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Awesome. It'll be interesting to see if the two Decastro teams win out, or if my Kendall Wright pick trumps him.
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Okay, time to cut to your final 53.
Note: You can add any of the following players to your roster if they're not already on there. (These are free agent/undrafted pickups on the Chiefs roster.) RB -- Shaun Draughn (1st year, North Carolina), Nate Eachus (rookie, Colgate). TE -- Kevin Boss (6th year, Western Oregon) DL -- Ropati Pitoitua (4th year, Washington State). LB -- Edgar Jones (6th year, Southeast Missouri) DB -- Abram Elam (7th year, Kent State), Tysyn Hartman (rookie, Kansas State). |
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My final roster is as follows.
My big news is that I'm going to give up and switch to a 3-4. I'm having all sorts of problems in my front seven on defense, and I think they'll fare better as a 3-4 unit. My offense is coming together very well, but my defense is struggling. QB Russell Wilson (Seahawks) Mark Sanchez (Jets) Jimmy Clausen (Panthers) I may have a starting quarterback. (Two of them, actually.) HB Jamaal Charles C.J. Spiller. (Bills) Shaun Draughn Nate Eachus I like this situation with two speed merchants on top of the chart. Spiller should be increasing his carries in Buffalo. FB Peyton Hillis Hillis was a nice pickup. WR Dwayne Bowe Kendall Wright (Titans) Steve Breaston - WR Leonard Hankerson (Redskins) Greg Salas (Rams) Wide receiver is really coming together for me. Wright, Breaston, and Hankerson can man my #2 spot. Wright is a rookie 1st rounder who will start in Britt's absence in Tennessee, and Hankerson is a 2nd string guy expected to get lots of action in Washington. Salas is a third-stringer in St. Louis. TE Tony Gonzalez (Falcons) Kevin Boss - TE Steve Maneri - TE Set here with Tony and great depth. OT Branden Albert Eric Winston - RT Bruce Campbell (Raiders) Our free agent tackle helped a lot. We have young depth, too. I'm happy. Bruce Campbell was traded to Carolina and is a backup tackle there. G Brian Waters Jason Pinkston (Browns) Alex Boone (49ers) Lilja, Ryan Wade Smith We're going deep on the roster here because we have five NFL starters with Alex Boone blossoming in San Francisco. Pinkston and Boone are both starting. C Rodney Hudson (Chiefs) Not much depth. Hopefully Hudson does well. K Alex Henery (Eagles) Great shape here. Henery is a good kicker. P Dustin Colquitt Great shape here. FS Kendrick Lewis Travis Daniels Charles Mitchell (Falcons) Deep, but not scary, and Lewis is hurt. Mitchell is a rookie 2nd stringer with Atlanta. SS Reshad Jones (Dolphins) Abram Elam Tysyn Hartman - DB Jones is a starter for Miami, so I'm okay here and have depth. CB Brandon Flowers Stanford Routt - CB D.J. Moore (Bears) Alphonso Dennard (Patriots) This unit went from being deep to being very thin. Moore is a nickel back in Chicago, and Dennard is a rookie who made the Patriots but is deep in the depth chart. OLB Tamba Hali Chris Carter (Steelers) Zach Brown (Titans) Dekoda Watson (Buccaneers) Andy Studebaker I'm moving Hali back to his great OLB spot in the 3-4. On the other side, I'll put Chris Carter, I guess, who's backing up James Harrison in Pittsburgh. The other non-Chiefs are NFL second-stringers, Brown as a rookie and Watson in his third year. I have depth, but I need someone to step up beside Hali. ILB Derrick Johnson Rey Maualuga (Bengals) Brandon Siler - ILB Going back to a 3-4 lets me move Maualuga back to his natural position, and I'm strong here even if I lack depth. DE Glenn Dorsey Ropati Pitoitua Ronnell Lewis (Lions) Jonathan Massaquoi (Falcons) Da'Quan Bowers (Buccaneers) Another big problem area. Lewis and Massaquoi are both rookies, and Lewis is a second-stringer. Massaquoi is buried on the chart, though he's gotten some good reviews. Neither is big enough to be a 3-4 end, which may mean they're screwed in the long run. I invested a high pick in Bowers in my 4-3 defense and he's out for the year, most likely, with an offseason injury. I'm not sure how he'll fit even if he comes back. So Glenn and Ropati will be my guys. NT Ron Edwards Anthony Toribio Alex Carrington (Bills) Well, Ron Edwards is starting in Carolina, so he and Toribio will split snapes at NT. Carrington was moved by Buffalo from DE to OLB and now to DT. Not sure what's going on there, but he's not a NT, so I'm not sure what to do with him in the long run. Tough Cuts: Junior Hemingway (Chiefs) Leonard Pope Neiko Thorpe - DB Edgar Jones Demorrio Williams Smith, Shaun Myron Pryor (Patriots) Easy Cuts: Tyler Palko Brodie Croyle Jackie Battle Thomas Jones Tim Castille Taylor Gentry Derrick Williams (Lions) Brandon Kinnie - WR Zeke Markshausen - WR Jamar Newsome - WR Josh Bellamy - WR Chris Chambers Kevin Curtis Jeremy Horne Tim Biere - TE Lee Ziemba (Panthers) David Mims - OT Ryan O'Callaghan Duke Robinson (Panthers) Justin Cheadle - OL Cam Holland - OL Wiegmann, Casey Rob Bruggeman Matt Szymanski - K Kyle McCarthy Shiloh Keo (Texans) Jacques Reeves - DB Mikail Baker - DB Jean Fanor - DB Terrance Parks - DB Chandler Fenner - DB Bruce Miller (49ers) Caleb Campbell - LB Dexter Heyman - LB Charlie Anderson Eric Bakhtiari Justin Cole Luke Patterson - DL Ethan Johnson - DE Wallace Gilberry Amon Gordon Lawrence Guy (Packers) |
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Here is my 53 man roster:
