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-   -   Chiefs Trade whatever possible for a LT prospect (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=357091)

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 17967605)
People gotta remember Jerrick McKinnon that year. 9 receiving TD’s. 2nd to Kelce. He was so good.

We haven’t had any explosive plays at RB since he got old last year.
Yeah and JuJu was a better #1 than Kadarius Toney, Sky Moore, or Justin Watson.

Rice didn't ascend to #1 usage until after week 13 in 2023.

Mecca 02-13-2025 12:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967607)
LMAO Blaming Veach when we now know what absolute ****ing idiots Brown and his agent both were is a choice.
It's kind of a failure of the process, how do you make that trade and not realize him and his agent have those demands?

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967612)
Bullshit. Veach offered him far more than any other team was willing to and Brown and his agent were too ****ing stupid to know it.
When you gave up what we did in trade for a player that player has the leverage.


Of course I think OBJ got too greedy but here's the thing.


Our left tackle position has been a revolving door of suck since OBJ Jr left.


He was better than anyone they have played since.

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:19 PM
Veach offered 6 for 134 that was essentially 5 for 100. OBJ signed a 4 for 64. A generational bag fumble.

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967620)
When you gave up what we did in trade for a player that player has the leverage.


Of course I think OBJ got too greedy but here's the thing.


Our left tackle position has been a revolving door of suck since OBJ Jr left.


He was better than anyone they have played since.
That's a laughably low standard. OBJ isn't a good LT, barely servicable. He got Mahomes hurt in 2022, got Burrow hurt in 2023, and missed almost half the year in 2024.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967625)
That's a laughably low standard. OBJ isn't a good LT, barely servicable. He got Mahomes hurt in 2022, got Burrow hurt in 2023, and missed almost half the year in 2024.
I liked the part where our OL gave up zero sacks to a stacked Eagles defense in a Super Bowl and put up 38 points.

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:26 PM
Sure, if we can play on a field that completely neutralizes any pass rush threat all the time throw out any scrub muffin we can find.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967636)
Sure, if we can play on a field that completely neutralizes any pass rush threat all the time throw out any scrub muffin we can find.
That was the Eagles fans excuse. Surprised you 100% accepted it.

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967641)
That was the Eagles fans excuse. Surprised you 100% accepted it.
LMAO Toma himself acknowledged how ****ing terrible it was and went into a deep dive as to exactly why.

FloridaMan88 02-13-2025 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967633)
I liked the part where our OL gave up zero sacks to a stacked Eagles defense in a Super Bowl and put up 38 points.
Also have to acknowledge that Andrew Wylie was part of that offensive line.

A not great, but serviceable and low cost RT… who Veach decided to “upgrade” from with Jawaan Taylor and his $20 million AAV.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967644)
LMAO Toma himself acknowledged how ****ing terrible it was and went into a deep dive as to exactly why.
Both teams had to play on the same field.


That's football. Boo hoo, poor Eagles had to play on grass.


LMAO

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967657)
Both teams had to play on the same field.


That's football. Boo hoo, poor Eagles had to play on grass.


LMAO
Uhh. Right. Both offenses had an incredible advantage playing on a field that shoddy.

Mecca 02-13-2025 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaMan88 (Post 17967645)
Also have to acknowledge that Andrew Wylie was part of that offensive line.

A not great, but serviceable and low cost RT… who Veach decided to “upgrade” from with Jawaan Taylor and his $20 million AAV.
They gave Browns money to Taylor, Wylie wasn't going to be low cost anymore and they felt they could get more athletic.

For the most part Taylor is the player he's always been.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 12:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967666)
Uhh. Right. Both offenses had an incredible advantage playing on a field that shoddy.
The thought was we would easily replace Orlando Brown Jr.


That hasn't happened yet.

Sassy Squatch 02-13-2025 12:47 PM
Really haven't put their best foot forward on it. Donovan Smith was a pivot that worked out and Suamataia/Morris both unfortunately flopped.

RunKC 02-13-2025 01:23 PM
PFF has Cam Robinson projected for $18.75M/yr over 3 years.

