Yep.

We're relying too much on DB blitzes right now.

I expect the pass defense to improve with the return of Gay. We've given up a lot of plays over the middle.

Gay will help, along with McDuffie.

Danna playing the way he was is being missed the most IMO.

Brady also gets rid of the ball quickly. Not shocking that a 4.3 DB sacked him with a running head start as the ball was snapped.

But I do agree. That’s the one spot the defense is lacking. Unless a Melvin Ingram is available I don’t think you give up massive resources for a pass rusher.

Next year I think we should sign someone like Yannick Ngakoue as well as drafting a project rusher in the 3rd or 4th rd.

Really want us to stock up there next Spring

soon as mcduff gets back we're going to start feasting

pick party or coverage sacks

They need a speed guy across from Karlaftis IMO. A real ass kicker.

I haven't looked much at the draft, but there's gotta be some guys coming out that will help.

I know they traded Tyreek to "rebuild or retool" a little, but this squad coming together I think you may be able to push a little bit and make a move for someone at pass rusher.

This is one of the best teams in the NFL as is. Add another rusher or two and you are right there.

I Belize you look like a fool right now

To be fair we played prevent defense for the entire fourth quarter of two games. The last two drives plus the final drive that ended with time running out vs AZ and TB accounted for 300+ yards and 4 TDs given up.

On all those drives we were giving up cheap yards to run out the clock because we were so far ahead. Bad for the stat sheet but good for the win column.

When it matters we are a top 5-10 defense in yards and scoring.

And we're a bottom 5 defense in completion percentage and turnovers, as well as being poor in the RZ.

Again, the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

KC's defense is playing great in light of the pass rush problems.

Yep. They've got a couple of things to shore up but health is going to help that some and of course, they're going to gel more as the season goes on.

How about a hand for Spags?

For the first time in the Mahomes era KC has a legitimate top-5 run defense in the first quarter of the season. And no one predicted that. All the talking heads predicted the Chiefs would be worse vs. the run this season, not better, much less league-leading.

And Spags will figure out the secondary by mid-season. Right now he's playing with all the new guys, evaluating where to put everyone in every situation. We know this is going to take a bit of time, but that Spags usually has things figured out by week 8 or so.

As it stands, it looks like the defense will be in sync a little ahead of schedule.

Kudos to Spags, he's doing a great job so far.

:clap:

They certainly won't get worse with Gay and McDuffie's returns, either. Hopefully, McDuffie can come back fully healed and give Fenton a run for his money.

it's going to start snowballing if we keep crushing TOP

losing TOP against mahomes because you can't run the ball only makes our offense better in the 4th against a tired defense

we're going to absolutely crush some poor teams in the 4th this year

"mahomes magic"

uh, no, the other team's legs are just dead

Through 5 games, this has been an absolute masterclass from Spags.

To get quality play from a completely re-made secondary full of young players is remarkable in its own right. Especially when he's also dealing with a lot of turnover at the LB position.

But to continue to dial up blitz schemes that teams are struggling with and generate pressure when he's getting very very little from the DL when they don't send extra rushers is really impressive.

This defense isn't succeeding despite Spagnuolo right now - it's succeeding because of him. The secondary and the well timed, creative blitzes are what's keeping this defense humming and those are both directly attributable to Spags work.

Didn't care for the hire and have never been super impressed by him here (though I have always said the guy can coach the shit out of a defensive backfield), but to this point in the season he's been a big time difference maker for us.

One more time for the idiots in the back bitching about the defense last night when they were down 2 DL in the middle of the game along with the other injuries/suspension.

It's crazy because most fans would have expected this defense to be struggling right now.

So....you've gotta try and atleast make some kind of 2021 Ingram deal for a pass rusher right?

Some fans will simply never escape the 90s.

They expect defenses to go out there and hold quality opponents to 13 points and just snuff out the opposing offense. That's simply not the way the rules are set up anymore. Moreover, teams are just orders of magnitude smarter on offense than they used to be.

Holding a team below 20 is pretty difficult these days. 2/3 of the league is averaging more than 20 PPG. And it's been that way for about a decade now. This is an easy league to score in.

I understand why everyone hates 'bend, don't break' - emotionally it was the G-Rob mantra and we hate that ****ing guy. But also, bend don't break keeps PM off the field.

But man, there's only so much you can do. Especially when you're a team that dedicates as much time, energy and capital to its offense.

If you have a defense that's making critical adjustments and key stops, that's all you can ask these days. And that's exactly what we're seeing.

Spags is doing a great job right now and its absolutely to be commended.

You mean a 2022 deal for Jerry Hughes?

