I really feel a little worse every day since Dorsey is gone. No matter what he did wrong, he put together a good roster and made it better every year. I can't see us getting better from that perspective.

14.5 games per year average over 7 seasons is injury prone.

I guess you just paid your injury prone QB the largest contract in history then moron.

This is vacation time for the NFL. Players, staffers, etc. are out of the office and out of the country.

I'll be surprised if they make an announcement any time other than a few days before training camps begin.

Dorsey will probably end up with the Chargers and haunt our ass for 10 years

I read pretty much exactly that.

Won't be announced till the eve of TC.

It's gonna be Veach.

https://youtu.be/EeFQ1vtT_Co



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Glad he's gone.

Couldn't find a replacement for DJ
Couldn't find a replacement for Tamba
Whiffed on CB's all over the place
Drafted Tanoh who we have no ****ing clue what he's going to do

Clark was right. There was a problem. And we saw that when Veach was trying to patchwork this shit up in August before the season.

Don't give up on Tanoh, he just needs time...

And a specific role

Tanoh is a tweener. Built too tall and thin to be a base 3-4 DE. Not athletic, powerful, or explosive enough to take advantage of his length.

For a raw guy who was touted as a physical freak during the draft process, he hasn't shown anything, to me at least, that makes me think that he's going to be anything more than a JAG in this league.

Guys who are actually physical freaks tend to physically dominate against 3rd string guys during the pre-season. I saw a lot of Kpass getting easily blocked and washed out of plays by guys who didn't end up making NFL rosters or are currently backups/practice squaders in the league.

If he magically does end up becoming a solid player, then great, I'm wrong. But I think the chances of that happening are close to nil.

Well, personally, I'm holding out hope that the fact he only has 5? 6? years of football under his belt, that our coaches can figure out a way to use him consistently...

He is a freak, and he does flash on tape (at least to me), and I hope the young man can learn how to harness his gifts..

But I completely acknowledge the fact that I am going full optimism here

I've argued for a long time he should be Levon Kirkland for the first two downs (when we use our base.)

I think Tanoh has potential as an elephant rusher, but will need time.

Raw development players who did nothing in college simply don't work. Tanoh looks stiff as a goddamn board and we are looking at another 3 year player at the weeping position.

If we were smart, we'd have him gain 20 lbs to get to 310 lbs and play him at DE. He's definitely got the body to do that and the strength to play the position.

Draft proven talented players FFS.

Complaining about Dorsey’s draft is straight up silly talk. His drafts were excellent.

Complain about his inability to get guys inked at the right time and having to overpay, fine. I’m with you...but even that doesn’t always work out.

Complain about his big dollar free agents.

Complain about him overlooking serious injuries to players he’s given mega deals to that could be seen as a big enough concerns at the time that he should have passed. Fine, I can see your argument. That list is significant.

But, to slam his ability to draft is silly. The guy was an elite drafter.

Kelce
Nelson
Peters
LDT
Jones
Morse
Hill
Hunt
Mahomes
Catapano :)

That’s a great foundation of good players to build with.

We’re gonna win a couple super bowls with that list.

I said in another thread, name me one team which drafted better than Dorsey did during his tenure, taking into account the overall picks (ranking of each pick). He was outstanding, his latest gem being Hunt. I just hope Veach can do as well.

:harumph:

Some good reading in this thread. Bunch of dumb ****s in this one.

Mayfield?

Aaaaaaaaaaaand the curse continues. LMAO

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Clark Hunt said he “let John go” due to “enough issues that popped up” prompting him to review the operation. <br><br>“What I let John know is<br>that we were not going to be extending his contract and really for his benefit, and for ours once <br>he knew that, he needed to move on.” <a href="https://t.co/qJddhMz8NC">https://t.co/qJddhMz8NC</a></p>&mdash; Matt Derrick (@mattderrick) <a href="https://twitter.com/mattderrick/status/1109269893021601793?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 23, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Sure, it had nothing to do with the awful contracts he offered...

….and firing Jeremy Maclin over the phone right after his wedding (heard Andy was pissed at that)...

Andy is running the show in KC. It's pretty clear.