Yeah I’d do that. Backload it to the 3rd year with a clean way out and we good

DJ's left nut 02-13-2025 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 17967667)
They gave Browns money to Taylor, Wylie wasn't going to be low cost anymore and they felt they could get more athletic.

For the most part Taylor is the player he's always been.
Yup.

I'm disappointed in the Taylor deal because I thought he'd A) transition to LT and B) continue to to progress given where he was in his career and the fairly poor organization he'd been in for the years prior.

He just didn't get better. He's the same guy he's always been.

Which does NOT make him a bad player. At all. It means he's been a little overpaid (or at least will have been by the time next year's deal is over) and didn't fit the needs of the team as well as I hoped he would.

It's been a B-/C+ deal. There are worse teams signed by NFL teams every season. There are guys who simply don't make the field and the team falls apart around them.

I mean you compare it to, say, the Omenihu deal that nobody really complains about. He got $16 million and didn't really contribute to the 2023 championship run after getting hurt in the playoffs. He wasn't as impactful this year as he was at his best last year and we didn't go as far with him in the lineup than we did without him in the lineup last season.

At $16 million for 8 sacks over 17 games that deal ended up being....eh. B-/C+.

DRM08 02-13-2025 02:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967569)
Suamataia
Morris
Suamataia
Morris
Thuney
Humphries
Thuney

There's 17 games in a ****ing season and he had a 4 man rotation playing musical chairs all year. Just saying he needed to suck it up is a bit lame IMO.
5 different people at Left Tackle in 5 Super Bowl appearances. You would think this occurred over a 15-20 year period. NOPE. It was just a 6 year period. This isn't sustainable. Josh Allen has had the same dude at Left Tackle for 99% of the games over the last 7 years.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 02:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRM08 (Post 17967804)
5 different people at Left Tackle in 5 Super Bowl appearances. You would think this occurred over a 15-20 year period. NOPE. It was just a 6 year period. This isn't sustainable. Josh Allen has had the same dude at Left Tackle for 99% of the games over the last 7 years.
The GM prior to Beane had a hell of a draft in 2017.

Grabbed the Left Tackle Dion Dawkins with a 3rd round pick a year before they drafted Josh.


We haven't hit on any of the tackles we drafted in the last 7 years.

O.city 02-13-2025 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17967756)
Yup.

I'm disappointed in the Taylor deal because I thought he'd A) transition to LT and B) continue to to progress given where he was in his career and the fairly poor organization he'd been in for the years prior.

He just didn't get better. He's the same guy he's always been.

Which does NOT make him a bad player. At all. It means he's been a little overpaid (or at least will have been by the time next year's deal is over) and didn't fit the needs of the team as well as I hoped he would.

It's been a B-/C+ deal. There are worse teams signed by NFL teams every season. There are guys who simply don't make the field and the team falls apart around them.

I mean you compare it to, say, the Omenihu deal that nobody really complains about. He got $16 million and didn't really contribute to the 2023 championship run after getting hurt in the playoffs. He wasn't as impactful this year as he was at his best last year and we didn't go as far with him in the lineup than we did without him in the lineup last season.

At $16 million for 8 sacks over 17 games that deal ended up being....eh. B-/C+.
Browsing around some stuff today...I just don't see how Chase Young isn't your ideal guy to drop into this defense. They don't like speed guys, he's not just a speed guy. They don't like older players, he's 26.

Just makes too much sense to me.

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 17967581)
They still have Chris Jones for a couple more years, Trent, Karlaftis and will likely keep Bolton.

Nobody is saying not to put resources into the defense. They need use this draft for the offense like what the used the 2022 draft for the defense
You started a thread entitled "trade whatever possible for a LT prospect".

Are you saying you're not saying that anymore?

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 17967601)
Pretty sure our 1st, 3rd, and 2026 1st could get us to around 15. I know you'll say that picking players around 15 isn't really any different than players taken late in the 1st, but just hear me out. I have no clue who they like yet or what their grades will be on specific players, but let's say they like Conerly and/or Ersery and see them as a long term solution but that they will also need some development time this season. You wouldn't do that? That's not "more than we gave up to get Mahomes".