QBI'm hurting here. I'm obviously hoping for a career year from someone. RBI'm comfortable with this backfield, but not ecstatic. Bernard Pierce is hobbled at the moment and it remains to be seen whether he is Ray Rice's heir apparent in Baltimore. For now though, the Charles/Hillis combo is pretty promising. WRI'm pretty thin here with David Reed currently on Baltimore's PUP list. TE Kevin BossI'm crossing my fingers for the health of Kevin Boss and I hope that one of my other two guys can block. OTI was pretty happy with my starting lineup until DeCastro disappeared for the season. Fortunately, I had more depth at Guard than at any other OL position so Ryan Lilja or Kraig Urbik can step in. My depth beyond that is pretty questionable though. KAdequate to good kickers, IMO. FSI have decent front line quality but I'm super thin here. I'm kicking myself for missing out on Abram Elam when the Chiefs picked him up. It looks like I'll be filling in with a lot of stiffs off the street this season. OLBI've got some decent linebackers, but depending on injuries or suspensions I may need to move Derrick Johnson back to OLB at some point. DEI still need someone to step up at NT. Hopefully Toribio or Powe can do the job this year. Ta'amu looks like he needs a year or two to develop. |
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I think you can pick up Elam, because he came to the Chiefs this season, right? The rule is that anyone who signs with the Chiefs as a free agent is on your training camp roster. |
QB
Mark Sanchez (Jets) Brady Quinn Ricky Stanzi Brock Osweiler (Broncos) RB Jamaal Charles Peyton Hillis Shaun Draughn Nate Eachus WR Dwayne Bowe Steve Breaston Jonathan Baldwin Dezmon Briscoe (Redskins) B.J. Cunningham (Eagles) Rishard Matthews (Dolphins) TE Chase Coffman (Falcons) Jake O'Connell Kevin Boss OT Branden Albert Eric Winston Selvish Capers (Giants) Donald Stephenson G Lilja, Ryan Jon Asamoah David DeCastro (Steelers) C Rodney Hudson K Ryan Succop P Dustin Colquitt S Eric Berry Geroge Iloka (Bengals) Abram Elam Tysyn Hartman CB Brandon Flowers Perrish Cox (49ers) Stanford Routt Jalil Brown OLB Tamba Hali Justin Houston Sergio Kindle (Ravens) Ricky Sapp (Jets) Edgar Jones ILB Derrick Johnson Jovan Belcher Vontaze Burflict (Bengals) DE Glenn Dorsey Allen Bailey Ropati Pitoitua NT Terrence Cody (Ravens) Cam Thomas (Chargers) Jerrell Powe Alameda Ta'amu (Steelers) |
I am really stacked at NT. And no Poe.
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WOOT! My 7B pick for 2012 is a starter already. For the Bengals, but still. :)
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...r-the-bengals/ |
My offense is actually looking pretty good. I may have to replace Tony G and I could use a fourth WR, but overall my offense is pretty decent.
My special teams is good, so no problem there. On defense, my linebackers are now pretty decent with the emergence of Zach Brown. They're good. However, I need a free safety, a #2 cornerback, and nickel back, and my defensive line is a disaster. I'm debating whether I'll get another QB with my 1st pick or not. I may just go all defensive line and defensive backs in this draft. Sheesh. Quote:
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Kendall Wright in the first looks like a strong starter alongside Bowe. Zach Brown in the second got 5.5 sacks and 3 ints as a rookie and claimed a starting job for me at OLB. Russell Wilson in the third gives me a QB. Alphonso Dennard in the seventh got half a dozen starts and three interceptions, which may be filling my hole at #2 CB. I think my offense is pretty darn good now, and I've got four solid linebacker starters. My defensive line is the thing that I can't solve at the moment, along with free safety. |
Really, Russell Wilson may be "checkmate" on this whole deal for awhile. I'll most likely be going with Geno this year, maybe Tyler depending on where they each land. But damn. Well played. Not even sure if there is a point to posting a poll in the Lounge this year.
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The more interesting poll, which I'm considering this year, is a "did these teams show better drafting than Pioli" poll. It'd be kind of interesting, but we might all benefit from some intense dislike of anything Pioli. I'm really not sure if I'll ride the Wilson ship or if I'll draft Geno anyway. I figure it can't hurt to have depth at that position. |
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Looking forward to keeping this rolling and watching it continue to evolve. |
Ok I liked this ill base on what I thought last year I'll be honest the only two picks I'll change are Wilson and burfict in seventh. I still need to find my roster but lets do this again this year.
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How about this? Take your last roster, and from there you can add the Chiefs' drafts and free agents until you get caught up. I think that's the fair way to go, and now you can start again with the upcoming draft. Wazu and patteeu, does that seem fair? |
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I had another thought about stuff as we get ready to go into the draft. I don't think this affects anybody yet, so it's a good time to decide it. If we draft a player from a team other than the Chiefs, what do we do if they leave their team via free agency? We remove Chiefs who leave via free agency, so it seems fair to do it to others. For example, I have CJ Spiller. If he moves from his team via free agency, it seems like I should lose him, too. However, it may be a hassle to do that unless we have people do it on their own teams via the honor system. I'm not sure there's a great way to do it because I can't really track every player as our rosters diverge. Should we remove them ourselves for our own teams, or just leave them be? I also recognize that we have an inherent disadvantage in not being able to sign our own free agents, so perhaps the advantage of keeping our drafted free agents merely offsets this disadvantage. (I'm rationalizing, of course.) |
As prep for the draft, changes to everyone's rosters so far due to free agency are as follows. Lots of changes this offseason.
