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Kiimo 04-19-2017 06:20 PM
Also Kizer can't hit on short throws and being inaccurate on short throws is like the #1 problem in this offense.

It's also my "okay f this guy" breaking point. Can you imagine having a QB missing a wide open Tyreke Hill in the flat? We'd lose our minds.

Coogs 04-19-2017 06:50 PM
I still prefer Watson. I have been watching Saga45's video's over in the draft planet, and Watson is still the guy I hope we draft. Yes, I know his fastball was timed at 49, but have read where that can be increased with work... and without overhauling his game. He also gets rid of the ball in .35 of a second, which is the same as Aaron Rodgers.

Some say he is Alex Smith. When I watch him, there is nothing there that makes me think "this is like watching Alex Smith". I see poise and patience in the pocket. I see eyes still down field the whole time he has the ball. I see a guy that can make a mistake, and let it go. A guy good enough to overcome a turnover or two, and still make plays to win a game.

One week out... Give me Watson.

-King- 04-19-2017 06:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coogs (Post 12831248)
I still prefer Watson. I have been watching Saga45's video's over in the draft planet, and Watson is still the guy I hope we draft. Yes, I know his fastball was timed at 49, but have read where that can be increased with work... and without overhauling his game. He also gets rid of the ball in .35 of a second, which is the same as Aaron Rodgers.

Some say he is Alex Smith. When I watch him, there is nothing there that makes me think this is like watching Alex Smith. I see poise and patience in the pocket. I see eyes still down field the whole time he had the ball. I see a guy that can make a mistake, and let it go. A guy good enough to overcome a turnover or two, and still make plays to win a game.

One week out... Give me Watson.
This. And while his velocity still is a concern for me, having the fastest release in the class kind of balances it out. He'd be great in this offense.

Coogs 04-19-2017 06:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by -King- (Post 12831250)
This. And while his velocity still is a concern for me, having the fastest release in the class kind of balances it out. He'd be great in this offense.
:thumb:

Mr. Laz 04-19-2017 06:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 12831140)
All true, but now go in the order of 'most likely to have to take in the 1st round' to 'least likely' and aren't you able to rank order that a bit?

1) QB - Smith; if you're replacing him in '18, it's going to take a first rounder

2) LB - Johnson and Chaff - This is a thin ILB class, IMO. After the 2nd round, you're digging through Ramik Wilson kind of LBers unless you think you can snag someone like Kendall Beckwith or Alex Anzalone and get lucky with injuries.

3) NT - also not a great NT class but there are some guys here that will likely be able to be found in the 2nd and 3rd rounds; guys like Jaleel Johnson, Montravus Adams, Elijah Qualls, etc...; you can get your NT a little later. And if you needed to, Jones could play the nose so you can add a pile of solid DEs to this list to deepen it if you wanted.

4) CB - Just in INSANELY deep draft class and you're not looking to replace CB1 next year, rather you're looking at CB2 where you can scheme around some weaknesses.

Based on that, I think you're likely to see QB, ILB, DL and possibly WR in that order (Maclin is a very possible cap casualty next season).
Agreed, reasonable conclusions.

FTR Albert Wilson is also a FA in 2018, Conley in 2019.


The entire thing hinges on "if you're replacing him in '18" though.

Our QB depth chart is very thin right now, which is another indicator.

Alex Smith
Tyler Bray
Joel Stave

That is an ugly QB depth chart. :Lin:

Don't forget the RB position, Ware is probably better as a #2.

notorious 04-19-2017 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coogs (Post 12831248)
I still prefer Watson. I have been watching Saga45's video's over in the draft planet, and Watson is still the guy I hope we draft. Yes, I know his fastball was timed at 49, but have read where that can be increased with work... and without overhauling his game. He also gets rid of the ball in .35 of a second, which is the same as Aaron Rodgers.

Some say he is Alex Smith. When I watch him, there is nothing there that makes me think "this is like watching Alex Smith". I see poise and patience in the pocket. I see eyes still down field the whole time he has the ball. I see a guy that can make a mistake, and let it go. A guy good enough to overcome a turnover or two, and still make plays to win a game.

One week out... Give me Watson.
It's going to happen.


http://www.threadbombing.com/data/me...N_predator.gif

O.city 04-19-2017 07:18 PM
Watsons lack of a fastball really gives me pause. There haven't been many guys, iirc, that have been that low that have been successful.

RunKC 04-19-2017 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coogs (Post 12831248)
I still prefer Watson. I have been watching Saga45's video's over in the draft planet, and Watson is still the guy I hope we draft. Yes, I know his fastball was timed at 49, but have read where that can be increased with work... and without overhauling his game. He also gets rid of the ball in .35 of a second, which is the same as Aaron Rodgers.

Some say he is Alex Smith. When I watch him, there is nothing there that makes me think "this is like watching Alex Smith". I see poise and patience in the pocket. I see eyes still down field the whole time he had the ball. I see a guy that can make a mistake, and let it go. A guy good enough to overcome a turnover or two, and still make plays to win a game.

One week out... Give me Watson.
I agree.

If he's Alex, he's the Alex we have wanted to see but never have. He's not going to be a pussy out there and if there's one guy from this crop that I want with the ball in his hands with 2 mins left in the game it's him.