I think this claim that draft picks taken at OT outside of the top 10 are no different than those taken late 1st or the 2nd is disengenuous. You probably could make the claim that WRs taken late 1st are not much better than those taken in the 2nd/3rd round, but that didn't stop KC from trading up for someone like Worthy. KC clearly liked Worthy and they went and got him, end of story. Will he end up being significantly better or even better at all than McConkey? Maybe not, but they found their guy and made the move. Why would they not take that same stance at LT if they identify a specific player that is the most likely to succeed here and provide a solution for our line problems?

Doing a bit of analysis where starting left tackles come from, yes they absolutely generally come from the top 10 for the most part. You have a handful of decent looking tackles that have been taken outside of the top 10 like Tristan Wirfs, Kolton Miller, Garrett Bolles, Taylor Decker, and Christian Darrisaw. I'm guessing Mims in Cincy may eventually join that list. DJ Humphries was a good left tackle for a while (when healthy), he was taken 24th.

Starting left tackles taken outside the 1st include Dawkins, Mailata, Armstead, Raimann, Walker, Coleman, and Little.

So outside of taking a left tackle top 10 where they are the most likely to be a sure thing, the highest concentration of starting left tackles in a particular part of the draft is those taken from around the 13-25 range of rd 1. Then you have a handful of decent or promising left tackles taken in the 2nd/3rd or the 7th. There don't really appear to be much in the way of left tackles taken currently in the 4-6 rd range.

So again, I would argue that a tackle taken in the 13-25 range of the 1st rd absolutely does have a higher chance of developing than someone in the 2nd-3rd rd.
And it still doesn't address the position in 2025, which is the entire premise of this thread.

ThyKingdomCome15 02-13-2025 02:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967633)
I liked the part where our OL gave up zero sacks to a stacked Eagles defense in a Super Bowl and put up 38 points.
The field conditions had something to do with that. Players on both sides were on skates. Had these games been switched it would have made more sense.

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 17967742)
PFF has Cam Robinson projected for $18.75M/yr over 3 years.

Yeah I’d do that. Backload it to the 3rd year with a clean way out and we good
If he signs for that great. I will bet he doesn't.

OKchiefs 02-13-2025 02:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17967835)
The GM prior to Beane had a hell of a draft in 2017.

Grabbed the Left Tackle Dion Dawkins with a 3rd round pick a year before they drafted Josh.


We haven't hit on any of the tackles we drafted in the last 7 years.
Last 7 years? Try 11 years.

I know this isn’t the primary point of this thread, but the fact that Andy Heck doesn’t get more criticism and somehow isn’t in the hot seat is really surprising to me. I understand LT is hard to find. How about a RT? Shouldn’t be nearly that hard to find a single damn tackle of any kind. I’m sure the blame is shared between the scouting department and coaching but regardless of who is the primary culprit that is simply inexcusable.

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 17967860)
Last 7 years? Try 11 years.

I know this isn’t the primary point of this thread, but the fact that Andy Heck doesn’t get more criticism and somehow isn’t in the hot seat is really surprising to me. I understand LT is hard to find. How about a RT? Shouldn’t be nearly that hard to find a single damn tackle of any kind. I’m sure the blame is shared between the scouting department and coaching but regardless of who is the primary culprit that is simply inexcusable.
The offensive coaching staff needs an overhaul. It won't happen but it needs to.

OKchiefs 02-13-2025 02:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 17967851)
And it still doesn't address the position in 2025, which is the entire premise of this thread.
It’s more palatable IMO to deal with subpar play if you at least have some hope on the horizon. As i’ve stated before, sign Humphries or Jedrick Wills and add someone like Conerly/Ersery. You’re set for 2025 and have competition and multiple options to ideally have answers at potentially both LT and RT in 2026 and beyond.

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 17967870)
It’s more palatable IMO to deal with subpar play if you at least have some hope on the horizon. As i’ve stated before, sign Humphries or Jedrick Wills and add someone like Conerly/Ersery. You’re set for 2025 and have competition and multiple options to ideally have answers at potentially both LT and RT in 2026 and beyond.
I like Conerly. He's a little undersized but performed very well in a tough conference. I also think he's a guy that you could potentially get without trading a whole bunch.