Trades Option to trade a 2nd this year and a future pick for QB Alex Smith. Prior to the draft, report whether you accept or reject this trade. These players were all cut, but you have the option to keep them. release OT Eric Winston release WR Steve Breaston release TE Kevin Boss release TE Steve Maneri release QB Matt Cassel release K Matt Szymanski release OLB Andy Studebaker release OG Rich Ranglin You can add these players to your training camp roster for the upcoming season. sign CB Dunta Robinson $15m/3 years sign S Hasain Abdullah sign WR Mardy Gilyard sign DT Marcus Dixon sign TE Kevin Brock sign TE Anthony Fasano 4 years sign QB Chase Daniel 3 years sign DE Mike DeVito $12.6m/3 years sign WR Donnie Avery 3 years sign CB Sean Smith $18m/3 years ($11m guaranteed) sign OT/OG Geoff Schwartz sign FB Ryan D'Imperio sign LB Chad Kilgore sign LB Frank Zombo sign OL Tommie Draheim |
One note on released Chiefs players - if we draft somebody that the Chiefs also draft, do we at least get to keep them regardless of whether or not the Chiefs do? I don't think it's come up yet, but just thinking. Seems like we should be able to.
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Honestly, I'd prefer to have free agent losses on all sides, but it'll just be a pain to track so I'm fine to no longer lose free agents. It might give us a bit of a net advantage, but probably not much when you consider that we can't use free agency to fill our own gaps. So henceforth, no free agent losses unless it's a Chief who was on the team prior to 2009. Oh, wait. Are you thinking about cuts, too, e.g., Eric Winston? |
Never mind. We've always had the option to keep cut players. I'll go back and correct my previous post about releasing players.
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Even with the painful 35 percent discount I'm seriously considering trading down with my #1 pick. My key question is whether I take a good and safe OT that I will likely need next year, or a somewhat more risky DT that I'm desperate for this year. I'm still struggling a little with this whole free agent thing. It seems a little unfair for us to never lose a free agent, but it could also be a pain to monitor it for the lower tier players. Any ideas? I'd like for us to fight the free agent battle along with the NFL Chiefs. At a minimum, I'm thinking that we shouldn't get compensatory picks starting next year if we don't lose free agents. This year we should get them because we all lost Brandon Carr, but if for example Albert walks and we keep him, we shouldn't get compensated for it. |
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I, too, am accepting the trade.
*Runs over to the corner of the room and pukes his guts out.* |
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And I think the honor system holds true. There are only 3 of us. We can look back and see who we drafted. If I passed on Baldwin, but he blows up, I won't claim to have him on my roster. There's no point. I just want to have some fun with this and see it continue to evolve. |
Okay, that settles it. We'll take compensatory picks this year, and henceforth we will not lose free agents other than Chiefs. We'll review it as we go to see if that gives us an unfair advantage or not.
If I can keep Albert and Winston, that'll help me a ton. |
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Edit: I guess we all lose Glenn Dorsey this year, too. Have we had anyone else walk? Oh, yeah. Brady Quinn. Anyone else? Dorsey hurts me because he and Toribio are my only true tackles. Alex Carrington plays there a little, but he's not really a tackle. If Da'Quan Bowers ever comes back and justifies my first-round pick I'd like to go with a 4-3, but it's hard to do that when you have no defensive tackles. I think I may be stocking up on DTs in this draft. |
Hmm, I just had an idea that I think could be fun.
On our trade up and trade down scenarios, we introduced the "tax" (15 percent on trade up, 35 percent on trade down) because we know where the players were drafted. The tax offsets the perfect knowledge. But what if we trade up or down BEFORE the draft? If that's the case, I think it would be reasonable to get full value. What do you think about changing the tradeup/trade down rules to this? 1. If you trade up or down before the draft, you can trade at full value. However, this is irreversible. Once you make the call to do it, you can't go back and switch. You can make as many of these trades as you like as long as they only involve draft picks. 2. You can still trade up or down after the draft, in which case the rules in the thread header still apply. If we really wanted to be pure, we would eliminate the second option and only go with the first. I could do that, though I think it's fun to do the tradeup/trade down thing. |
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I'm good with the new trade rule.
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(Banging gavel.) Okay, new trade rule is in.
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Hmm. I've been looking at draft points under the new rule. So if I trade with, say, Philadelphia at the #4 pick before the draft I would get every pick in their draft. Every one of them, and I'd still be giving up points. I realize that we have an oddity this year in having the #1 pick, but does that seem reasonable?