Beginning of the end.

Not saying Weiss is right or wrong, but I know one things for sure. The guy is a buffoon. Anyone that has listened to him on Sirius can testify.

I’d take everything he says with a grain of salt.

He's been running the show since day 1. Dorsey just decided to get out of lock step and fell out of favor. Dorsey was never in charge.

Then it's exactly as I thought. He was running the show as if it was his show to run. Obviously, the Berry contract and Maclin were the tipping points.

The bad contracts are only bad if you award them. I believe he wasn't going to give Berry a mega deal and was probably willing to let him walk. Clark obviously wasn't.

DJLN analyzed the Houston deal recently and I agree with him in that we awarded a contract that was in-line with league standards, and that it could not have been done "better".

In the end, his and Reid's vision for the team didn't match up, case closed.

Electric bump - I was about to give you shit - but that's a dope ass bumb my brah!

Had to go all the way to Cleveland to escape that big ass shadow

I think it was many tipping points. There is an Emmanuel Sanders recent interview where someone asks him about how close we was with signing with the Chiefs and basically Andy really wanted him but he was getting low balled by the front office. They then upped it to his asking price, assuming because Andy wanted him. Andy LEFT the facility and they changed the contract offer back to the low ball. Meanwhile a bunch of teams like San Fran, Broncos, etc jumped in and offered his asking price and he said Andy came flying back to the facility very angry lol.

Yeah..... If Sanders is accurate Reid and Dorsey just weren't compatible.

Jesus! LMAO :facepalm:

WTF that is crazy. Stupid Dorsey

oof. This didn't age well. :D

I think it was too much ego under one roof, definitely.

They mostly agreed, but boy when they didn't, they really didn't.

I liked Dorsey and wish him well, but I like Veach so far as well.

And Dorsey has some sack, you gotta give him that. Mayfield at #1 had most people scratching their heads and now he looks like a genius. If it weren't for Mahomes having a record year, Mayfield would be the talk of the NFL.

It's going to age VERY goddamned well, starting with this upcoming season. Unlike Mahomes, having a seasons worth of tape on this little douche is about to pay dividends.

How will Mayfield respond to adversity in the form of 2 or more continual losses? I'm betting not well. And that more than anything tells me why Dorsey has elected to build like he's going to the Super Bowl; he's just trying to make sure that his QB doesn't have to deal with losing more than 2 or 3 in a row.

Well, that and the fact that he doesn't have a tried and true head coach.

Andy Reid > John Dorsey

Yeah, this shit doesn't pass the sniff test.

Clark said an awful lot of uncharacteristic non-PC type stuff about Dorsey. Then it took Dorsey a year to land a job. Then the Chiefs loudly made a bunch of changes that would line up with what Clark said about Dorsey.

Not buying it.

GM's who cut the fat, let go dead weight, and buy low/sell high > Andy Reid/John Dorsey

Expound, please. FDF.

Dude. The kid WALKED ON in college. Couldn't beat out Mahomes which is no shame, went to Oklahoma. Balled out Wins the Heisman. Got drafted by CLEVELAND. Thrust into starting right away. That's always worked out great in Cleveland, right? Throws 27 TD's/14 INT's to...who other than Landry? Now he's got OBJ.

I understand if his personality rubs you the wrong way, but all the kid's ever done is produce in the face of adversity. Having to start at QB as a rookie in ****ing Cleveland-there's no adversity greater than that in the NFL. Shit sandwich time, and once again, he balled out. He's not going anywhere.

I wouldn't trade Mahomes for any player in football, he's a generational talent. BUT-if we didn't have Mahomes, Mayfield would be the next guy on my list.

Y'all wait. We'll be playing Cleveland in a bunch of AFCCG's real soon.

I think a lot of people hate him because he's cocky; but you have to understand, since high school everybody's told him he can't play. And he just keeps proving them wrong. So he doesn't give a shit what anybody thinks. As an opponent you may hate him, but his teammates LOVE IT.

I never said he wasn't talented. I said he was a douche who is about to get his card pulled. And I do NOT believe in the "ascension of the Cleveland Browns". It's the AFCN version of "look out for those Chargers this year"!