Personally, I'm with you. Sign a cheap vet and draft a guy, maybe 2. Let them all compete, along with Kingsley, for a job. See what shakes out.

I'm just not keen on shelling out major resources for mediocrity, or worse.

staylor26 02-13-2025 02:55 PM
7 years? 11 years? The Chiefs didn't even have a need at OT until after the Bucs SB. They had both OTs fall apart in the same season, and at ages where you aren't necessarily expecting it. Eric Fisher was in the same ****ing draft class as Lane Johnson.

The OT discourse is so reminiscent of the WR discourse.

New World Order 02-13-2025 02:57 PM
How old is Willie Roaf

htismaqe 02-13-2025 02:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by staylor26 (Post 17967879)
7 years? 11 yesrs? The Chiefs didn't even have a need at OT until after the Bucs SB. They had both OTs fall apart in the same season, and at ages where you aren't necessarily expecting it. Eric Fisher was in the same ****ing draft class as Lane Johnson.

The OT discourse is so reminiscent of the WR discourse.
Or reminiscent of the OT discourse we've had pretty much every year since Fisher and Schwartz went down.

Nothing being said right now is any different than 2 years ago or 4 years ago. We are still looking and we are still drafting in the 30's every year

DRM08 02-13-2025 02:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by staylor26 (Post 17967879)
7 years? 11 years? The Chiefs didn't even have a need at OT until after the Bucs SB. They had both OTs fall apart in the same season, and at ages where you aren't necessarily expecting it. Eric Fisher was in the same ****ing draft class as Lane Johnson.

The OT discourse is so reminiscent of the WR discourse.
Bad luck for Kansas City at this LT spot, that's for sure.

staylor26 02-13-2025 03:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 17967886)
Or reminiscent of the OT discourse we've had pretty much every year since Fisher and Schwartz went down.

Nothing being said right now is any different than 2 years ago or 4 years ago. We are still looking and we are still drafting in the 30's every year
Yes, but you would think there's been a lot of investment through the draft when people are complaining about development when there just hasn't. Before last year, they hadn't spent more than a late 3rd. When you take a T that late, you might be hoping for a starter, but that's swing T territory.

Kingsley is the only significant investment, everybody knew he needed development, and it's been just 1 year.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 03:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThyKingdomCome15 (Post 17967856)
The field conditions had something to do with that. Players on both sides were on skates. Had these games been switched it would have made more sense.

Doesn't change the fact that the OL with Orlando Brown Jr at LT was the #1 offense in 2022 in Points Per Play.

This year we were 14th. Barely ahead of Indy who had a raw QB struggling to find himself.

FloridaMan88 02-13-2025 03:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRM08 (Post 17967889)
Bad luck for Kansas City at this LT spot, that's for sure.
Eric Fisher could still be their left tackle without the cascade of injuries that started with him in the AFC Championship Game vs Buffalo.

RunKC 02-13-2025 03:17 PM
Orlando Brown Jr was garbage. He would have gotten his ass kicked too. He wasn’t good

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">2022 pressure rate allowed (regular + postseason):<br><br>Orlando Brown Jr. - 6.49%<br>Andrew Wylie - 6.24%</p>&mdash; Zack Eisen (@zackeisen21) <a href="https://twitter.com/zackeisen21/status/1632902632896610304?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 7, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 17967914)
Orlando Brown Jr was garbage. He would have gotten his ass kicked too. He wasn’t good

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">2022 pressure rate allowed (regular + postseason):<br><br>Orlando Brown Jr. - 6.49%<br>Andrew Wylie - 6.24%</p>&mdash; Zack Eisen (@zackeisen21) <a href="https://twitter.com/zackeisen21/status/1632902632896610304?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 7, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
If he was garbage then the Left Tackles after him have been worse than garbage.

staylor26 02-13-2025 03:20 PM
Eh as bad as Brown was, I don't think he would've been bull rushed over and over again like Thuney with success, and Josh Sweat just isn't a dynamic pass rusher.

FloridaMan88 02-13-2025 03:22 PM
OBJ isn’t Willie Roaf… but he’s better than the shit the Chiefs have tried to replace him with.