I haven't thought about how we would value future picks and probably wouldn't remember that I have one anyway, so I'm thinking I'll just stick with this year's picks. I think I would make that trade prior to the draft, but want to confirm that it's a reasonable thing. Or is a pre-draft trade at face value too generous? We're assuming that we could make the trade in real life, and that may not always be the case. |
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I'm not a big fan of trades that involve future picks just because of the bookkeeping involved, but if you guys want to keep that option, that's fine with me. I'll probably just stick with same-season trades anyway. |
So are you proposing that the draft rules are:
Prior to the draft: 1. You can trade up at face value. 2. You can trade down at face value, but are limited to only two picks more in receipt than you give up. After the draft: 1. You can trade up, but your picks are at a 15 percent discount. 2. You can trade down, but your picks are at a 35 percent discount and you are limited to only two picks more in receipt than you give up. I made it "two picks more" in case you do something with a package of your own picks, which is not unreasonable. I guess this opens a little room for abuse if I package my 1, 6, and 7, for a 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5, but I'm not sure it's indefensible to do that, especially if you've got the #1 choice. Given our small group, we can probably rely on the honor system to do trades that aren't completely infeasible. Honestly, this probably wouldn't even arise as an issue of concern if we didn't have the #1 pick and its exponential power. I was quite tempted to trade down ahead of the draft, but I think I'll hold off. If the Chiefs make a trade down I'll consider it, but I might wait until after the draft since I'm not sure how realistic a prior trade down will be. Also, I think I've got my target and I want to see how far he falls. |
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There are a lot of players that interest me this year. While I'm glad I don't need linebackers in the short term, I sure hate to pass up on a couple of them out there. But I probably don't have a choice. |
Ok updating as I go I'll have it done tonight and as I said I'll only take chiefs picks from 2012
Trades Reject Alex Smith trade Resign Brandon Carr don't get comp third rounder sign CB Dunta Robinson $15m/3 years sign S Hasain Abdullah sign WR Mardy Gilyard sign DT Marcus Dixon sign TE Kevin Brock sign TE Anthony Fasano 4 years sign QB Chase Daniel 3 years sign DE Mike DeVito $12.6m/3 years sign WR Donnie Avery 3 years sign CB Sean Smith $18m/3 years ($11m guaranteed) sign OT/OG Geoff Schwartz sign FB Ryan D'Imperio sign LB Chad Kilgore sign LB Frank Zombo sign OL Tommie Draheim qb: I unlike the chiefs have a young qb being groomed rb: same as chiefs wr: stronger than the chiefs with crabtree and bowe Te: unfortunately i didn't draft moeaki so i'm weaker OL: I have youthfull backups but like chiefs need a rt c: stronger i have matt tenet as the hier apparent to wegman k and P: same as chieffs De: more youth than chiefs with selvie added DT: stronger than chiefs with Cam Thomas OLB bout the same as chiefs ILB : stronger with spikes and DJ Cb: same as chiefs S: weaker cause no SS kendrick lewis overall stronger than the chiefs in certain areas draft needs in no order TE, RT, qb, RB WR unlike the chiefs i'm good at DT. 2009 draft #3- Michael Crabtree - WR Texas Tech (49ers) #67- Jaron Gilbert - DE San Jose ST (Bears) #102- Brandon Williams - OLB/DE. Texas Tech (cowboys) #139- Cornellius Ingram- TE Florida (eagles) #175- A. Gardner- OT Georgia Tech (dolphins) #212- AQ Shipley- OC. Penn State (steelers) #237- Darry Beckwith- ILB LSU. (chargers) #256- Ryan Succop- PK. South Carolina. (chiefs) 2010 draft 1st: Eric Berry S Tennessee 2nd: Javier Arenas CB Alabama 2nd: Brandon Spikes ILB Florida 3rd: Jon Asamoah OG Illinois 4th: Kam Chancelor FS Virginia Tech 5th: CAm Thomas NT North Carolina 5th: John Skelton QB Fordham 5th: Matt Tenet OC Boston College 6th: George Selvie OLB South Florida 2011 Draft 1. Mark Ingram rb alabama 2. Dontay. Moch. OLB. Nevada 3. Leonard Hankerson WR. Miami 3. Allen. Bailey. DE. Miami 4. Owen Marecic. FB. Stanford 5. Ricky Stanzi. QB. Iowa 5. Ahmad. Black. S. Florida 6. Jerrel Powe NT Mississippi 7. Lee Ziemba. OT. Auburn 2012 Draft: 1. DT Dontari Powe Memphis 2. OL Jeff Allen Illinois 3. OT Donald Stephenson Oklahoma 4. WR Devon Wiley Fresno State 5. DB Dequan Menzie Alabama 6. RB Cyrus Gray Texas A & M 7. DE Jerome Long San Diego State 7. WR Junior Hemingway Michigan ok done some thinking traded Tank Tyler midseason, traded thigpen when we did never traded for the two bumbs in Miami. so with that 1st, 2 2nds, 3rd, 4th, 3 5ths, and a 6th QB 7 Cassel, Matt QB 15 starts 15 skelton, john qb 1 start 12 Ricky Stanzi HB 25 Charles, Jamaal - 6 starts 28 Mark Ingram - 42 Cyrus Gray FB 44 Owen Maric WR 82 Bowe, Dwayne - 16 starts 15 Michael Crabtree -15 starts 87 Leonard Hankerson 88 Junior Hemmingway 17 Devon Wiley TE 49 leonard pope - 6 starts 81 Kevin Boss ? Scrub T 76 Albert, Branden - 15 starts 75 Eric Winston 79 Donald Stephenson 74 Lee Ziemba G 74 Smith, Wade G 16 starts 73 Asomah, john - 1 start 72 Jeff Allen C 62 wegman casey - 16 starts 61 matt tenet K 6 Ryan Succop K South Carolina- 16 starts P 2 Colquitt, Dustin P - 16 starts LS 43 Thomas Gafford FS 37 Kam Chancelor 21 arenas - 1 start 38 Neiko Thorpe SS 29 berry, eric - 16 starts Ahmad Black 31 Tyson Hrtman CB 24 Flowers, Brandon 15 starts 39 Carr, Brandon - 16 starts 21 arenas, javier - 1 start OLB 91 Hali, Tamba - 16 starts 51 Brandon Spikes 96 Studebaker, Andy 52 Brandon Williams 99 Edgar Jones ILB 56 Johnson, Derrick - 16 starts 51 spikes, brandon - 8 starts 59 Belcher, Jovan - 8 starts 95 greenwood, correy DE 97 Allen Bailey 72 Dorsey, Glenn - 16 starts 94 gillberry, wallace -2 starts 90 Smith, Shaun - 10 starts 78 Ropati Pitoitua DT 93 Jerrell Powe 92 Dontari Poe 93 Thomas, CAm IR 49 Dequan Menzie 52 Dontay Moch |
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Current Chiefs roster (recall that Dorsey is gone) You can keep any Chiefs player cut in the offseason (e.g., Winston) Subtract any Chief drafted in 2011 Hmm, I think that's it. |
Ok ready for the draft now
made some good picks over the years and some bad ones trutfully there is no way I would have made these picks last year that is one bad draft Ok so i keep carr so no third comp pick but still receive sixth comp As it stands However I"m not figuring out starts right now 1st no 1 2nd KC pick traded to SF 3rd Kc pick 4th Kc pick 5th Kc pick 6th Kc pick 6th comp 7th Kc pick |
One correction, Chiefscafan. Brandon Carr walked, so you have to drop him. You get the third round comp selection, though.
