It's the Mahomes factor. They knew they'd get by no matter what because we have #15, so they crossed their fingers and hoped for the best.

It's a great approach if you want to alienate and piss off your superstar QB. Probably should go ahead and pivot on this one. :)

And even after it all went to crap he could have went after a guy like Cam Robinson that the Vikings traded for. Only cost them a 6th and 5th round pick swap that maybe turned into a 4th? Say what you say about how shitty Cam Robinson is but he would have still graded out as our best tackle.

Feel free to name who the Chiefs should have acquired there bc the list is pretty much non-existent

They took this approach to WR as well and Pat was still able to get a SB win. The problem is we have PROOF that this doesn't work with the OL! Bucs destroyed Pat and thus you say the front office go after Silverback and just really focus on the OL. Then we go on to win a couple of SBs and the front office starts relaxing on the OL again! For ****s sake!

Spend everything on the OL and then we know Pat can throw to crap receivers still.

pretty much anyone is better than what we had this year at LT...Mahomes doesn't need Jonathan Ogden protecting his blindside, just someone adequate.

Donovan Smith. At worst he's just like that fat bitch DJ Hufflepuffs and suits up for a game or two to suck shit, and maybe he does what he did in 2023 and performs just well enough that Mahomes can comfortably function.

I'd like some names.

Donovan Smith is done. There’s a reason nobody gave a **** about him. Would be no different

Could have overpaid and traded up? Could have overpaid and traded for a vet? Could have not fuking left Kingsley on an island and ruined him.

Could have done a ton of different moves and while most would have included overpaying in value....I think we can all agree that we would have been fine doing so for a quality tackle.

Your solution was to trade to 5 and draft Joe Alt, ok can't imagine how fun that would have been giving up like 4 1's.

Won't ever know because we wasted 4 million on Humpback to suck shit and look stupid on the sidelines instead.

I don't want to trade up in the draft for a prospect. What if the guy we are moving up for ends up being shite like a lot of first round LTs. There are currently 31 LTs in the league that are better than what we have. Surely a couple of them are gettable.

Jonah Williams went from CIN to AZ and would have been our highest grade OT.

Jermaine Eluemunor went from Vegas to Giants and again would have been a huge upgrade in pass blocking at tackle.

George Fant? Tyron Smith? Mekhi Becton? La'el Collins?

LOTS of names that would have been better on a rookie

Thats not what I'm saying.

I'm saying Veach didn't even TRY to go up and get a tackle they had higher ranked than Kingsly. IF Veach would have traded up and got a LT and for whatever reason that player got hurt or didn't play well, I could not blame Veach as he did try to get the best player even giving up value.

Why would you trade picks to go up and get a guy that's just like Kingsley? We've debated tackles in the draft forum for almost a half decade. Trading up into the late teens/early 20's has a HORRIBLE return rate.

Yep, there were tons of guys out there. Countless names, none of them great, but all proven LTs in this league at some point, or at least had potential like Becton. They did literally nothing besides draft Kingsley and pray.

It was a massive, incredible miscalculation that can never, ever be allowed to occur again. Ever. They should have figured that out after the Tampa Super Bowl, but if what happened last night and the look on Mahomes' face and in his mannerisms isn't enough to make them get it, I don't know what will be.

It's a risk but equally risky (and perhaps more so) to rely on Kingsley/Wanya or whatever free agent we can get at LT. As has been said before, LT is critically important position and if you can get a good one on a rookie deal, it sets you up for a long time because a) you can save at the league's 2nd most expensive position b) you can keep that player once their rookie deal is up rather than trying to scrounge for one.

The year for the Chiefs to trade up for an LT was last year. We didn't and paid the price last night. The next best year to try it is this year, even with a much weaker OT draft class.

Picks 31, 64 and 96 are about equal to #16 overall. Could we get a good LT there? I don't know. But I think I'd rather have #16 and #66 if we could solve LT than #31, #64, #66 and #96 and still have no LT.

Exactly, it's a ton of capital to give up if you want to move into the Top 8 of the Draft for a serious Left Tackle prospect. And then you hope he won't be a bust. If you're giving up a lot of capital, it might as well be for a proven veteran. But those are very hard to get as well.

16 really isn't high enough. That's the problem.

I know it’s not what people want to hear but I’d bet our 1st round pick this year will be a CB and they’re going to try to develop Kingsley.

They can try to develop Kingsley all they want, behind the proven LT they sign in free agency.

If he is starting at LT for this team next year when they enter camp, Veach and Reid both should have their heads examined. They'd have to be literally insane to go into next season in this same situation that just destroyed another year that could have added to Mahomes incredible legacy.