DRM08 02-13-2025 03:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaMan88 (Post 17967913)
Eric Fisher could still be their left tackle without the cascade of injuries that started with him in the AFC Championship Game vs Buffalo.
Yep, sad thing is he’s not that old. They tried to replace Fisher with Trent Williams, who is about 2.5 years older than Fisher. Horrible luck to have Fisher go down like this at a reasonably young age.

BossChief 02-13-2025 03:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch (Post 17967622)
Veach offered 6 for 134 that was essentially 5 for 100. OBJ signed a 4 for 64. A generational bag fumble.
That was reported, but I highly doubt the report was valid. Unless it only hard the first year or 2 guaranteed.

RunKC 02-13-2025 03:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by staylor26 (Post 17967919)
Eh as bad as Brown was, I don't think he would've been bull rushed over and over again like Thuney with success, and Josh Sweat just isn't a dynamic pass rusher.
That’s just how they attacked Thuney and Jawaan.

If OBJ was the LT Nolan Smith would have beat him with speed

DJ's left nut 02-13-2025 03:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 17967956)
That’s just how they attacked Thuney and Jawaan.

If OBJ was the LT Nolan Smith would have beat him with speed
With the energy level and execution we saw in that game, I think Munoz and Roaf as bookkends would've gotten their asses kicked.

It was just such a wholesale implosion that I just don't think anything mattered. The further away from it I get, the MORE confused I am by it.

I mean it's like the whole team just went out the night before and got ripped. I just don't get it. At all.

Titty Meat 02-13-2025 04:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17967959)
With the energy level and execution we saw in that game, I think Munoz and Roaf as bookkends would've gotten their asses kicked.

It was just such a wholesale implosion that I just don't think anything mattered. The further away from it I get, the MORE confused I am by it.

I mean it's like the whole team just went out the night before and got ripped. I just don't get it. At all.
Kelce eluded to the grind of playing in the super bowl every year and the wear out it had in the building this year

FloridaMan88 02-13-2025 04:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Titty Meat (Post 17967966)
Kelce eluded to the grind of playing in the super bowl every year and the wear out it had in the building this year
You would think though being in the Super Bowl, at the finish line of the grind, they’d have the adrenaline to push them over the top.

staylor26 02-13-2025 04:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaMan88 (Post 17967969)
You would think though being in the Super Bowl, at the finish line of the grind, they’d have the adrenaline to push them over the top.
Especially with a bye week.

ydub 02-13-2025 04:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17967959)
With the energy level and execution we saw in that game, I think Munoz and Roaf as bookkends would've gotten their asses kicked.

It was just such a wholesale implosion that I just don't think anything mattered. The further away from it I get, the MORE confused I am by it.

I mean it's like the whole team just went out the night before and got ripped. I just don't get it. At all.
It's inexplicable. The wholesale collapse of the offensive unit is beyond understanding.

Thought experiment: How many players would one need to fix a game in this fashion?

Megatron96 02-13-2025 04:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ydub (Post 17967985)
It's inexplicable. The wholesale collapse of the offensive unit is beyond understanding.

Thought experiment: How many players would one need to fix a game in this fashion?


Offs.

Just stop.

TEX 02-13-2025 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 17967959)
With the energy level and execution we saw in that game, I think Munoz and Roaf as bookkends would've gotten their asses kicked.

It was just such a wholesale implosion that I just don't think anything mattered. The further away from it I get, the MORE confused I am by it.

I mean it's like the whole team just went out the night before and got ripped. I just don't get it. At all.
Nah, dont over think this. We could see the signs all year that the offense had issues. The teams that had a good DL gave us fits. Its why shit teams like Vegas, Denver, Carolina gave us such a hard time. JJ Watt was spot on when he said that KC could get by teams when one phase of the DL was good. But he said Philly not only had good DE play, their DT's are also exceptional. It was the perfect storm of major strength against our major weakness. All they had to do was rush 4 and they could get to Mahomes. And things got out of hand quickly, like they did against Tampa Bay.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEX (Post 17968188)
Nah, we could see the signs all year that the offense had issues. The teams that had a good DL gave us fits. Its why shit teams like Vegas, Denver, Carolina gave us such a hard time. JJ Watt was spot on when he said that KC could get by teams when one phase of the DL was good. But he said Philly not only had good DE play, their DT's are also exceptional. It was major strength against our major weakness.
And Thuney had been holding up because elite pass rushers were still trying to run around him and his short little arms.