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I thought we didn't have to cut people chiefs cut or let go
That was the understanding I had so now I can't keep Carr? |
So if Albert is traded I have to accept the trade?
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If the player leaves and isn't cut, you lose them. So guys like Carr and Dorsey go and you can't control it. Guys that the Chiefs cut are your option to cut or keep, and guys that the Chiefs trade are your option to accept or reject as long as they're still on your roster. Going forward, we'll stop losing free agents as long as they weren't Chiefs before the start of the game in 2009. So if Albert leaves, we'll still lose him, but if Eric Berry leaves we can keep him. But we won't get compensatory picks going forward. This will be the last year unless the Chiefs lose a big name that was there prior to 2009. |
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Planning out my trade for Geno, and it keeps getting better. My understanding is that based on the chart we are using, the 1.1 pick is worth 3,000, so I just need to subtract 35% of that, and then I can go shopping.
35% = 1050 So That means I have 1950 points that I can go find, and trade 1.1 for, correct? (Edit: Obviously all being from the same team.) |
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I'm doing the same thing, but pondering Star Lotulelei as my guy. I need a tackle. |
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One more question - I realize I am only allowed one trade of picks. I assume that means I get to pick one trading partner, and any combination of picks that they/I have as long as it fits with the chart. Do those picks have to be picks that are owned prior to the first pick that would have been selected? I'm assuming so. Reason I ask is I was considering trade with Vikings, but then they traded some picks and moved up. Do I trade with their "new" reality? Or the one that they began the day with?
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I'm pretty sure that I'm going to trade down to the Jets. That works out almost perfectly for me. I'll move down from #1 to #13, most likely picking up Star Lotolelei, and then I'll pick up an early 2nd round and mid 3rd round pick. I'm not sure that's what I'm doing yet, but it's my initial inkling. |
As we head into the draft, my team's needs are pretty clear. The defensive line needs major help, and we have a couple of other holes that may have stopgap solutions for the time being.
High priority Starting DT/NT Starting OT, likely a RT if we can keep Albert. Depends on what happens with Winston. Starting DE Another starting DT if we go 4-3 Starting FS Backup QB Moderate priority Another starting DE Future TE if this is Tony G's last season Low priority Backup C 3rd string QB Backup OT Backup OLB Upgrade/backup at ILB, but only if we stay at 3-4 |
Ok I'm confused if I do the jets trade what exactly do I get back? The two firsts and a second or more cause I'll do that trade , but who would the jets take?
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The Jets have the following picks, and they get full value for them. The pick is shown below, along with the point value: 1-9 1350 1-13 1150 2-39 510 3-72 230 5-141 35.5 6-178 21.2 7-215 6.4 The Chiefs hold the following picks. In any trade up scenario, these picks are valued at .65 of their face value. So I show their picks below, along with the trade value and their face value. Recall that, per NFL rules, teams cannot trade their compensatory picks, which for the Chiefs are the 3-96 and 6-204 picks. 1-1 1950 3000 2-34 364 560 3-63 179.4 276 3-96 0 (Cannot be traded) 4-99 67.6 104 5-134 25.4 39 6-170 15.9 24.4 6-204 0 (Cannot be traded) 7-207 6.2 9.6 You can then make any trades as long as the value of your discounted picks is more than the value that you gain, and you cannot acquire more than two picks beyond what you give up. So some reasonable scenarios might be: Trade your 1-1 pick (1,950 points) and 3-63 pick (179.4 points) for the Jets' 1-9 pick (1,350 points), 2-39 (510 points), 3-72 (230 points) and 5-141 picks (35.5 points). You give up 2,129.4 points and 2 picks, and you get back 2,125.5 points and 4 picks. Winner. Trade your 1-1 pick (1,950 points), 6-170 (15.9 points and 7-207 (6.2 points) for the Jets' 1-13 pick (1,150 points), 2-39 pick (510 points), 3-72 pick (230 points), and 5-141 (35.5 points), and 6-178 picks (21.2 points). You give up 1,972.1 points and 3 picks, and you get back 1,946.2 points and 5 picks. Winner. Trade your 1-1 pick (1,950 points), 2-34 pick (364 points), 3-65 pick (172 points), and 6-170 pick (15.9 points), for the Jets 1-9 pick (1,350 points), 1-13 pick (1,150 points), and 7-215 pick (6.4 points). You give up 2,509.3 points and 4 picks, and you get back 2,506.4 points and 3 picks. Winner. Since the Jets are a good potential trade partner, I've included an Excel-based calculator to figure out potential trades with them. |
Ok I'm taking this scenario
Trade your 1-1 pick (1,950 points), 6-170 (15.9 points and 7-207 (6.2 points) for the Jets' 1-13 pick (1,150 points), 2-39 pick (510 points), 3-72 pick (230 points), and 5-141 (35.5 points), and 6-178 picks (21.2 points). You give up 1,972.1 points and 3 picks, and you get back 1,946.2 points and 5 picks. Winner. NFL Draft 2013: 1-13: OLB Jarvis Jones Georgia 2-39: QB Geno Smith WVU 3-63: TE Travis Kelcie Cincinnati 3-72: WR Stedman Bailey WVU 3-96: OC Brian Schwenkie California 4-99: OG/OT Barrett Jones Alabama 5-134: DT Jessie Williams Alabama 5-141: ILB AJ Klien Iowa State 6-178: DE Joe Kruger Utah 6-204: DE/OLB Mike Capatano Princeton |
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Actually, in that Jets trade scenario you can keep your 6th round pick and give up their 6th round pick and be slightly better off. Just remove the 6th rounders from the trade.