I would be very happy if Veach goes the FA route instead of trading up for a rookie. There are several good quality OTs in FA coming up.

How is our OL coaching? Seems like we have prospects that aren’t developing like we had hoped either. Why get a LT if we are going to put him in there and he pulls a hammy in his first game. Great coaching move, then we don’t see him again.

Then this offense will continue to be trash and they’ll be paying $65 million next year for Mahomes to dump the ball off to Gray, Kelce, or a RB 20 times a game. Sounds like a brilliant winning strategy.

That FA list at OT likely looks a lot worse by the time FA starts and multiple teams can easily outbid us for the ones that are available.

You don't want to develop a LT. And you don't want a free agent.

What do you think they should do?

I mean all I see in this thread is you bitching. You haven't offered a single, palatable solution. You also started posting in volume again right after the game after being silent most of the season. :hmmm:

Well it's not like the fans get a vote, but that sounds silly unless they find a stud LT and RT within the league.

That could be but in past years it seems that at least one or two legitimate starters become available.

Example for this year would be if Alaric Jackson wants to test the market. A young 26 year old that had trouble the start of his career but is now a very very solid starter with still room to grow. Rams might not want to tag him at $25M and he might want to see what other teams will offer. Would be a home run but would cost a good amount and the plan Veach would probably put in place is to focus on the right side and replacing Taylor sooner than later with possibly a more developed Kingsley.

I can name several others that should atleast start FA able to sign anywhere.

This is a great point, at this point in the process they need to look at all parts of the O-Line, including the coaches.

It's that bad. And if they think fans are overreacting, perhaps they can explain why "we'll be fine, totally fine" for next year's tough schedule without making some major O-Line (at least tackles) moves..

Without a solid LT and LG, the Chiefs are at best a team with a winning record, but not playoff bound. Until that happens we should be happy that Mahomes stays healthy.

Half of these guys are not left tackles.

Eluemunor is a RT/G. Becton crashed out hard at T and is a G now. George Fant is a RT. Jonah Williams is a RT now. And all of those guys were dogshit last year.

The only actual LT in that group is Tyron Smith - who got a really big deal from the Jets.

This place would have melted down had the Chiefs made a big commitment to Smith or signed one of those dudes to play LT. Especially Jonah Williams, who was so bad at LT the Bengals committed big FA dollars to Orlando Brown to get him off LT, and then was one of the worst starting T in football at RT.

Which exhibits the point: People need to be realistic in their expectations of what it costs to acquire LTs, and the difficulty in acquiring good ones.

Not a lot of them are being produced right now. The ones that are are diffiult to acquire in the first place, unless you're picking very high in the draft. And they rarely impact right away, usually not even reaching "adequate" play until the start of their second full season.

It's easy to say "FIX IT VEACH." The fix is, well, not easy.

I don’t want half measures. Hoping and praying a hack like Suamataia is the answer is fool’s gold, go up and get someone who has the talent and go from there. Yes, that likely entails a trade up in the 1st. Sign Humphries as a bridge option. When your OL gives up over 40% pressures when the D didn’t blitz a single time you have a huge ****ing problem and what you’re doing ain’t working. I frankly don’t care if it opens some holes elsewhere like at DT or CB, so be it. You’re paying half a billion to your QB only for him to put up one of the worst SB performances ever. Some of that falls on his shoulders but the team has also massively failed him. They’re going to force him into early retirement at this rate. ****ing fix it.

I don't even want to hear this excuse one time, it's a complete and total non-factor. If someone like Alaric Jackson or Ronnie Stanley gets to free agency, this is a Trent Williams type situation. You literally pay either of them whatever the hell it takes to get them to KC. You don't even let them take another visit once they come here. You wine and dine them and don't let them leave the facility until their name is on a contract.

This isn't just another ho hum free agency where we throw some offers out there and hope guys sign. They are signing an NFL left tackle, it's not even an option to wait until the draft. If they want to sign one and still draft one, fine by me, but you're signing one. I don't care what you have to do or what money gets moved around, it's happening.

Name them. Cause I'm looking at the list, and outside of Ronnie Stanley and Alaric Jackson, I don't see it.

I've advocated for taking a look at Joe Noteboom as a potential bridge option for a bit and think KC will look for someone like that. I'd place top odds on it being D.J. Humphries at this point.

There's really no reason the Rams would NOT franchise tag Alaric Jackson (unless they go all-in on a reset year and are stockpiling picks, then I guess you could try to work a tag-and-trade). They have the cap space and will gain more once they shed Kupp. Same for the Ravens with Stanley.

Can we talk about Juwan Taylor? You can't convince me that when OBJ walked and we signed Taylor the plan was for him to be the RT. They even said they hoped he could play LT or something along those lines. For whatever reason he can't play LT even though when they signed him they thought he probably could. That set us back big time.