Because that just makes WAY too much sense to not get done.

Losing Wharton hurts some.

Gay out hurts some. He's just such a freak athlete.

Mcduffie back will help, in my opinion. Fenton's okay, but just okay.

We are a pass rusher short, maybe two now.

What was funny about that game is that even when we were down 17-0, I was telling my buddy 'man, I just don't feel like they're playing that bad. This is just a couple of plays made/not made from being a tie ballgame...'

I was never as irritated as I was in the Chargers or Colts games where I just thought they were playing like shit. They just seemed right there on the edge of playing good ball.

Giving Fenton more help with Adams and then taking some steps to keep Wylie from getting face-raped on every snap was really all it took. Weirdly, in a game where the Raiders had a 17-0 lead, had they come back and won it I'd have felt like they 'stole' it. That game was getting away from them and the longer it went, the worse it would've gone for them.

I think the Chiefs had them figured out by the end.

Yeah, I brought that up in the other thread where I'm trying to trade picks so my idea.

But yeah, you'd think that's an easy deal to make. For what...a 5th? Conditional 5 that turns to a 4?

4 to a 3?

Taylor Stallworth can help replace Wharton; pretty similar styles of player.

Getting Danna back will help. And I wouldn't be surprised to see a Hughes kind of deal made.

They're good on 3rd down and they're pretty good in the RZ. Asking for more than that is simply asking a lot in this league with the rules the way there are.

I said before the season started and we saw that Watson can play that I thought this team would be REALLY good in the red zone.

They've just added so much speed and length. Mistakes in coverage are amplified between the 20s because guys have space/time to pull away. But in the red zone, you can take a false step and maybe still have the boundaries to bail you out.

Some stuff will fluctuate all year. I think the 3rd down percentage will equalize towards the mean a little, for example. Then again, I think we'll see the turnover rate climb a little to partially offset it. That said, I think the red zone performances are legit - this team simply appears built to be very good in that area.

They've been pretty good on 3rd down for a couple of years now. I think they're a top 5 3rd down defense so I wouldn't undersell that.

The defense only allowed 9 points in the second half, which under most circumstances is completely acceptable.

Much more concerning is that the defense wasn't that great vs. Jacobs run game, and that they only got 2 sacks, though they really got three, and they did seem to get some pressure as the game went on.

Adams was a problem, though the stats say he didn't necessarily have a great game. He was targeted 7 times, but only caught three balls. Unfortunately, two of them went for TDs, but he is an elite receiver, and we don't have an elite DB, so things are going to happen. But I have faith that Spags will find better ways to cover Adams next time and he won't have the same kind of success in January.

Also, our secondary is still very much a work in progress; I expect they'll be much better by mid-season, which is normal timing for a Spags defense.

just buckle in, i have a feeling the reidian run started early

Carolina is probably about to fire sale so Brian Burns could be out there.

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24 points given up
Bills were 2/4 in the redzone
Multiple 4th down stops

2 TD’s given up by a rookie corner starting in his first game. I don’t know what more you could have asked from Spags here.

Can’t wait to get back McDuffie and Gay

This defense is so bad with missed tackles, and poor coverage. We knew there would be some growing pains but when we’re 32nd in opponent passer rating that’s absolutely pathetic. Our offense is best in the league, our defense is bottom third. We’re averaging opponents passer rating at 107.5. That’s good for worst in the league. Faders are right ahead us at 106.7. Tied for worst in the league in missed tackles with 39, and also tied for worst with YAC. Same with our ST on kickoffs, worst in the league.

We haven't been able to cover premier WRs this year and I think that's the biggest problem. Whether you want to say it's lack of defensive pressure or secondary problems... it's a problem.

Pittman Jr, Evans, Williams, Adams, Davis, and Diggs combine for...

In those 5 games.... 55 targets, 40 receptions, 634 yards and 6 TD

Which if that was a player that would be T-10th in targets, 8th in receptions, 3rd in yards, T-2nd in touchdowns.

Only 6 other teams have more points scored against. The chiefs have the best offense in the league while being straight dragged by their terrible defense.

This defense and our tackles will ensure we get embarrassed in the playoffs.

The rating is 106.7?

Hot dog, that is better than I expected!

Can't argue with the truth.

But the defense that played the other day is not going to be the defense that's playing for us a month or so from now. What I mean is, they are going to improve. Getting Gay back will help up front immensely. Getting McDuffie will also help, but just getting live snaps in will help these guys get more comfortable in Spags system.

It literally happens every season. By weeks 10 or 12, Spags will have a much better idea of what all these new guys can and can't do, and he'll put them in positions to succeed. That's what he does every year.