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After considerable gnashing of teeth, I have my draft. I'll unveil it after sleeping on it.
This year was really, really hard. There were only a few no-brainers for me, and several agonizingly hard decisions. I will begin by stating that we reject the Alex Smith trade, thus keeping our 2nd round pick. We will also trade our 1-1 pick to the Jets, along with our 7-207, and we will receiver the Jets' 1-13, 2-39, 3-72, and 5-141 picks in return. In this scenario, we acquire 1,925.5 points and four picks, and we give up 1,956.2 points and two picks. We therefore enter the draft with 11 selections. 1-13 2-34 2-39 3-63 3-72 3-96 4-99 5-134 5-141 6-170 6-204 |
Okay, here goes. My team's 2013 draft.
Note the post below, in which we traded our 1-1 pick and our 7-207 pick for the Jets' 1-13, 2-39, 3-72, and 5-141 picks. While I needed an OT, it was a no-brainer to trade down and pick up so many high picks even at a massive discount. We also decline the Alex Smith trade and thus keep our 2-34 pick as well. This leaves us with 11 picks. And here we go... Round 1, Pick 13 - Star Lotulelei, DT (Panthers) We desperately need multiple DTs, and I liked Star because he can apparently play 3-4 NT, 3-4 DE, or 4-3 DT. The only other player I considered was Jarvis Jones, but while I like him we don't have a need at OLB and we had a desperate need at DT. He will immediately move to the top of the depth chart as a starter at either 4-3 DT or 3-4 DE. Round 2, Pick 34 - Geno Smith, QB (Jets) This was a much harder pick than one would guess. For much of my consideration Geno was not my guy, and I was figuring I would take DT Jonathan Hankins with this pick to continue beefing up my line. But in the end I couldn't pass up a likely starting QB with only a second-round pick. Geno will back up Russell Wilson as my likely second-string QB and insurance policy. Round 2, Pick 39 - Menelik Watson, OT (Raiders) I struggled with this pick. Hankins was still available and highly attractive, and I really wanted him. He was my second choice yet again. I also strongly considered DT Kawann Short and TE Gavin Escobar, and flirted with ILB Kevin Minter, DE Margus Hunt, and even DE Tank Carradine. But in the end, this whole Eric Winston thing screwed me over. I only have Branden Albert, Winston, and Carolina backup Bruce Campbell as holdovers, and I need someone who can step in and start at RT. If I didn't take Watson, my only other option was Terron Armstead in the third, and I decided that Watson was a better risk Round 3, Pick 63 - Travis Kelce, TE (Chiefs) This was purely a need pick. I think my fullbacks are headed out of the league, and my starting TE, Tony Gonzalez, is likely in his last year. I considered Escobar as a long-term replacement, but landed on Kelce because I can play him as an H-back type this year, and either leave him in that position long term or move him to TE when Tony retires. I'm not thrilled about this pick because I really wanted and needed DE Demontre Moore here, but Kelce was the only strong candidate who could fill my roster hole. He'll likely move into the starting lineup as an H-back. Round 3, Pick 72 - Brandon Williams, DT (Ravens) This is my year to fix the defensive line. I was very torn between Williams and DT John Jenkins, who seemed to be ranked a little higher. I went with Williams because he's a little more versatile (4-3 DT and 3-4 NT as opposed to purely a NT) and because he has a history of generating a pass rush inside. I really hated passing on Jenkins and it killed me to watch Demontre Moore go off the board. But I need versatile DTs. I also strongly considered WR Keenan Allen as a BPA move, but receiver isn't an area of great need. OT Terron Armstead got a long look too, as I pondered whether to take him or Watson (Round 2) or both. In the end, though, I have to fix my DT spot since my incumbents were Alex Carrington (fine backup), Anthony Toribio (backup), and Ron Edwards (retiring, I think). Brandon will likely move into the starting lineup as either my NT in a 3-4 or as a 4-3 DT. Round 3, Pick 96 - Tyler Wilson, QB (Raiders) Controversial pick here. If I was going to take a developmental quarterback, Matt Barkley was still available. But in the end I like Tyler Wilson's prospects more, and he can sit at third string behind Russell Wilson and Geno Smith and get some seasoning. There were a bunch of players I really liked here, including DT Akeem Spence, DE Alex Okafor, WR/PR Ace Sanders, WR Quentin Patton, RB Marcus Lattimore, LB Jelani Jenkins, C Barrett Jones, FS Phillip Thomas, and C Brian Schwenke. I need a backup C, a returner, a backup RB, and a starting FS, so these guys were hard to pass up. But in the end, it's all about the quarterback and I need insurance there. I can get by in these other areas in the short term. Round 4, Pick 99 - Denard Robinson, RB/KR (Jaguars) All of the guys in the previous paragraph were still available for this pick, and I liked a lot of them. My initial thought was Spence or maybe Okafor, and I also took a long look at Schwenke. But when I started analyzing my roster, I realized that I really needed a returner. Ace Sanders rose to my top, but he's a receiver and I have depth there. I kept looking to see if I could find a RB who could be a returner. While Lattimore was very intriguing as a long-term play at RB, he didn't solve my return problem. Then I found Denard Robinson down further. During the draft, one of the talking heads was the coach of Notre Dame, and he made some comments about Robinson being the most dynamic playmaker he had faced this year. The Jags are apparently going to make him a RB and returner, so I'm taking him as a high-risk, high-reward candidate. He'll be a third-stringer behind Jamaal Charles and C.J. Spiller, but will contribute as a returner and potential gadget. My backfield is built on speed, baby! Round 5, Pick 134 - Jesse Williams, DT (Seahawks) This