This story is true. Heard it yesterday on the fan straight from Sanders mouth. If I am Reid you are gone in a heartbeat !!! Enjoy !!

http://1043thefan.com/category/podca...59&n=The+Drive

You both are correct here and one of you will eventually be more right in the end. Only time will tell.

nah, man. It's the exact opposite of the Chargers.

The Chargers are the aging 'never was' team on their last legs with Phyllis.

The Browns are the young 'nothing to lose' team with a young gunslinger at QB who's been told he wasn't good enough so many times he just puts up the middle finger.

I love it. We've suffered, we Chiefs fans, and we deserve Mahomes. But our suffering is nothing compared to Cleveland fans. Their owner stole their team from them in the dark of night for ****'s sake. Plus, they live in ****ing CLEVELAND. Those people deserve a winner.

I find Mayfield refreshing. He doesn't spout the same cliche crap. He says what he thinks, he's funny, he's loose, and then he goes and balls out. In hindsight, he's PERFECT for Cleveland; the QB everybody said wouldn't make it in the city everybody makes fun of playing for the franchise that's been the longest running joke in the NFL.

Goddamnit you know what I mean. Look, you're a fan. That's fine. All I'm saying is, I don't believe in him OR Dorsey the way some of you do.

That's it, nothing more, and we shall see. I'm done talking about the little prick.

haha. Fair enough.

I'm not a huge Dorsey fan; I see the problems as well as the plusses. I'm not sorry he's gone, but I wish him well.

I am a Mayfield fan. Do you just hate OU? Curious as to why you hate him so much. It's not like he's...Big Ben or something.

Browns roster > Chiefs

when you pick first every ****ing year, I'd hope so.

I'm not going to look up a bunch of links, but Clark, very uncharacteristically said communication was a problem and went into way more detail than he ever has about anything. Typically he'd just say we thought it was better to move on or whatever like he's done with everyone else.

Then Dorsey waited a year for a new job. You'd think if Dorsey wanted to get out of Reid's shadow, he'd simply find a new GM job. That wasn't the case.

Then when Veach took over Clark very loudly said stuff about communication and professionalism and shit that would be easily connected to Dorsey.

Like I said, I don't have any hard evidence, just doesn't pass the sniff test.

Yeah Dorsey didnt churn that roster at all :rolleyes:

PICKING FIRST. In each round.

There's really no excuse but incompetence for an NFL team to be the worst team in the league for multiple years.

Clearly, Dorsey is not incompetent, at least in acquiring talent although his predecessors were and he hit a home run with a QB...PICKING FIRST. That's still no small feat, as lots of flame-out QB's were picked first IN CLEVELAND for decades.

Also, due to the team being shite for so long, there weren't stars he had to pay, so they have cap room.

IN KC, we had some fat underperforming contracts we needed to get out from under. Ironically, signed by Dorsey. And we've been consistently good so we've been picking in the #20's for years now. It's not really a good comparison in those simple of terms.

But we have THE QB of his generation, and so all is well. Dorsey has probably the #2 young QB in the league, and so they should do well also.

I'm not sure why y'all see everything in such black and white terms. Life doesn't work that way.

There are some who don't like his moxie. I do like it because we have not had it around here since Lenny. Big difference between posing and producing. In the beginning it could be very easily be interpreted as "big mouth posing" BUT from mid-season on last year the kid produced. Granted it was against easier competition BUT he produced when presented the opportunity. We'll definitely know more about him this year against tougher competition.:thumb:

Nope, especially after you drafted Mahomes?

How many top 10 picks have they had? How many years have they had multiple 1st round picks?

I don't like other teams or QB's trying to steal Mahome's spotlight when they haven't produced the way the Chiefs and Mahomes have. The media is trying to sell Cleveland as "Chiefs east", and I think it's bullshit. Until they win their division consistently and start hosting AFCCG's, it's nothing but speculation and hot air.

Mother**** you. Browns cap space pre-Dorsey>>>Chiefs cap space POST-Dorsey.