I was actually surprised looking at the numbers today. I really thought the defense had played better than what the numbers are.

But we're 20th in yards allowed and 25th in points allowed. I'm not the biggest EPA guy, but according to EPA, this defense is on par with the 2018 Sutton defense.

I don't know it doesn't really feel like that though.

Because i think a lot of it is situational.

I agree, they are playing better than their numbers suggest. A few big passes down the sideline here and there, DPI's that put opponents in scoring position etc.

The only stat that really matters

Honestly, I think the biggest thing is that people know they're bad but because of the turnover and youth infusion, they're convinced they'll get better.

People are flat willing to overlook some early season warts if it means improvement at the end of the season and there's certainly some promise there.

Well, there's a pretty massive flaw in this defense that doesn't have a realistic fix this year outside of a blockbuster trade, and it's the complete inability to pressure with 4. We have to rely on blitzing to generate it most of the time and our DBs aren't holding up well. Fenton in particular has been absolutely awful.

Fenton is so goddamn grabby, he can't play man without drawing a hold or DPI flag.

He's been genuinely awful this year. On 23 targets he's given up 19 catches for over 250 yards. That's just not going to cut it going forward.

Spags can never figure out how to stop the run or close out games. Same shit, different year.

I'm thinking and hoping that getting Gay and McDuffie back will go a long way in improving the D. The pass rush is a different story. Need an upgrade there it seems, or get healthy.

Two weeks ago, it was the number one run defense.

Now they're as bad as the 2018 Sutton Efense.

Maybe we ought to let it settle in a bit more before we freak out.

When you can't get pressure with 4, you can't or won't have a good defense in today's NFL.

It's just the reality of things.

yup

They've been rebuilding the defense for like 3 years via the draft and it's still shit.

What is the deal?

Same DC.

We're playing the toughest schedule in the NFL with a 7th round rookie, a 4th round rookie, a rookie at DE, another rookie at 3rd LB, while a 2nd round rookie is your 3rd safety, and your first round rookie CB is out? All while having most of your veteran leadership being new to the team and scheme?

Bolton and Jones are your only stabilizing factors?

I mean, I'm just spitballing.

The Chiefs have allowed 30 points 1 time this year and it was bc the Bucs were way behind and we were playing prevent.

This time last year we allowed 29, 36, 30, 30 and 38 points in 5 of our first 6 games and the defense looked terrible.

They look much better this year even with the youth injection

Ok, but you also are in a salary cap league where you aren't gonna be able to keep a unit together for that long.

It doesn't seem to take other units as long to not be this bad, but the schedule has been pretty brutal for sure.

I think they'll get better, but damn.

I'd sure love to give Spags a good ol' fashioned performance review like any of us have had to go through. He would definitely be going into a performance improvement plan with the poor results of his work. He would be given a month to drastically turn it around or demoted to hydration specialist.

Well, pass rush is a problem. So Spags blitzes a lot in key moments.

Live by the blitz, die by the blitz.

It's been a mixed bag, but they've been pretty good in key moments I'd say.

Elite QB's and WR's are going to get theirs. We've seen it 3 weeks in a row.

Personally, I'm not worried (other than the pass rush), and think they've played better than I expected overall.

By the end of the season they'll be a lot better. I bet they finish a top 15 or so defense.

Blitzing this much...I just don't see it.

You can't be this bad with 4 up front and be very good IMO

or giving an endless excuse to poor results year in, year out.

I have no problem with personnel. I have a problem with scheme and the person running that scheme and the lack of true accountability towards him. Same shitty results filled with excuses of they will be better next month. Then the next month comes and there have been no real tangible improvements to move out of the shitty category and excuse is still same. They will be better next month. Then the year ends and the excuse is essentially the same. Had a rookie here, injury there, but we are almost there. We will be better next year. Never mind the fact that every team has to start a rookie or 3 that they really don't want to.

The only problem with the defense is the lack of accountability towards the guy running it.

The 2018 Chiefs proved that this is not true. You need to be well rounded to be a good defense, not just the pass rush

Regardless, other than magically making Frank Clark relevant I don't see what Spags could do differently.

I think he's doing a great job, all things considered.

Mixing up man and zone, blitzing in key moments, nobody looks lost, they're playing hard.

It would be much easier if you could get home with 4, but we just can't.

This is why IF we're about to make a move, I'd bet it's for a pass rusher.

The 2018 Chiefs proved that you can't have a good defense without a good front 4....how?

I didn't say that's the only way to have a good defense. But you can't have a "good" defense in today's league without that.

Spags real issue IMHO is his inability to feel a game within a drive. His adjustments come WAY to late.