How far would you trade up for one? You willing to give up possibly more than we gave up for Mahomes to get one? Because that's what it will take.

They already tried it with Trent Williams. He was just using Veach to squeeze more cash from the Niners. It's hard to get the guys you want. If they go down the path of overpaying, they really need to start using the Void Year stuff like Philly. That's how you overpay for dudes and not get nailed on the cap for a few years.

We don’t know that for sure. It depends a lot on what happens in FA. If Jackson or Stanley were somehow snagged then clearly the need drops, although with depth at OT so important and Taylor done here after 2025 I’d still consider tackle in the first 3 rounds.

If we strikeout on on those 2 then I guess you sign Humphries again and you then get to work with the draft. Yes, Banks/Campbell/maybe Simmons requires probably too high of a trade up. I believe our 2025 1st, 2025 3rd, and 2026 1st is enough to get us up somewhere around 15 or a little higher. Obviously it depends on their draft evaluation and how high they think they need to go, but I think they need to come away with one of Banks, Simmons, Conerly, or Ersery. Most likely none are quite ready to start by day 1, but at least you now have a veteran option with Humphries and I guess worst case scenario Morris and/or KS are improved some more (but I’m not banking on that for a second). This might seem like an over correction but so be it, we’ve hopefully solved LT long term and have the 5th year option and hopefully Morris or KS end up being a capable starter by 2026 after Taylor is kicked to the curb.

Any left tackle you take after about pick 12 is a lottery ticket. That's what the hit rates are. You either draft one top 10 or you hope.

Still better than doing what we’ve done. If they feel one of those guys can be competent pull the trigger.

The LT shit has ruined our season multiple times

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">After playing just 4 games for the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Browns?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Browns</a> this season, Jedrick Wills has been placed on IR. The move will most likely end both his season and his career in Cleveland. <br><br>After a promising rookie campaign, the former 10th overall pick never developed into the reliable tackle we… <a href="https://t.co/uYGKJBPWrS">pic.twitter.com/uYGKJBPWrS</a></p>&mdash; The Dawgs - A Cleveland Browns Podcast (@thedawgspodcast) <a href="https://twitter.com/thedawgspodcast/status/1865604687279394970?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 8, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Looks like a Brett Veach special.

Change for the sake of change isn't always good. They spent a 2nd round pick on Kingsley. Do it again. Take two.

But there's absolutely no reason for them to trade up if they're not trading up for something that is surely better. You're active in the draft forums. You know how often those guys in the 20's pan out. Short of a monumental trade, we are giving away multiple picks for another Kingsley. That would be overeactionary and stupid.

**** all of that.

Lol I’m digging the nicknames for Humphries.

I would rather the Chiefs start Hubert H Humphrey than DJ Humphries!

I don’t envy Brett Veach and his staff. Finding a quality Left Tackle is pretty damn hard, especially when you’re stuck at the bottom of the Draft order every single year.

We did that with Kingsley and people are saying he’s a bust already.

What happens when rookie we trade up to take around pick 20 is too raw to do anything his rookie year?

If you’re not getting a top 10 guy, you either take a limited ceiling player and hope that’s good enough to be just kind of alright or you take a super raw player who’s going to get his ass ruined a lot early on.

In both cases, you don’t know what you really have until year 2 or more. And if you don’t have the patience to see their development through the whole process, then don’t bother drafting them ever

Why is it just another Suamataia? Who knows what their grades are but it’s entirely possible they have a higher grade on one of these guys than they did this year on Kingsley.

Kingsley shouldn't have even been active with how raw he was. LT this season was a complete botch job that was the most significant factor in us falling short of the three peat.

If you draft OTs in round 2 or 3 or even late 1 you literally get what we've gotten. Any team that pulled an elite starter from that area or later got lucky as ****.

Yep...

Guys available to play tackle in the 20's are either


1.Talented but raw as shit, like Kingsley.


2.Plug and Play but don't have movement to play left. Right tackles.

Or if it's a LT possibility extremely limited athletically in some way. See Jonah Williams and he went 11th.

Everyone here was jerking themselves off about wanting Anton Harrison 2 years ago, how's that going?

Not every developmental tackle is going to be as bad as Suamataia, his failure also doesn’t mean you stop trying. Yes, they ****ed up throwing him into the mix so early without development time and no viable plan B, but he was so historically bad and unplayable that you can’t depend on him improving. If he does develop then that’s icing on the cake but for ****’s sake take another swing and have a plan B (i.e. Humphries).

It's just ****ing irritating because there's a not so insignificant chance that he got ****ed up mentally being thrown to the wolves and then subsequently being benched twice.

