So with the D line currently looking like:

DE: Karlaftis, Omenihu, Danna, Kaindoh, Herring
DT: Jones, Wharton, Omenihu (sometimes)

I am thinking DE is less a priority now then DT.

Came here to ask the same basically.

Is Omenihu our new starter at DE then? or is he a rotational guy? Doesn't seem like the fast-bendy guy many fans are hoping for opposite of George, am I wrong? Unclear.

He's getting paid to be, IMO. At the very least he's going to be heavily used in the rotation, both inside and out.

I really, really like that signing.

If they can get Gaines I'd do jumping jacks. I'm too fat to do them but I'd figure it out.

I'd like to see Agholor or Campbell at WR to be honest. These big names are overdoing it IMO.

Someone in the other thread suggested he'd start at DE and move inside on passing downs, and that we're prob still looking for a fast pass rushing specialist at DE in the draft. I think that feels about right to me.

I like the signings so far, wish we hadn't struck out on Tunsil, we're signing guys at quality contracts, younger ascending players, and we prob have room for another high caliber addition or two.

Omenihu plays early downs at DE, then slides inside and Will McDonald comes in on passing downs. Then we wreck shit.

Careful. They'll pile on you for that.

LMAO

Would be pretty hyped for this scenario

A move for Burns would be awesome, I'm game! Adding another star caliber player to our DL with CJ would give teams fits!

Why not Clowney? CP never seems to have any interest in him, but kid has potential if we can manage his ego. Not very expensive either, could play Ingram's role.

It'll be interesting to see his value. What did he get last year? $10m? Year older, leaving with a bit of bad blood. Gotta think he's getting max $8-9m? But honestly I might just see what Ingram wants. He's probably even cheaper, and I think he has more as a pass rusher

Damn you.........god damn you

Obviously we’d like to have a new starting DE but damn man. The Kaindoh and Herring experiment has got to end.

They need more depth back there

Send a 3rd to the Commanders for Chase Young and see what happens. He's ideal across from Karlaftis.

Ok...you gotta clue me in on McDonald. Are we just assuming that Spags is throwing out what he's looking for? Is he not less than 240 lbs like they have him listed?

McDonald is real bendy and explosive. I like that alot.

Cullen is at the Georgia Pro Day and running the defensive linemen through drills.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Chiefs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Chiefs</a> DL Coach Joe Cullen on the lead today at <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Georgia?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Georgia</a><br><br>- Jalen Carter<br>- Nolan Smith <a href="https://t.co/Xkfe48tCdB">pic.twitter.com/Xkfe48tCdB</a></p>&mdash; ᴄᴏᴅʏ ᴄᴀʀᴘᴇɴᴛɪᴇʀ (@CarpentierNFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/CarpentierNFL/status/1636027779941642240?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 15, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">These are not Ws being posted. The weight is a big concern considering this is the most important job interview of your life. Testing was expected to be a positive and now he&#39;s not testing. The slide could be very real for Carter. <a href="https://t.co/D88hrzRzNU">https://t.co/D88hrzRzNU</a></p>&mdash; Lance Zierlein (@LanceZierlein) <a href="https://twitter.com/LanceZierlein/status/1636016366028312577?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 15, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
:drool:

With Saunders gone, I am thinking 1st or 2nd round pick has to be DT now.

I'd move up to around 20 for him if he falls.

Jalen Carter won't last past 9, Eberflus is a cover 2 guy and that fit would be to good to pass on.

Also some of the video Nolan Smiths bend is pretty impressive.

Will McDonald and Nolan Smith look good but are less than 240 lbs. pretty skinny dudes.

Seems to not fit what Spags has traditionally valued

I don't think they'll be there when we pick, to many 3-4 teams that want pass rushers.

Everywhere I've seen has Will McDonald over 240, most 245. Looks plausible to me. He can play the run just fine and, like Nolan Smith, very well for a guy that weight. We have 2 big DEs in Karlaftis and Omenihu and Jones playing there plenty. Power is not an issue, speed is. McDonald would be an excellent pick up, Smith won't get anywhere near to our pick, he's just too good of an athlete.

It's Hall, Foskey, or Adetomiwa Adebawore

Or McDonald. I think we might break the mould this year

I don’t see McDonald being the pick.

