his tape from another year. Last year Odunze looked bigger and slower, this year shiftier, and rhe opposite for Egbuka. Go figure.

In any case, Odunze is definitely bigger and playing far more on the outside that Egbuka. I don't know that Egbuka isn't a better slot given that's where most of his snaps are coming from. I AM certain that isn't Odunze's role. I just think he's going to beat man more frequently and if it's not with speed it'll be with physicality. More strings to his bow imo.


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