was a no-brainer. I need DTs, and this guy slipped way further than I thought. Apparently there's some long-term concern about his knee, but screw that. Perfect value pick that fills a need. Never even really considered anyone else other than a look at RB Stepfan Taylor. Williams will battle for a starting DT or NT job. Round 5, Pick 141 - A.J. Klein, ILB (Panthers) I probably should have taken DE Quanterus Smith or DE Lavar Edwards here and looked really hard at Smith, but I have no depth at ILB and I liked Klein as a prospect. If we go 3-4 he'll fight Rey Maualuga for a starting job alongside Derrick Johnson, or if we go 4-3 he'll fight for a backup job. I also briefly considered WR Tavarres King and G/T Oday Aboushi, but didn't feel that they offered an upgrade over my current roster. Round 6, Pick 170 - Bacarri Rambo, FS (Redskins) One area of need that I haven't addressed so far is FS, where my current starter is Kendrick Lewis. I need to upgrade, but couldn't justify a high pick on the position given other needs. Rambo is a character risk with talent, so I figure he has a fighting chance to unseat Lewis as my starter or at least be a backup. I also strongly considered OT David Quessenberry, RB Kenjon Barner, and TE Nick Kasa at this spot, particularly Quessenberry. Round 6, Pick 204 - Jordan Poyer, CB (Eagles) I wasn't sure what to do with this spot, and CB isn't a strong area of need. I looked at Poyer, who seemed like a really good value pick, and was also very interested in ILB Mike Mauti, DE Armonty Bryant, and FBs Braden Wilson and Tommy Bohannan. The latter two were of interest more to divert the third round pick from Kelce to Demontre Moore. Undrafted FAs WR Da'Rick Rogers and ILB Kevin Reddick also interested me. But in the end I already had Klein at ILB, and it's hard to predict if fullbacks will even make the final cuts. I went with Poyer as a safe, talent-adding pick, even if CB isn't a real need. When all was said and done, the two guys I really lament passing on are DE Demontre Moore and DT Jonathan Hankins. They could have really helped. I also think that WR Keenan Allen and WR Quentin Patton could be steals, but I just had too many other fires to put out and have a good pair of starting WRs already. |
I still need to add some training camp fodder, but right now my depth chart looks like this (rookies in red):
QB Russell Wilson (Seahawks) Geno Smith (Jets) Tyler Wilson (Raiders) Mark Sanchez (Jets) QB Chase Daniel 3 years Jimmy Clausen (Panthers)* Wilson is certainly a pro bowl find at QB, and I hope he maintains his performance. I have a couple of developmental prospects behind him, most likely. We'll see if Sanchez and Daniel can compete for a spot. HB Jamaal Charles* C.J. Spiller. (Bills)* Denard Robinson (Jaguars) Shaun Draughn Nate Eachus High quality here with two star pro bowl running backs, and Robinson will handle my return duties. Draughn and Eachus will battle for a roster spot. FB/H-Back Travis Kelce (Chiefs) FB Ryan D'Imperio Peyton Hillis Most likely Kelce, but if D'Imperio makes a good showing I could move Kelce back to TE. WR Dwayne Bowe* Kendall Wright (Titans) WR Donnie Avery 3 years Leonard Hankerson (Redskins) WR Mardy Gilyard Greg Salas (Rams) Steve Breaston - WR I like my starters in Bowe and Wright, and Avery will fit right into the slot. Hankerson is a good fourth receiver and we'll have a battle at the bottom for a roster spot. TE Tony Gonzalez (Falcons) Anthony Fasano Kevin Brock Kevin Boss Steve Maneri Obviously strong here with a pro bowler starting, though I need a succession plan. Kelce is most likely that plan, and Fasano will be a good backup. I like what's happening here. OT Branden Albert* Menelik Watson (Raiders) Bruce Campbell (Raiders/Panthers)* Eric Winston - RT OL Tommie Draheim Depending on what happens with Winston, I'm thin here. I'll be starting a rookie and my backup isn't exactly proven, though I can also slide Scwartz out. Albert is a rock, though. This may be the weak link of my offense. G Wade Smith* Alex Boone (49ers)* Jason Pinkston (Browns) Geoff Schwartz Lilja, Ryan Brian Waters* Good talent and depth. Wade was a pro bowler last year. No problems at all here. C Rodney Hudson (Chiefs) I hope he develops. Worst case, if he doesn't or if he gets hurt I can move Wade Smith easily into this position. He and Watson will be the two starters to watch. K Alex Henery (Eagles) Perfectly fine. P Dustin Colquitt* Pro bowler. FS Kendrick Lewis* Baccari Rambo (Redskins) Charles Mitchell (Falcons) S Hasain Abdullah Travis Daniels* I really wanted to upgrade this position with a strong starter, but couldn't justify it. Rambo may challenge a bit, but otherwise Kendrick will last until I can upgrade. SS Reshad Jones (Dolphins)* Abram Elam Tysyn Hartman - DB I'm very strong here as Jones is a rising star. Depth? Meh. CB Brandon Flowers* Alphonso Dennard (Patriots) CB Sean Smith D.J. Moore (Bears)* Jordan Poyer (Eagles) CB Dunta Robinson Stanford Routt I really like this position even though it's not star-studded. Flowers will lock down one side, and then I'm going to have a battle royale between the rest of them to get the other starting job and the nickel and dime slots. OLB Tamba Hali* Zach Brown (Titans) LB Frank Zombo Chris Carter (Steelers) Dekoda Watson (Buccaneers)* Andy Studebaker* LB Chad Kilgore I wasn't sure what to do with this unit. Hali is a strong starter and Zach Brown had a great rookie season. It's pretty journeyman behind them, but I think it's reasonable. ILB Derrick Johnson* Rey Maualuga (Bengals)* AJ Klein (Panthers) Brandon Siler - ILB I like Klein as a backup and my starters are strong. I wouldn't mind if Klein challenged Maualuga for a starting job if we go 3-4. DE DE Mike DeVito Da'Quan Bowers (Buccaneers) Ropati Pitoitua Ronnell Lewis (Lions) Jonathan Massaquoi (Falcons) I desperately wanted to upgrade this unit, but it didn't work out. If we go 3-4 I'll put Devito out there along with