People need to stop riding that fools cock. If Veach and the Chiefs were loaded and handing out money like drunken Billay's at a plus-size strip bar, we could have a bunch of big name, high dollar FA's on our roster too.

Of course, the difference would be that those FA's would be here for the privileges of playing with Mahomes and being coached by Reid AS WELL AS THE MONEY.

It's cool man. I just like having as much info. about that situation as I can.

Thanks!

I literally laughed out loud during the press conference after the game where he threw 3 TD's when he said he just woke up that morning and 'felt dangerous'.

****ing hilarious.

I think Ballard is the better GM than Dorsey.

Dorsey’s first draft wasn’t that good if you take out Baker, who was pretty obvious of a pick.

Taking a short, frail CB over Chubb was reeruned. He also got his Eric Fisher in Austin Corbett LMAO
He took a RB and Fisher clone while Ballard got Darius Leonard and Braden Smith a few picks later.

He’s learned nothing from his time here. He’s already spending like a mother****er and bringing in extremely difficult personalities. Shit John, you’d think the Marcus Peters fiasco would have taught you something. Nope...gotta get OBJ.

Give it a couple years when Dorsey doesn’t have it easy anymore and you’ll see the same thing happen that happened here. Dorsey is good, but he’s got some major flaws.

Well, to be fair; Reid (and Dorsey) built a consistent winner here. So Cleveland is a little like if we'd drafted Mahomes and started him the year after we kicked Pioli out.

And as Dorsey was a big part of that turnaround (and he was, don't get it twisted) plus, they have what looks to be the second best young QB in football, Chiefs east is the picture they'll paint.

Unless things go horribly wrong, Cleveland should be a play-off team this year. Mayfield has weapons, and a decent defense.

I just don't get why we have to vilify opponents.

I think they're going to be the Brady/Manning rivalry of the next decade plus and it's going to be awesome football to watch.

I disagree.

The Browns' 2017 draft looks far from bad so far.

Im not the type to say everyone is good but Dorsey, Ballard and Veach are three very good GMs IMO.

The Browns will be a force for years after years and years of being the laughing stock of the league. That' John Dorsey for you.

NO, NO. Mayfield was nobody's consensus #1. NOBODY. go back and look.

landing a franchise QB is really difficult. I don't think any of the other of the guys will be one. Dorsey got it right. Just because he ****ed our cap up doesn't mean he's incompetent.

I'll give you three solid reasons to vilify that opponent:

1) Peters

2) Hunt

3) Hill

Yeah, what a blessing these three have been!

Yep. And to your point there are those who actually believe what the feel and then say and THEN PRODUCE ! And then there are those that say the same thing and just pose.

1) Peters was a risk worth taking at the time. Lot of talent, and I think they thought Berry could keep him in line. Of course, Berry spent '17 in rehab and Peters fell apart.

2)Hunt is, I think, a decent guy, but not a good drunk. We all know people like that. Hopefully he gets his life together. as a 3rd round pick, though, you can't argue with the production.

3) If it turns out Hill broke his kid's arm and we cut him tomorrow, as a 5th round pick we got unbelievable production. I hope not, but if that's the case, it was a risk worth taking.

If we lose Hill, that's three productive BUSTS.

Except, if that happens, we will have lost 3 top playmakers and got nothing back from them all because of their “risks”.

Hunt is the only one we didn’t really see coming. Unless he had issues in college that I didn’t hear about.

OBJ isn't Peters. OBJ is a typical diva WR, Peters is a complete asshole. There's a difference.

You could do a LOT worse than a Fisher clone. We got spoiled watching Big Willie Roaf-but Big Willie was a generational talent at LT. It's not Fisher's fault that he was probably the best player in a decade-worst draft and we had the bad luck to pick first.

That small frail corner played pretty well. And I don't think 5'11" 190 is THAT small anyway.