Some coaches can pick up on what you are trying to do, and adjust their play calls to counter. Spags seems to wait till HALF to adjust. He has not shown any ability to adjust in series, or even in HALF.

Leaving a rookie singled up on peoples #1's is also out of this world reeruned.

I think so.

Hell, maybe 2 more rushers. Dunlap doesn't do shit and the rest is just meh.

You guys are really going to fall for this exact same shit again?

The first attempt wasn't a rebuild - it was a re-set. It was older veterans who could help them win now. And frankly, it didn't really work - Hitchens wasn't good and Frank Clark ****ing Sucks.

We're in year 2 of a defensive rebuild. The problem is that an offensive rebuild isn't far into the future. But I think we still have one more year where we can attack the trenches offensively and defensively.

But I'm not the guy to really have this conversation with as I'd have drafted at least 3 DL last year; I thought we needed at least 2 DEs and a DT. But they went a different direction...

It is what it is. Finite resources and what not...

The problem with just blasting away at the defense is the rest of the shit falls apart.

We're also getting to the point where the things we need to rebuild aren't the easiest places to find and are gonna be pricey.

So we get back to stars and scrubs stuff and one might make the argument that while packing the team with 2 or 3 solid WR's vs a HOF'er is the way to go, it's not really easy to do.

Same with pass rushers etc.

Man - this is a bizarre week to go in on Spags.

Held a dynamic offense to 24 points while missing 5 key contributors. Got the ball back to the offense on multiple occasions with a chance to extend the league or ice the game.

This is a team that's put immense capital into its offense and is clearly an offense first squad. The defense did enough to win - the offense didn't.

Like I said folks, we're not gonna beat teams 20-17. It's just not a reasonable expectation. Think of this as slow pitch softball vs. MLB. You ain't winning a game 3-2 in slow pitch. If you don't score 14+, you don't deserve to win the game.

This ain't the week to ride Spags ass. The defense did its job.

Oh, I agree. The offense shit it's pants.

But I'm speaking more in generalities. I don't really fault Spags for it either. They just don't have the horses up front.

It ain't supposed to be easy - the NFL drew it up this way.

That's the point I've tried to make a hundred times over - Brett Veach has the Madden sliders on Rookie his first 2 years here. Cost controlled QB, a bunch of elite players on cheap contracts at key positions. A clean cap.

The last 18 months and the next 18 months will say more about Brett Veach as a GM than anything else this team has ever accomplished. Things will never be as easy for him as they were in 2019/2020 again.

Adjust your expectations accordingly.

Again, very true.

CP won't like it, but could you also say thru 4 years to only have 1 SB it's been a bit of a letdown?

I said it after the AFCCG. Yeah - it is a little bit.

4 times we hosted the AFCCG; we won 2 of them and only a single championship. That's essentially a series of coin-flip scenarios.

The issue is that it feels a lot like my golf game; there's not a single problem that messed it up. 2018 was a shit defense and a single penalty. 2020 was a catastrophic slate of injuries to the OL. 2021 was the first inkling we've seen of Mahomes mortality.

But yeah - I think we'll look back on this time historically and say "man, we left a little meat on those bones..."

Winning a championship in four years is a letdown? The ****ing Patriots have warped people's minds. Jesus Christ.

50 ****ing years without a Super Bowl appearance. One AFCCG game appearance 30 years ago.

A letdown? ****, them going to two SB's and winning one is a ****ing dream come true.

GTFO.

The problem isn't that his defense doesn't help, the problem his his defense is almost NEVER the reason we win. The defense has not carried us in a LONG LONG time. And not only that, situationally.... Does anyone trust Spags play calling when it comes to end of games?

The defense won the LA game and it was only 3 weeks ago. JFC.

did you miss the raiders game?

the chargers game?

spags defense carrying us last year in wins over new york, green bay, dallas, and denver TWICE?

chiefs have faced murray, herbert, brady, carr, allen...once we face some average QBs and get healthy the defense will improve like it did last year

Hosting 4 straight AFC champ games and only having 1 SB win in hindsight...yeah, I think so.

Now don't get me wrong, this is all gravy post SB win for me. None of this regular season stuff matters anymore to me so it's just time killing fodder.

But man.

Considering that just 5 or 6 years ago, I was convinced I would never see the Chiefs play in a conference championship before I died, no I don't think so.

4 straight AFCCG is a feat in and of itself. The fact they've only won 2 of them means nothing to me in the grand scheme of things. If they had not won a Super Bowl at all, then maybe. But they've exceeded 50 years of expectations and I will never question that.

Name me a defense that's doing that consistently right now.

Denver. ROFL