Star Lotulelei. If we go 4-3, my hope is that Bowers is up to a starting job. I've been patient with him and I need him to deliver on his pass rush potential. I have depth here even if it's not wow. NT Star Lotulelei (Panthers) Brandon Williams (Ravens) Jesse Williams (Seahawks) Alex Carrington (Bills)* Anthony Toribio DT Marcus Dixon Ron Edwards* This was obviously an area of emphasis, and my goal was to get guys who could run in a 4-3 or 3-4. All of my rookies can be a DT in the 3-4 or the 4-3, and I can move Star out to DE in a 3-4. We'll see how training camp goes. My hope is that this influx of talented rookies will solve my DT problem. Overall, it's coming together well. I have pro bowlers on offense at QB, HB, HB, TE, and LG, and no gaping holes despite a little concern at C and RT. My P is a pro bowler and my K is good. And my defense, which really needed some help, got an infusion of talent, particularly on the line. If Bowers looks promising at DE I may go 4-3, or if not, I'll go 3-4 with Star out at DE. I could be stronger at DE and FS, and I'm relying on rookies to deliver at NT, but I feel pretty good about my LBs, CBs, and SS. I have two pro bowlers on defense in Derrick Johnson and Tamba Hali. Only two NFL teams put more pro bowlers on the field last year, and I'm infusing a lot of talent. I like where this season is headed. |
For got to add my chief second rounder
I'll do it tomorrow |
Ok CB/S Dave Amerson NC State
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The Fresno Refugees accepted the Alex Smith trade very begrudgingly. I can't stand the trade for the actual real Chiefs, but the reality was that going into this draft, I could not anticipate what situation any of the rookie QBs would be drafted into on their real life teams. So the only way to have near-certainty that my team would have a QB who is actually starting in the NFL was to accept a trade for a QB who I am not excited about. That won't stop me from continuing to swing and miss at this position until our franchise QB is found.
In addition to the Alex Smith trade, we are trading our 1-1 pick to the Cardinals, along with our 4-99 and 7-207, and receiving the Cardinals' 1-7 and 2-38 picks in return. The Fresno Refugees 2013 Draft Class: 1-7: Tavon Austin, WR (Rams) 2-38: Geno Smith, QB (Jets) 3-63: Travis Kelce, TE (Chiefs) 3-96: Tyler Wilson, QB (Raiders) 5-134: Jesse Williams, DT (Seahawks) 6-170: John Boyett, S (Colts) 6-204: Jordan Poyer, CB (Eagles) To answer all of your questions - YES, Rainman stole most of my picks by pre-emptively reading my mind and posting before I could. Seriously, though, first four were no-brainers for me given how much I liked those two QBs. I just don't believe the negativity about this quarterback class and am insisting that I be proven wrong the hard way. Was also glad to see the Chiefs take a TE I like. Was not sure he was my favorite, but seemed like a good time to go with the flow. Williams and Poyer at first seemed like fantastic coincidences that we both drafted, but then again those are two players who fell pretty far from where they were projected, so not surprising that they caught the attention of multiple armchair GMs who have limited visibility to the other players taken in late rounds. I did not see them on Rainman's list prior to selecting. |
So three of us have independently selected Jesse Williams in the fifth round. How fascinating. I wonder what NFL teams were reluctant about relative to what we know.
The three drafters so far have an uncanny amount of overlap. Frankly, I drafted Kelce begrudgingly for need more than anything, so others see more than I do, and I was also hesitant about Geno but decided he was worth the risk. It'll be interesting to see how these guys turn out. |
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I drafted Geno on general principle. I would have spent first overall. In fact even today I'd happily trade Fisher to the Jets for Geno straight-up. All of the criticism was cause for some pause, but bottom line is he was clearly the best QB in the draft, and our team desperately needs a franchise QB. Gotta roll the dice. Without a top QB everything else we do is just window dressing. With Kelce, I wasn't a fan when I first saw the pick, but it grew on me after I learned more. I've been struggling at that spot ever since agreeing to the disastrous Tony Gonzalez trade. The fact that he is in a good situation and was drafted by the Chiefs made it an easy decision. |
I'll get to this soon. I swear I'm not just waiting so I can copy off of the three of you.
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Here are my picks, sorry it's so late: 1.13 (13) - Sheldon Richardson DT (Jets) 2.07 (39) - Cornellius Carradine DE (49ers) 3.01 (63) - Terrance Williams WR (Cowboys) 3.10 (72) - Terron Armstead OT (Saints) 3.34 (96) - Knile Davis RB 4.02 (99) - Josh Boyce WR (Patriots) 5.01 (134) - Sanders Commings CB 5.08 (141) - Oday Aboushi OT (Jets) 6.02 (170) - Ryan Swope WR (retired) 6.36 (204) - Vince Williams LB (Steelers) I know Ryan Swope is retired, but I was high on him so I would have taken him if I'd done this right after the draft. I'm also adding these guys to my roster: Chase Daniel QB Tyler Bray QB Ryan D'Imperio FB Donnie Avery WR Anthony Fasano TE Demetrius Harris TE Marcus Dixon DE Mike DeVito DE Frank Zombo LB Akeem Jordan LB Edgar Jones LB And cutting: Eric Winston Kevin Boss Steve Breaston Matt Cassel Brady Quinn Ricky Stanzi Nate Eachus Peyton Hillis Ryan Lilja Abram Elam Stanford Routt |
Armstead and Aboushi were two guys I was giving a long look at, and I finally went with Menelik Watson in the second. It'll be interesting to see if Armstead or Watson ends up being the keeper.
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So here's a thought. How hard would it be to use the Sandbox Simulations engine to rate our final 53 man rosters?
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