It'll be worth watching their cap situation. They have the room right now to absorb OBJ's contract, but in a couple of years they're going to have to make some decisions. We'll see if Dorsey has learned from his mistakes. As of right now, though, he's following Reid's blueprint and getting Mayfield as many weapons as possible, like we did signing Watkins.

at worst, it's ONE bust.

a few seasons of all-world play from a 3rd round pick and a 5th round pick in a league where the average career is 3-4 years? Those are wins.

and I wouldn't even call Peters a bust. We just didn't want to re-sign him. We got production from him for 3 years.

and we also got two picks for peters

that's true through a certain lens. I would argue that who gets all-world performance from a 5th round draft pick? I would argue that anything more than special teams fodder for a few years is good value in the 5th round.

How many RB's are truly dominant for more than 3 or 4 years? Hunt unfortunately gave us 2. There was nothing in his background that said 'BIG RISK'. I still think he's a good guy, just has a problem. I also think that Reid schemes production from his RB's and always has. Note that Damien Williams actually had a higher ypc than Hunt. So that hole is filled.

Peters was a risk, and everyone knew it, that's why he fell to us in the first place. We still got 3 good years from him. That's not really a bust, but it's not ideal I'll grant you that.

look at it like this-

If you could go back in time, knowing what you know now-

Would you still draft Peters? Maybe not.

Would you still draft Hunt? Probably. Who else is better in that round 3?

Would you still take Tyreek in the 5th? Knowing what we know RIGHT NOW. **** yeah, you would.

because you didn't get more years out of mid to late round picks that were extremely high production players doesn't mean they're busts.

Are you kidding me?

Peters gave this team three years of Pro Bowl play and then netted a 2nd and 4th round pick. Would you have preferred Kevin Johnson, or Trae Waynes or Erving, Agholor, Ogbuehi, Dupree?

Hunt was a great pick but then that story happened. But it is not like he had any character concern pre draft.

Hill gave this team more in 3 years that 90% of late 5th round picks will ever give you.

I swear, some of you dont deserve Pat Mahomes.

Ballard did nail his first draft though, no question.

You can't really compare it with Veach's in any fair manner. We had no #1 and were picking later in each round.

He did. He was suspended in college.

Soren Petro mentioned this on his show and it was really a broad definition but going into last years camp a scout told him the Chiefs had 41 "red flag players". Wasnt sure what that met like failing a drug test? Being late to a meeting? Etc. Thought it was interesting though.

You're both missing the point entirely but I'm not going to debate it. You've already pre-conditioned your minds to accept this cluster****.

wha?

No.

Nobody's missing your point.

You say:
Peters=bust, bad pick
Hunt=bust, bad pick
Hill=bust, bad pick.

Your words.

We say:
Peters-not ideal, worth the risk, 3 years of good play nets a #2 and a #4 in trade.
Hunt-two seasons of all-pro level play for a mid round pick.
Hill-three seasons of amazing, game changing play for a 5th round pick.

While we'd love it if we got 5 plus years from all those guys, you can't be mad because it didn't last longer. They were all HIGH performance per investment.

And we don't know what's going on with Hill. It's just as likely that he'll be cleared as found guilty.

I say you're reacting on an emotional level and not thinking logically.

Another way of saying some people who know how to see and make lemonade(talented production) out of lemons(bad character).:D

look, I'd rather not have bad apples in the bunch either, but you're not going to have a good team fielding 53 choir boys.

I was uncomfortable with taking Hill. Until now, he'd been a model citizen. We'll see if that's still true or not pretty soon.

Hunt just makes me sad for the guy. He ****ed up, no question, no apologies for his actions. I think he needs to get his life and temper under control.

Peters is an asshole, and I was done with him when he left that game after throwing the flag in the stands. And then came back with no socks? What the ****? **** that dickhead.

I still don't think those were wasted picks or bad value.

You’re right. Nobody wanted him. Including this guy. I had to reference him
In my eat crow thead. It appears he’s less of a douche than I anticipated. His arm also looks better than I thought.

He doesn’t take himself too seriously in interviews which I didn’t expect. He’s actually become fairly easy to root for.

Rooting for Baker would be like taking it in ass from 3 donkey fans.

I’ll root for that cock holster the day he breaks his knee.

That's what Dorsey does more than anyone. He thinks he can find value by picking guys that have dropped due to character issues. Reid has done it and continues to endorse it as well, but Dorsey just does not give a **** about character.