Yes there are exceptions, but if you notice one thing about Veach’s early picks. There’s one thing in common. He very much prefers to use the premium picks on young guys. McDuffie, Karlaftis, and Skyy were all 21. Creed and Bolton were both 21. Clyde 21 and Willie Gay was 22.

McDonald will be 24 when the season starts. I don’t think his age automatically rules him out or anything. But it would definitely be breaking the norm

I did a breakdown in another thread and I think I only spotted like 6 dudes that were 23/24 when drafted the entire time Veach has been drafting guys. He definitely prefers younger players, probably so they still have value when looking to extend or maybe trade them. If you draft a 24yo, they will be 28 or so when their rookie deal is up. Unless they are baller af, we aren't going to be super invested in extending them long term.

Yeah that’s how I see it. And he probably just thinks there is so much more room for improvement with the young guys as well. If he thinks McDonald is a class above the available guys I’m sure it could happen. But I just don’t see any Danny Watkins (remember him?) scenarios happening under Veach

Side note - Karlaftis is a month away from even turning 22. He’s just scratching the surface

I wouldn’t mind Felix Anudike-Uzahma in the first. He is an explosive and with really good bend. And is 255 lbs.
and is only 21 years old

Yeah I keep forgetting his age, it's a fair point, i feel like that might be a disqualifier more than the weight for Veach/Spags

Looking as Pass Rusher metrics in the draft below, size & speed vs production, to identify our best fits.

Spage Type & Team Need:
-6-4+, 260+
-Faster more agile DE than Karlaftis (4.71)

Athletes: 3-5 Sacks
-Adetomiwa Adebawore
-Zach Harrison

In-between: 5-8 Sacks
-Lukas Van Ness
-Keion White
-Derrick Hall
-Isaiah McGuire
-Byron Young
-DJ Johnson

Productive: 9+ Sacks
-Isaiah Foskey
-Tui Tuipulotu
-Andre Carter
-Yaya Diaby
-Karl Brooks
-Viliami Fehoko
-Thomas Incoom

I think Isaiah Foskey is our ideal target: 6-5, 265 lbs, 4.58 40 time, 12 Sacks

Both Diaby and Incoom are interesting later round targets IMO

I like Felix A-U a lot, I like Foskey a lot, Hall, too.

I think Mcdonald is just too light. Ojulari is about as light as I can imagine them going; but Ojulari like Mcdonald would pretty much be wide 9 only rushers. Think Dee Ford types. (Not saying they're stupid and can't line up onsides, or brokedicks, just similar playing styles.) The thing with that is, they might get some pressures and sacks, but they're just too light and will get run over.

I mean, if I was an offensive coordinator, that's what I'd do. I'd run right at 'em with a pulling guard and just obliterate them as much as possible.

I think Mcd is just strictly going to be a 3-4 rushbacker. Probably a real good one, but I don't see the scheme versatility.

Mazi Smith pro day today. Let’s see what he does

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This EDGE class is tailor made for Steve Spagnuolo.<br><br>Since arriving in KC (2019), this draft class has:<br><br>- Has the most HIGH fit DEs (15)<br>- Has the second MOST medium fit DEs (16)<br>- The MOST high + medium fit DEs (31)</p>&mdash; Matt Lane (@Matty_KCSN) <a href="https://twitter.com/Matty_KCSN/status/1637556338929573890?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 19, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

What is the criteria he's using here? What exactly is HIGH FIT, MEDIUM FIT based on? Size/length/speed?

I'd be curious about the same.

I think Size/Length is certainly a thing. Length more in the arms I think than overall. Size being more in that 260-270 range. Not so sure about the speed. At DE it's more about acceleration than it is about speed. How quickly does he get off the ball and then how quickly can he close to the QB when the opportunity is there? We're talking a 5-yard window here most of the time. I really don't think Spags cares a whole bunch about top-end. I'd be more inclined to look at a short shuttle for DL. Maybe look at a 10-yard split but certainly not 40 times.

I think Power is the next thing. You can look at a combo of vertical and bench and composite that. But really, I think it's identifying the guys that can be multiple and display inside/outside versatility. Diaby and guys like that are going to likely be pretty high on Spags list because they have good arm length, good power, good release, and they can play in/out.

That's my opinion, for whatever it's worth.

Let me see if I can find the criteria he's using again. I know it includes height, weight, arm length and a couple of other factors.

Looks like it's height, weight and arm length. He lists out most of the DEs here and whether they're good, medium or low fits by the colors.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">KC EDGE thresholds<br><br>Felix Anudike-Uzomah ��<br><br>Ht 6031 ��<br>Wt 255 ��<br>Arm length 33.5” ��</p>&mdash; Matt Lane (@Matty_KCSN) <a href="https://twitter.com/Matty_KCSN/status/1631311383181635584?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 2, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Tavius Robinson is my dark horse at the edge this year. He has a good burst off the snap and has that really good length to go with a frame to pack on 20 pounds with ease. Improve his run anchor and his rush plan and get him out of that odd front that doesn't fit his skills.

He's a day 3 guy but I'd take him pretty early on day 3.

Okay, I'll bite: What do the colors mean? I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess green means HIGH. But what about the others?

Green is a good fit.
Orange is a medium fit.
Red is a low fit.

Here's the basic slotting he has:

High
Tyree Wilson, Texas Tech
Lukas Van Ness, Iowa
Myles Murphy, Clemson
Isaiah Foskey, Notre Dame
Keion White, Georgia Tech
Isaiah McGuire, Missouri
Zach Harrison, Ohio State
Mike Morris, Michigan
Tyler Lacy, Oklahoma State
D.J. Johnson, Oregon
Ali Gaye, LSU

Medium
Tuli Tuipulotu, USC
Derick Hall, Auburn
Felix Anudike-Uzomah, Kansas State
Tavius Robinson, Ole Miss
Andre Carter, Army
K.J. Henry, Clemson
Eku Leota, Auburn
Adetomiwa Adebawore, Northwestern
Dylan Horton, TCU
M.J. Anderson, Iowa State
Ochaun Mathis, Nebraska
Brenton Cox, Florida

Low
B.J. Ojulari, LSU
Will McDonald IV, Iowa State
Nolan Smith, Georgia
Nick Herbig, Wisconsin
Byron Young, Tennessee
Lonnie Phelps, Kansas
Nick Hampton, Appalachian State
Jose Ramirez, Eastern Michigan


Some guys he's missing:
Colby Wooden, Auburn - High
YaYa Diaby, Louisville - High
Thomas Incoom, Central Michigan - Medium
Yasir Abdullah, Louisville - Low

Favorite 5:
Isaiah Foskey, Notre Dame
Keion White, Georgia Tech
Adetomiwa Adebawore, Northwestern
Tuli Tuipulotu, USC
Zach Harrison, Ohio State


Bonus 5:
YaYa Diaby, Louisville
Villiami Fehoko, San Jose St
Karl Brooks, Bowling Green
Thomas Incoom, Central Michigan
Cam Murphy, Ferris State

@KCKrow did Matt Lane score other positions as well? DL or WR perhaps?

No idea. He just copied my shit anyhow. Just kidding. :D

I know he mentioned Demario Douglas out of Liberty a few days ago. I mentioned him a couple of weeks ago or so as a guy Direckshun should check out when he was going all giddy about shifty players.

Not sure who else he's high on. I don't subscribe to his draft guide or whatever it is he calls it.

Pest might know.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/S-alUkOi6HQ" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

No. That's not him "scoring" players. It's basing it off of the type of EDGE that Spags likes. It's just saying whether a player is a fit or not when it comes to height, weight and arm length. I believe he's only drafted one player that wasn't a fit and that was Mike Danna.

Danna worked out just fine.

Eh - I think they'll target tiers. When 31 comes up they'll look at the position tiers and see if there's a standout target left at any of them (vs 3 or 4 similarly situated guys at other positions) and take the guy they think they'll be less able to find a reasonable facsimile for in the 2nd.

They really took need off the board with their moves in FA. RT is the only real problem area now and I think they still have some faith in Niang. DT needs help but I don't see a 1st round possibility sliding to us there.

You know, this could very well mean the Chiefs could wait until round 2 and still get a very good Edge.

This may signal another position in round 1 where the depth is not so strong.

It's a risk, though. I think that's how Speaks and Skyy happened.

Now that's not to say I think Moore will have the same impact as Speaks did (none at all) but I think we slow played the position both times banking on depth to bail is out and suddenly in the span of a handful of picks, the depth vanished on us and we ended up taking the last guy in the tier to avoid being shut out entirely.

Ideally you want to be mid-run on stuff like that and it's just not possible from the back of the round unless you're REALLY proactive on trade ups and have a real good feel for how the draft will go.

There's a really good chance I wouldn't risk it.

Speaks is currently in the USFL. He was a 2nd round pick like 5 years ago and is not yet 30. I would certainly hope that they don't risk waiting until there aren't any 2nd round pass rushers available to take one.

Cannot believe how much depth there is in this draft at Edge. After the top guys that extend to early rd 2, you’ve got guys like Tuli Tuipulotu, Tyrus Wheat and Tavius Robinson who all look like capable players with strong traits.

Man. I can really see Veach doing what he did at Corner last year with the DL this year. Would not shock me to see 2 edges and a DT drafted

Maybe take an OT in the 1st, trade up in the 2nd for DE, trade our 3rd for Hopkins.

RD 1 - OT A Harrison, D Jones, or D Wright
RD 2 - [Trade up = 2nd + 4th + CEH] DE Foskey, Adebaware, Tuipulotu, or Carter
RD 3 - [Trade for Hopkins = 3rd + 2024 5th]
RD 4 - DT
RD 4 - N/A
RD 5 - BPA
RD 6 - BPA
RD 6 - BPA
RD 7 - BPA
RD 7 - BPA

What's yall's fascination with Andre Carter? He's maybe a 3rd round guy and that's based on some of his athletic traits. I wouldn't trade up for him in the 2nd by any stretch. I'm saying NO. Don't do it mate.

I'm feeling that the NFL is going to view this edge class differently than the media.

My assumption is:

1. W. Anderson
2. T. Wilson
3. L. VanNess
4. M. Murphy
5. N. Smith (3-4)
6. I. Foskey
7. T. Tuipulotu
8. W. McDonald (3-4)
9. D. Hall
10. F. Anudike-Uzomah

As for K. White and A. Adebawore, I really think you put those guys as 3-4 DEs and not EDGE IMO.

That's my takety take.

I kinda worry sometime when there's alot of "depth and similarity" of a group in a draft it's more because there's not really any one that separates themselves and it's all kinda grouped together.

Luckily, we have the best staff going to figure out who's who.

If you're speaking on edge, I think there's clear delineation in talent levels.

I think you have Anderson and Wilson then a drop to a tier of Van Ness, Murphy, Foskey, and Tuipulotu and then another drop to a tier of Smith, Hall, McDonald, Anudike-Uzomah, and Ojulari before it drops again. I just so happen to think Smith is going to get drafted higher than some others because of his athleticism in a 3-4 fit.

That's my take at least, I can't speak for everyone.

I'm on the Foskey at 31 train.

I'm more of the, post the first 2, there isn't much that separates the prospects, other than projecting them out. Which is definitely part of the whole deal, don't get me wrong, but that gets tough to do.

Depends on what you're looking at I think. In terms of run defense, that 2nd tier is a whole lot better than the 3rd tier. I think that's what creates your dividing lines, honestly.

There's a big drop either way you look at it after about the 2nd round level of these guys, so we need to hit it early and often if that's the route they wanna go.

LMAO

Veach can legitimately hit anywhere in the draft. Have you learned nothing?

Pass rushers from the mid late round in terms of the type we need now, aren't exactly high occurrences.

That's my bad. I forgot this is a DL thread. I thought you were talking in general.

But I still think we can get a guy like McGuire, Harrison, or Young in the 3rd. Or somebody like Roy at DT. There will be talent still available in the 3rd on the DL, and I wouldn't be surprised if they took a guy in the 1st/2nd AND the 3rd.

I think those guys can turn into nice rotational pieces for sure, but I'm wanting a real pass rusher that can play every down.

I disagree that that is their upside/ceiling. Those guys can definitely develop into starters.

You get too caught up with this "you can only find good players and starters early in the draft" shit dude.

We have our starting edge rushers going into the season. Whoever we take, regardless of the round, is going to be a rotational player early on.

It's entirely possible that you take 1 in the 1st and 1 in the 3rd and it's actually the guy in the 3rd that develops into a starter. You just build your roster laterally, and continue to stack talent at those important positions. Everything else will sort itself out.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Keion White was FLYING at his Pro Day ��<br><br>White clocked in at an unofficial time of 4.65, which would’ve been the FASTEST time of any player over 283 pounds at the NFL Combine this year.<br><br>White weighed in at 6’5” 285 pounds.<br><br>The Georgia Tech DE is a FREAK. <a href="https://t.co/IprBs3GmNu">pic.twitter.com/IprBs3GmNu</a></p>&mdash; NFL Rookie Watch (@NFLRookieWatxh) <a href="https://twitter.com/NFLRookieWatxh/status/1637120653714247680?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 18, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Yeah I think everyone should be excited tbh. The way I see it Veach IS going to miss on a few, it's just a numbers game and he's due an early round whiff. But we've got a million picks and he'll definitely hit on some too.

It's not whether we will get better in every position, I just don't think that's realistic. It's whether we are better across the 53 when the season starts. Sounds crazy to think with a SB team but there's just so many ways it can still improve. Last year nobody liked the DTs or RT and plenty thought the WR and DE groups were poor. Will we get better across all of these? Maybe not. But where are we at at present? I'd say we're already better at DE, LB, and safety we could be worse but could also be better when you consider better LB coverage. We're probably worse at WR, OT and DT. I think we can DEFINITELY start the season with improvements in at least two of those positions, if not all 3.

Just to add - the mistake I always make is to focus on the picks where there seemed an obvious alternative that would've been better. Obviously, that's a bummer, but the real question should always be "does this pick make us better". If the answer is yes, and you may not know that for a year or more, then it's a win.

Tavius Robinson, Ole Miss
6’6”
257 lbs
33.75 arms
4.66 40
1.63 10
23 bench reps

Would love to get this guy on the beginning of day 3. Excellent depth piece that could probably do some of what Omenihu does but needs time to get a bit stronger.

With Danna likely leaving next Spring and Turk coming back from a big injury, it would be nice to have this guy.

Time to get rid of Herring and Kaindoh and bolster the depth

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Feels like Foskey is the consensus pick if he's available at #31.

I can't see any chance they pass on Keion White if he slides to them.

I mean...his potential is off the scale.

Long, heavy, extremely powerful, freakishly athletic - he's a damn monster.

Foskey's not as heavy, not as powerful and I don't see as much agility either. He's a strict speed edge and while I think that's a fine guy to add - if you could add White, who brings the same athleticism while also being strong enough to move inside at times, he just seems more 'spags'.

Maybe the relatively paltry production in college will push him into the mid-2nd and we wouldn't be willing to gamble on him. But man, how many 6'5" 280+ lb guys who can pop up 30 reps and then run a 4.6 40 are you going to find?

He's just a specimen.

I've said it before, but White is everything Veach wished he was getting with Speaks.

Whaaaaaaat?

Speaks lacked...everything. Athleticism, strength, agility - all of it.

That pick was real dumb from the moment it was made and it sure LOOKED dumb at the time.

(Well, for SOME of us...)

I mean if you looked at White and said "White is who we hoped Tanoh or Kaindoh could be..." then I'd understand that. But Speaks? Man, I see no comparison of those 2 at all.

Seriously - WTF was Veach thinking with Breeland Speaks?

I really don't understand it. Didn't have the athleticism to play on an edge (certainly not as an OLB), especially when combined with the lack of length. And he didn't have the strength to play inside. He brought NOTHING to the table even as a prospect. There's no a single standout tool and wasn't from the moment he was drafted.

White would give Spags a defensive line where he could rush any of them from any spot on passing downs.

Karlaftis - Jones - Omenihu - White

Shit.

Oh I'm not saying they're comparable prospects aside from size. That's kind of the point.

Right?

It's literally 4 guys who are almost completely interchangeable on the DL. It's...actually kinda bizarre.

But man, it could be fun as hell.

They completely ****ing ****ed coaching that kid. I was really high on Speaks as a DT prospect. He absolutely had outstanding athleticism if they would have used him inside where he was best in college. Instead, brilliant ****ing Bob tries to make him a damned OLB. Then he spends all year injured when Spags arrived and never developed. I don't think it was the pick as much as it was the absolute dipshits that were Sutton and Co.

I'm less nervous with Spags but if they pick Moro Ojomo, Tyler Lacy, or Dante Stills those butterflies might come back.

God…I’d forgotten about Speaks at OLB.