The INT bullshit is inflated and overstated. 5 of his 17 INT's were from WR running the wrong route, WR falling down on the route, perfectly placed balls hitting off the hands of the WR or an alligator arm effort from a good enough. All that should have been caught.

Also the Malik Hooker INT was crazy. Watson placed that ball perfectly but Hooker is just a flat out boss.

RealSNR 04-19-2017 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coogs (Post 12831248)
I still prefer Watson. I have been watching Saga45's video's over in the draft planet, and Watson is still the guy I hope we draft. Yes, I know his fastball was timed at 49, but have read where that can be increased with work... and without overhauling his game. He also gets rid of the ball in .35 of a second, which is the same as Aaron Rodgers.

Some say he is Alex Smith. When I watch him, there is nothing there that makes me think "this is like watching Alex Smith". I see poise and patience in the pocket. I see eyes still down field the whole time he has the ball. I see a guy that can make a mistake, and let it go. A guy good enough to overcome a turnover or two, and still make plays to win a game.

One week out... Give me Watson.
I'd like to see him with better ball placement on slants and crosses. The velocity is one thing, but the placement is off, too. Maybe if he speeds it up that will change and he'll meet his receivers quicker and in better position in their routes, but for now there's a lot to be desired in that regard.

It's why the velocity is such an enormous red flag for me. In my limited knowledge of QB coaching, I would think that's something that's close to impossible to improve and teach, but if it CAN be improved, I think that will fix a lot of his problems.

The issue is do I want to bet on our coaches being able to smooth out the footwork and routine mechanics of somebody like Mahomes or do I want to bet on Watson developing more velocity on his throws? Which one is more likely?

-King- 04-19-2017 07:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 12831311)
I'd like to see him with better ball placement on slants and crosses. The velocity is one thing, but the placement is off, too. Maybe if he speeds it up that will change and he'll meet his receivers quicker and in better position in their routes, but for now there's a lot to be desired in that regard.

It's why the velocity is such an enormous red flag for me. In my limited knowledge of QB coaching, I would think that's something that's close to impossible to improve and teach, but if it CAN be improved, I think that will fix a lot of his problems.

The issue is do I want to bet on our coaches being able to smooth out the footwork and routine mechanics of somebody like Mahomes or do I want to bet on Watson developing more velocity on his throws? Which one is more likely?
Footwork is more fixable.

But I also don't think you need great velocity in the offense we run. Our offense is basically pitch and catch. When Alex plays, I don't feel like he puts a lot of velocity on his throws and I don't think it hampers him. What does hamper him is his willingness to take shots down the field. Watson looks like he'd be willing to take the shots down the field that Alex misses out on. What he would have to improve on is his ball placement so that our WRs and RBs and Kelce can get YAC.

notorious 04-19-2017 07:30 PM
http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/03/how-...e-logan-thomas

Quote:
Quarterbacks don’t get much over 60 mph, no matter who’s throwing. It should be noted that Thomas’s record is only for players who threw for velocity. Many top prospects haven’t done that at the combine, a list that includes Andrew Luck, Sam Bradford, Robert Griffin III, Tim Tebow, Matthew Stafford and Matt Ryan. Even so, Logan Thomas threw faster than Colin Kaepernick (59 mph), Nick Foles (57) and Russell Wilson (55).

Then again Tyler Bray (59), Stephen Morris (59), Drew Willy (58), Mike Reilly (58) and Paul Smith (57) were all pretty fast too. Brandon Weeden (59) and Kirk Cousins (59) were ahead of Foles and Wilson in the 2012 combine. And if throwing hard equated to on-field prowess, Jeff George would have been a first-ballot Hall of Famer.

O.city 04-19-2017 07:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by -King- (Post 12831326)
Footwork is more fixable.

But I also don't think you need great velocity in the offense we run. Our offense is basically pitch and catch. When Alex plays, I don't feel like he puts a lot of velocity on his throws and I don't think it hampers him. What does hamper him is his willingness to take shots down the field. Watson looks like he'd be willing to take the shots down the field that Alex misses out on. What he would have to improve on is his ball placement so that our WRs and RBs and Kelce can get YAC.
That lack of velocity makes those windows that much smaller.

It doesn't hamper Smith, but I'd imagine thats a reason why he isn't aggressive.

Coogs 04-19-2017 07:56 PM
Like I said, I have been doing a lot of research. I don't know where I read this, so I can not link it, and I am paraphrasing. They were saying Manning, Bree's, and if I recall correctly Brady were not all that with velocity when they entered the NFL. But with coaching and the work in weight room, they all increased their velocity very quickly in their careers.

So while 49 mph is a concern, it isn't a deal breaker for me.

Coogs 04-19-2017 08:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 12831382)
That lack of velocity makes those windows that much smaller.

It doesn't hamper Smith, but I'd imagine thats a reason why he isn't aggressive.
A reason maybe, but far from the only one. Probably like reason number 7 or 8 on a list of reasons.

-King- 04-19-2017 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 12831382)
That lack of velocity makes those windows that much smaller.

It doesn't hamper Smith, but I'd imagine thats a reason why he isn't aggressive.
The quick release can make up for it.


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