There’s not a ton of solutions available. The most obvious would be Ronnie Stanley, and let Kingsley try to develop. But then you’re looking at making a guy who struggles to stay healthy the highest paid LT in the game.

We’re in a shitty spot, but I expect Veach to be aggressive.

The draftubators are generally awful

If he is that mentally soft, then he was doomed from the start. I don’t think that will be the case in the long term…I just think he’s a better overall Guard prospect than he is at LT.

Not happening

Kcchiefsus is a **** tard

If Josh Simmons is available at 25, is it worth making a trade up to roll the dice on yet another rookie LT? Veach has put either a first or second round pick into WR for three straight years and finally hit on the last two. Should he do the same at LT until he hits one?

We could re-sign Humphries and have Morris as a back-up, again, but it really does not inspire confidence at the position for the third straight year.

His 'failure' is also not yet a failure.

If he was ready day one, he'd have gone top ten.

Ravens LT ronnie Stanley is FA, Can't chiefs sign him?

Technically I guess, but the top names are almost assuredly going to be tagged or extended before free agency.

They'll probably be in a better position to retain him, but I would absolutely love to see them test this. To my mind he is the clear best option in the short-term. The worst outcome may be Cam Robinson.

At best he's a worse version of Taylor, but at LT. He'll still command an enormous fee and probably want more years than Stanley. We can't keep sinking good money into average for multiple years, even at a position as important as LT. He's also, like Taylor, a horrible run-blocker. Clearly we are never going to be a run-first team, but if we want any chance of convincing Reid to mix it up a little more, we probably need OTs that can produce.

I also don't think it's a particularly good year for OTs in the draft. In all honesty, I'd push my chips in on Stanley. If that doesn't work, I'd probably kick the tires on DJ and hope to hell he can provide something approaching OK. If Simmons or Conerly looks possible, fine, but don't bet the house on them.

It may just not be a problem we can't fix this off-season.

JJ Watt sums it up...we got away with it in the past against (1) teams with great edge rushers and no interior pressure and (2) teams with great interior rushers and no edge pressure. Eagles had great rushers across their d-line.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Eagles didn’t blitz Chiefs one time last night. Similar to Bucs vs. KC in the 2021 Super Bowl.<br><br>But it’s not as simple as “blitz vs. no-blitz”.<br><br>To win with just a 4-man rush, you have to have monsters on the edge and beasts in the middle.<br><br>Great edge rushers can be neutralized…</p>&mdash; JJ Watt (@JJWatt) <a href="https://twitter.com/JJWatt/status/1889065775732027472?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 10, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Trade this years 1st and next years to the Giants for Andrew Thomas

Yep big price but he’s locked in on a reasonable deal (for the player he is) for 5-6 years.

The draft and FA ain’t helping this year.

If you are proposing that we risk him as a starter on day one next season then that cannot happen.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why would they do that?

No, I'm not.

I'm not PROPOSING anything, necessarily. I'm pushing back on unrealistic narratives.

Sure, if they’d take that.

They wouldn’t.

The Giants have had o-line issues for years. They are not about to trade their best player on offense other than Nabers, especially since they are about to draft a QB.

Watt nailed it. Thuney got abused playing out of position and Calliendo had no chance. Left side collapsed almost instantly all game long. Right side was a little better, but not much. It was just a perfect storm to go up against an OL that had been in flux all season. That's why, for this game, I would have given serious thought of putting Thuney back at LG and at least have a strength on strength situation somewhere, with our interior 3.

Veach knows all that. No way he does something stupid like that.

Yeah, their selling points right now are that they have the foundations on offense. Franchise LT, franchise WR, good young RB. Just need the QB to make it work and ascend quickly.

I’ve looked around rosters. I don’t think there’s a young LT to be had, at least not one that you feel like settles the position for years, like people want.

If you can’t sign one of Cam Robinson, Stanley, or Alaric Jackson, I think you can take a numbers game approach as the best bet.

Sign a floor vet like Humphries. Sign a second-chance guy like Jedrick Willis. Draft another guy with traits.

Throw them in the pot with guys you have on hand and see what comes out.

Any way the Chargers are gonna trade Slater? Surely not right?

I mean, you are joking, right?

Sadly...yes

sure, for 4 first rounders to a team in their division...

It's not about grades. It's about hit rates. Guys taken after pick 15 just don't hit with any regularity at all. If you're not taking an Alt, you're taking a lottery ticket. Would you pay $15 for $5 scratcher? That's dumb.

People need to be realistic about what you need at LT to be "successful".

If it's a "throw a guy out there on an island and have him just kick ass and be elite" well......good luck.