No.

Those two turds will likely have contributed about 12 WAR by the end of the season (in 4.5 seasons).

There's also the Jake Odorizzi piece, without which the James Shields deal probably doesn't get done.

Greinke deal was not a salary dump.

So? Greinke did 8.4 by himself in only 2 years. A much more compressed time frame. He was vastly superior to that duo by himself. Of course, he did cost a lot more. And you know where I'm going with that right?

And they control both Escobar and Cain for many more years. I wouldn't be surprised if they get 25-30 WAR from those two over the course of their careers with KC. They're both guys who have value driven by their glove, but value is value.

Also don't forget they traded a malcontent (who, BTW, personally blocked a trade that would have returned Jordan Zimmermann and Ian Desmond) who was known to be demanding a trade.

There is more than enough evidence to use against Dayton Moore, to critique him with, without ripping on this trade. Same thing with Glass.

I’m torn between wanting duncan to continue arguing with the dumbshit because I enjoy his takes, and feeling sad that he is wasting his breath arguing with a dumbshit.

He wouldn't be arguing with me so often if he really thought I was dumb. It's simple really: all you have to do is use objective data, and that will allow intelligent people (not you) to debate. Can't do that with people who just throw out opinions with no substance.

Honestly you could probably learn something watching us discuss this stuff.

So, I have a question: Dayton Moore said "it could take 10 years" to re-build the Royals. So let's test him on that one. I took a look at the rosters of MLB teams in 2006 when Dayton assumed the GM role here in KC. And guess what? Very few players in the entire league are still with their teams. That means EVERY OTHER GM was forced to build a new roster in the past 8 years just like Dayton had to.


2006 Cards: C Yadier Molina, CL Adam Wainright.
2006 A's: <none>
2006 Rays: Ben Zobrist
2006 Pirates: <none> (Here's their team if you want to laugh: http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/PIT/2006.shtml)



I could do that for any team really and we'll find the same thing: all teams have to rebuild in the time DM says it takes to rebuild a team. Only question left is what was in the pipeline. Pittsburgh had Neil Walker & McCutcheon but then again, KC had Butler & Gordon so that's a wash. Here were the 2006 system rankings:

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today...006/26854.html

I notice you left out Milwaukee's acquisition of Jean Segura for Zack. Segura (3.2 WAR) is outdoing the duo (2.8 WAR) all by himself. This significantly alters your future WAR calcs.

Wong, Wacha, and Taveras for Shields? Can we make you John Mozeliak for a day to get this deal done. To be honest though, you should win pretty easy with Wainwright and Shields. That would be two workhorses in the rotation for the playoffs.

Why would I look at that? The question is: Did the Royals get appropriate value for Zack Greinke?

They got two young, above-average starters who provide plus defense at premium defensive positions, guys they control for a long time. They also got a few minor league pieces, one of whom flamed out and one of whom was a key piece in acquiring James Shields.

Jean Segura, a top 75-100 prospect, flukily turning into something he's NEVER been before (and regressing significantly - he's slugging .411 since June 1, which lends some credence to the thought many had early - that his power was not sustainable) has nothing to do with what the Royals acquired for Greinke.

Because you can't talk about long term WAR values of what KC got but not what Milwaukee got. Jean Segura is clearly part of the Greinke deal because they got him for Greinke. They traded Cain, Escobar, Odorizzi for 2 years Zack + Jean Segura.


But let's assume you're right and we'll just invalidate Segura entirely. Let's stipulate that. So what? The Royals traded for a CF with 2.0 WAR. Their backup Dyson already has 0.8 WAR in 1/4 the at-bats. Why on Earth did we give up something so valuable as Zack to get a player who's no better than what we already have? Admit, it's a great question no?

We'd have to include Greg Holland and probably Starling.

Wait wait wait, Wong, Wacha, and anyone not named Taveras or anyone wiht the big club.

Done. A million times done.

You would be the best GM in history if you could bring along convenient hindsight.

So in just a month of play, Will Myers has almost equaled Moose in HRs and will probably surpass Butler and Hosmer before years end... :facepalm: