That's the ideal situation for sure. I want him to stay and hopefully he does if all the numbers work out okay for both sides.

Chris Jones should be one of the center pieces of this team going forward. Chiefs just have to make sure he is the ultracompetitive type and that he won't take it easy after he gets paid. Whatever he gets it is going to be a lot. so better make sure he is worth it. Only so much money to go around.

I kinda wish they would just get a deal done with Patrick right away and maybe he will get a Chief friendly contract that would show how serious he is about winning championships and therefor lead by example and the rest of the players take a discount because they will be on Mahomes team.



Who the **** would be stupid to go else where when Patrick Mahomes II gives his team the best chance to win multiple Super Bowls?

Not only does Patrick Mahomes II give his team best chance to win Super Bowls but he demoralizes the defensive players against him. So going else where would be dumb for Chris Jones or any FA not to want to come to Kansas City on the cheap because even if your NFC and you will lose in the Super Bowl against Kansas City Chiefs.

So do we have any cap rollover money from last season that still can be applied to our cap number? Or has that already been factored in?

Right now Over the Cap has us at about 13.7 million.

OK, Megatard, it appears literacy is among your many weak mental aspects.

You see, Megadouche, the Berry and Houston deals are not irrelevant. They are a perfect, shining example of why you dont dump a ton of money on one guy. Those who dont know history, are dooned to repeat it. The Chiefs have been burned twice, and I find it extremely hilarious you say Berry was irrelevant, because were the Chiefs not still eating dead money, we arent in as piss poor a position to retain our players that we are now.

While yes, Megazord, you could cherry pick the guys who got stupid money and produced decent results on one hand, (assuming you can count, thats a big ****in leap of faith but hey..) there are far more instances of complacency and injury on these huge deals than homeruns. Dwayne Bowe wants to know if you need anything from Sonic, btw.

As I said before, Megaturd, Patrick Mahomes, the best player on the God damn planet, is the ONLY guy worthy of any contract number. The guy has the ability to affect the outcome of any given game by himself, and more importantly, is irreplaceable. Even he knows that in order to build the team, he probably has to take less than hes really worth.



Your ridiculous little comment about trade Kelce hes 30, doesnt hold water. Kelce isn't looking to be the leagues top paid receiver.

Hill, big swing and a miss there too. Everyone with a functioning braincell knows Hills deal has been structured so that we do not get burned, due to his off field soap opera that was taking place.

In the end, Megatranny, if Jones is more interested in breaking the bank than winning super bowls, he needs to do that elsewhere and we utilize the picks and cash to deepen the roster with talent across the board.

The ship kind sailed when no deal was done with Jones, and we gave Frank Clark his money. To your point, Clark did produce. But only after a period where CP got up in arms about how much he sucked. Getting a Lombardi softens the blow of his deal, so even if he flames out going forward due to injuries or what have you, people will still reflect on that one good postseason run that helped us win a title and say it was worth every penny.

They are probably right, but it still doesnt change the fact that his deal affects the Jones deal, and affects the overall team.

Hopefully Megadork, that clarifies some things for you.

Anybody claiming that Jones wants to be the highest paid player in the game when he has yet to say that anywhere....is talking out their ass.

That to go with Trubisky over Mahomes?

https://media.giphy.com/media/a4K7jjmwg0DyE/giphy.gif

The Bears also got a second rounder back in the deal

A 1st + 2nd would be a no brainer. Jones is a great player, but not so great that he can make up for a talent vacuum in several other spot at his expense (financially).

2 x 1's + 2 x 2's also helps you set up for 2 years from now talent and cap wise.

IVIT


In Veach I Trust

Chris Jones is going to be the new Alex Gordon.

I’m with most that trust BV to make the right decision.

I just hope he either:

Signs him to a deal that doesn’t hamstring the team going forward

Or

Gets fair compensation in a trade.

I think that’s where most are at. I’m glad I’m not the one making the decision. Veach with draft capital is exciting, though.

Yeah and for all that offensive talent they only won one SB and that was because they finally put together a somewhat respectable defense.

Who?

Fair point. Aaron Rodgers also only won one SB because they never surrounded him with weapons.

I’ve no idea what the correct way to go on jones is. As others have posted trust in Veach . We have seen that you can have the best offense in the league and if you don’t have a damn good defense to go with it you ain’t winning shit.

If people are being honest...Mahomes won the SB because Jones batted down some potential first downs in the 4th quarter...

Jones also caused the initial pressure that led to a Garoppolo INT.

And give credit to Dee ford not being a CHIEF!

I kinda doubt the next NFC SB QB is Jimmy G

Chris Jones is not the best defensive player in the league. He's pretty one dimensional. He is just lucky that his one dimension is really important.

He's not even the best defender on the Chiefs. He might be 3rd.

Mathieu had 2 TD saving tackles, Suggs read a screen and saved a likely screen TD, Fisher had the key block on the 3rd and 15 conversion driving Bosa out of the play, Pennel had the hit the caused the INT, Clark had a key pressure and sack to end the 49ers offense on 4th down.

You can say this shit about several players dude.

400m dollars on 3 players?

200m on Mahomes
100m on Clark
100m on Jones

I don't think we can afford to do that.

Can the Chiefs make CJ the highest paid defender in the league? They can.

Should they? Absolutely not.

IF that is what he and his agent are wanting, goodbye Chris. Love you as a player and appreciate the last 4 years, but can’t sacrifice other areas of the Team just to support your bloated contract. Only Mahomes gets that luxury.

Hope Veach gets a nice draft haul for him in a trade. Hopefully to the NFC somewhere.

No one is claiming that

A little help here ...

If somebody can explain the details associated with the franchise tag vs. the transition tag (in short, easy to comprehend words), I would be most grateful.

FAX

Give me a 1st and a 2nd and sign me up for trading him. Congrats to Jones if he can get $20m+.

He’s earned it and has his ring. But we don’t need two DL making $20+.

We have too many areas we need to address this year and beyond.

Try this FAX.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...303-story.html

Only difference here is that instead of being automatically awarded 2 first round picks for the non-exclusive franchise tag, the compensation between teams is usually negotiated into the deal. For example, last year the Chiefs agreed to one 2nd round pick for Dee Ford instead of two 1st round picks.

Strahan

Reggie White, Michael Strahan and Chris Jones have similar frames and IMO ability.

Time will tell. The first one is one of the all-time great NFL players. Strahan was pretty good, but is not in the same conversation as White.

Jones is very good, but you could make a case that he is not even the best defender on the Chiefs. He very well could be, but Mathieu ain't bad either. Nor is Clark.

Uhh... sure? If the only dimensions are "interior pass rushing" and "not letting your dick fall out of your shorts when you sprint" then yeah, I guess Chris Jones is pretty one-dimensional.

"Not even the best defender on the Chiefs." What does this even ****ing mean? Also, who ****ing cares? That's like saying "Tyreek Hill isn't even the best offensive player on the Chiefs. He might be 3rd." Except what you said was way dumber, because you can make a legit argument for Jones being the best player on the Chiefs defense, whereas everybody and their blind deaf mothers would say Mahomes is the best player on the Chiefs offense.

Thought it was pretty straight forward.

You can make a case his is the best. You can make a case Mathieu is. You can make a case for Clark too. When he could be 3rd best, you don't make him the highest paid player in the NFL.

Mahomes on the other hand. Pay the man.

So what if Clark or Mathieu is a coin flip on who is better than Jones. You know who is not better? Anthony Hitchens, Daniel Sorenson, Derrick Nnadi, Alex Okafor, Breeland Speaks. The list goes on. You know those picks youd get for trading Chris Jones...they could be another Chris Jones or they could very well be another Breeland Speaks. Why not just pay the (very good) devil you know vs the devil you dont.

I noticed I haven’t seen you post much since we won the SB and just looking at your recent post history you literally haven’t posted once about winning it.

Your last post before you started posting again (before the SB) was you bitching about Reid when the Chiefs were down 24-0.

Then you disappeared, came back, and still come off like a miserable pillowbitergot.

What the **** is your problem dude? The Chiefs win a SB, you don’t even acknowledge it on here and just go back to being a miserable ****?

Do you have any joy in your life whatsoever?

* this isn’t necessarily a response to the post I quoted

The thing that always goes unnoticed is the year Rodgers won, they had an elite defense. 2nd in points allowed, 5th in yards.

They haven't had a defense rank near the top 5 in either of those categories since. That was 10 years ago.

Also, anybody who put Nnadi in the same category as draft busts or overpaid JAG’s is a ****ing moron point blank period.

mcaj22 is easily one of the worst posters on this board and a miserable ****.

You'd know what you're buying though. With the cap savings you could sign proven veterans in free agency to shorter deals say a Chris Harris Jr. and AJ Green.

If you snag a 1st and a 2nd/3rd for Jones you then have ridiculous draft capital to fill out the rest of your needs (DT, CB, LB, RB, IOL). Veach with 5 picks in the top 100 in this draft...damn!

Look, I'm gonna get lambasted for being that Frank Clark hating guy again, but if people actually believe Frank Clark is a more valuable player than Chris Jones, they're butt****ing morons.

Also, I think tales of Chris Jones and his lack of discipline in run defense are exaggerated. He's not the best guy at it, but he's becoming a much more balanced player. JakeF calling him "one-dimensional" in that regard is pretty freaking stupid.

And I’m smart and reasonable enough to know that this isn’t an insult to Clark.

Chris Jones is really really ****ing good and Chiefs fans STILL don’t seem to get it. It’s embarrassing.

Chris is just entering his prime and has only had 1 year with premier coaching. He’s also surrounded with talent along that DL. There are many reasons to believe he will continue to ascend in this situation and he’s already an all pro quality player at a position of huge importance when talents like him are nearly as rare as elite QBs.

Chris Jones effects EVERY SINGLE PASS PLAY.

Whether it be him getting his long arms up to block passing lanes...

Flushing QBs out of the pocket.

Causing fumbles

Forcing rushed throws

Forcing a double team

Stalemating a run

Dude is a ****ing unicorn.

Bingo. I think didn't think it was that difficult to understand.

Too many people on CP are looking so intent on looking for a fight that they don't want to understand what is said because then they can't bitch.

Mathieu
Clark
Jones

When Clark is healthy he is the better all-around player on defense.

More balanced? Sure. Better? Get the **** out.

I really hope we keep him.

Two things...Chiefs SB window is NOW not 2 in years. There is a time to be financially prudent...and that isn't this off-season. The Patriots are finally dead. Get it while you can...there isn't a lot of great QBs in the AFC right now. They are going to have to draft well regardless of Jones for sustained success..

In a few years...even marginal players are going to be asking for stupid money. Teams are going to be able to keep their good players so FA will dry up. It sounds like a lot of money...but it wont be soon.

I realize Jones doesn't have cool name like "Honey Badger"...but he's their best defensive player.

Veach can push Mahomes money into the future...

If he's going, then he needs to be replaced by another excellent inside pass rusher, and I dont see many around. Spags' pass rush is all about inside penetration and the ends setting an edge (and eventually finishing the job). Which happens to be also quite effective against the runs.
Reason why most folks here complained about Frank Clark - and why we let Dee Ford go in the first place.
Veach will do all he can (and more) to keep him.

Pay Jones.

This is an understatement I'm not even worried. Veach knows what he is doing and really can just make a case you want to win Championships come or stay in Kansas City if not go away.


Mahomes is going get a deal done that is a fact so little to worry about players will want to play here. I think Chris Jones wants to stay and we need him to anchor this defense so he will get something fair from Veach and so will Frank Clark and the Honey Badger I think we got them next few years anyways. No worries.

We got this all.

IVIT

I think if they can sign him to what Frank Clark got, that would be a huge bargain and they should do it immediately after the CBA is signed. Either that or a 3 year deal similar to how Veach structured Landlord and Watkins deals. Something like 3/60 with 40 guaranteed. That allows Chris to hit FA again while still in his prime once the CBA explodes.

I disagree with this. With how young Mahomes and most of our players are we have a huge window to win championships.

If wanting to sign Chris Jones is considered being miserable around these parts, then sign me up.

I am glad you are so invested in my post history. I apologise I didnt celebrate the Chiefs Super Bowl victory with you. I am sure you are real fun at parties. I am bummed I missed out.

No it’s not about wanting to sign Chris Jones. I totally agree with that.

I’m talking about shitting on guys like Sorenson, Nnadi, Watkins etc. without even acknowledging we won it all and they were key players in that run/win.

You were bitching about Reid when the Chiefs were down 24-0 calling for him to be fired then came back after an incredible run all the way to the SB as if nothing changed since that post. You just went right back to bitching about overpaid bums like you used to. It’s ****ing weird.

I don't know why this set you off so much. There are people in here that are arguing Clark and Mathieu is better Jones. To offer perspective I then grabbed a bunch of role players that Jones is better than. Really the Jones in Door #1 vs Breeland Speaks in door #2. Why are you bothered by that? Even if I am wrong who cares. The team has Mahomes now. Not Cassel, not Alex Smith. The days of arguing about the Stanford Routts and Jeremy Maclins are over. Mahomes will carry this team no matter what.

I have been wrong a lot it shouldnt bother you that much. Its fun to theory craft roster construction and cap space in the off season. Isnt that why certain people make those Late Night Bullshit Threads? Why is it negative if I think a guy sucks? Do you read the gameday threads on here? People turn on players every play.

Whether we keep or trade Jones, one thing is certain.

We are winning the 2021 Superbowl.

IF that's true, then you trade him.


IF.

I gotta confess that I have flip flopped on tag/trade vs just paying him now. Hell, I still go back and forth some, but for the most part, I think you pay him.

IMHO, The real issue is anticipating the CBA and subsequent salary cap. $20mm may be a bargain after they come to an agreement.

I too will trust Veach. He’s earned that.

I'd like to keep him, but if there is a bounty to be had in exchange for him, then I would be ok with seeing him go too.

IVIT

That’s why no one is signing until the CBA is done.

Good ****ing grief, people act like the chiefs are the only ones whose salary cap is going up. Every single other free agent will demand more, because there is more. The salary cap increasing only means something to players on EXISTING contracts.

Paying Jones is a mistake. It a a mistake they might make, but it’s a mistake. You trade him and move on. Defenses are simply not about one player. They are about a whole unit, and this whole unit needs upgrades. Trading Jones gives you not only the cap space but also the draft picks to do so.

It’s the only logical choice, assuming the value on the trade is in any way fair compensation.

Coincidentally I agree. That's why I want to trade him as long as we get at least a 1 and a 3.

Then why would you name this thread that very thing?

Guys let’s just trust Veach. Everyone here should’ve gained his trust after he literally revamped this defense in a span of one offseason and made us super bowl winners. Trust Veach!! Whatever move he makes we need to support him. He will be our GM for the next 20-30 years so get used to it

"gained his trust"? Were you born this silly, or do you have to work on it?

Defenses as well as offenses are not about one player, 100% agree.
But some players are more difficult to replace than others.
The defense needs upgrade, and so does the offense (running backs and the OL to some extent), but losing key players in the process is not the way to build a dynasty. If Veach is confident in the draft picks he may let Jones go, otherwise I'm sure he'll stay and get paid a fair amount of money.

Veach has said repeatedly that he wants to keep Jones, and I believe he’s going to try to do exactly that. I’m very curious to see just how he tries to make that happen.

As for the hypothetical case of trading Jones, I’m not sold on the idea. You don’t give away a great known quantity for a possibly might be almost as good unknown quantity. It’s stupid.

I don’t think anyone said that the Chiefs are the only team whose salary cap is going up. The point is that this salary cap increase may be a good opportunity to extend both Mahomes and Jones while mitigating the risk of not being able to afford other players to fill the roster.

I know most people believe the franchise tag was placed on Jones temporarily to give the Chiefs some breathing room to get a deal or trade done, but how does the cap look if he were to play on the tag? Is that even a possibility? Obviously it wouldn't be great from a relationship standpoint given how Jones spoke out against it as soon as he was tagged.

Jones hasn’t been tagged yet.

The team has said they intend to tag him, but the step of actually doing so hasn’t happened yet.

Someone correct me if I’m wrong here, but we need to make a decision on Sammy by next Wednesday right?

Pretty sure we can’t be over the cap on the day of the new league year and Chris Jones tag puts us over while Sammy is the best option to cover that $15 or so million.

Gotcha. Saw this from an article on Forbes:

If a player plays multiple positions, can you base the franchise tag value on the position they played the most using the previous year's snaps? Does it have to be one of the two amounts or if a player played 60% DT and 40% DE, could you set it to $15.977 million (60% of the DT tag and 40% of the DE tag)? In other words, does the team have any leeway on the amount or is it specifically set by the NFL?

Trade Houston are you nuts? Trade Berry are you nuts? How did making them the highest paid at their position work out for everyone not named Houston or Berry? Not very good.

How can you compare a player at the end of his career, and another one who's been "day by day and no play" for the past few years, to a healthy beast in his prime such as Jones

PAY HIM

I thought that is what we were discussing here too.

Right now this is the benchmark. I just don't see how we can go there.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/chicago-...il-mack-14414/

Because at the time they were given their money, Houston was a 20+ sack linebacker, and Berry was the beast who beat cancer, was hugely responsible for winning 2 games for the Chiefs on his huge plays that season, (Panthers, Falcons) and was comeback player of the year.

Jesus Christ, how ****ing obtuse can you be?

Jones hasn’t officially had the tag put on him yet. Veach is trying his moves behind closed doors. Dude is gonna get no sleep this week

7/154m

I’d give Chris that deal right now.

First 2 years are super cheap and after that the cap skyrockets anyway

It’s not that.

It’s the 30% rule that’s holding up every contract negotiation league wide.

A new deal can’t have a salary that jumps more than 30% year to year going into the last year of the current CBA.

If there’s no new CBA, the Chris Jones deal is going to be very difficult to get done.

I don't know BC. I'm not saying you are wrong. But right now, IMO, we only have one guy that we have to keep regardless of the cost. The QB. Everyone else is replaceable. Again, this is IMO.

If you are referring to a trade you should know that we cannot trade Jones until after we have put the tag on him and he has signed as well.

Sorry, but we already know this is not the case. Without enough weapons, Pat and Andy have a harder time scoring with any consistency. See the 2019 Colts game and the 2019 Texans game. Or even the second 2018 Chargers game.

So Tyreek, Kelce, and someone very similar to Sammy Watkins are not replaceable. Take away two of these guys and the offense stalls more often than not.

And without a defense we also have trouble winning big games against quality teams. Just go back and look at last year's games against both the Pats and the Rams. Scored 91 points between those two games, because most or all of our offense was available, but the defense didn't show up at all.

So saying that all we need to have is Pat is a gross oversimplification. Hell, all you have to do is go back and look at Aaron Rodgers and the Packers since 2013 or so. Only won their division 3 times until this season. Lost in the playoffs four consecutive seasons, and didn't even make the playoffs 2017-2018. Why? A lack of offensive weapons, including the fact that they used a WR as their RB1 for a season and a half, so basically no real running game. And then lump in the fact that they gutted their defense, and there you go. Even with a prime Rodgers they struggled to win their division, and never made it back to the SB.

That is not a route we want to take with Patrick. We need at least three quality offensive weapons on the field, and we need a decent defense that can get Pat the ball when we need it, period.

Not waying we have to keep Jones, though I believe that getting back to the SB is a lot easiwer with him than without him. But we have to have a quality defense, otherwise we open the door to quality teams that can score and play defense.

There are other good to great players out there. Every single year. You don't have to fill the other spots with JAG's. Once in a lifetime QB's however, you keep those guys.