Once the Eagles figured out, nope, just bulldoze him, the last Jenga block holding our OL fell and the whole structure collapsed.

TEX 02-13-2025 07:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17968189)
And Thuney had been holding up because elite pass rushers were still trying to run around him and his short little arms.

Once the Eagles figured out, nope, just bulldoze him, the last Jenga block holding our OL fell and the whole structure collapsed.
Yes sir. Fangio had 2 weeks. The left side gave way almost instantly whether it was Thuney or Calliendo, who is not a starting caliber NFL Guard to begin with.

MahomesMagic 02-13-2025 07:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEX (Post 17968195)
Yes sir. Fangio had 2 weeks. The left side gave way almost instantly whether it was Thuney or Calliendo, who is not a starting caliber NFL Guard to begin with.
I'm still shocked Reid didn't switch it up after a series or two.

As soon as you see Thuney getting pushed back into Mahomes that fast you need to act.


Was Humphries really that bad?

TEX 02-13-2025 07:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MahomesMagic (Post 17968197)
I'm still shocked Reid didn't switch it up after a series or two.

As soon as you see Thuney getting pushed back into Mahomes that fast you need to act.


Was Humphries really that bad?
I thought the same thing. At least I thought we could have a situation where if moved Thuney inside, and we have our interior three, which is our strength against theirs, and at least we would have had a fighting chance...:shrug: But to answer your question, Humphries must have been THAT bad. I mean he had been taking half the reps at LT at practice, so Reid & Co. must not have liked what they saw.

FloridaMan88 02-13-2025 07:32 PM
Andy Heck seemingly unaware that the reason Thuney had to be moved to LT was due to his failure to develop Kingsley or Wanya?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GjspKfVW...pg&name=medium

O.city 02-13-2025 07:43 PM
Everything I’ve read points to Ronnie Stanley hitting the market

Just get that done

TheGuardian 02-13-2025 07:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17968211)
Everything I’ve read points to Ronnie Stanley hitting the market

Just get that done
There's actually a few really good options in FA if we can just land one.

The draft is a no go. We need a SURE FIRE OPTION. Not another prospect. Or potential.

Mr_Tomahawk 02-13-2025 07:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 17968213)
There's actually a few really good options in FA if we can just land one.

The draft is a no go. We need a SURE FIRE OPTION. Not another prospect. Or potential.

Go on….

List these really good options, please.

Chris Meck 02-13-2025 08:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17968211)
Everything I’ve read points to Ronnie Stanley hitting the market

Just get that done
Where are you reading this? This would be extremely surprising.

Chris Meck 02-13-2025 08:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Tomahawk (Post 17968217)
Go on….

List these really good options, please.
Really, there's just Stanley, who I'll be shocked if he doesn't stay put- and Jackson, who is likely to be available because he is plan B in LA and they won't pay both.

And that's about it.

O.city 02-13-2025 08:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 17968225)
Where are you reading this? This would be extremely surprising.
Read a few articles today, they don’t have the cap for it right now unless they restructure some guys

Few guys in Baltimore said they’d heard he was gonna hit the market

ChiefsHawk 02-13-2025 08:28 PM
You go after Jackson as he'll only get better. If I remember correctly he didn't start playing football until his sophomore or junior year in high school.

DRM08 02-13-2025 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17968232)
Read a few articles today, they don’t have the cap for it right now unless they restructure some guys

Few guys in Baltimore said they’d heard he was gonna hit the market
Baltimore could play the Void Year game like Philadelphia and easily keep Stanley. If they let him walk, it’s because of the injury history. They don’t want him missing a ton of games on a big money deal, which already happened in recent years.

RealSNR 02-13-2025 08:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaMan88 (Post 17968201)
Andy Heck seemingly unaware that the reason Thuney had to be moved to LT was due to his failure to develop Kingsley or Wanya?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GjspKfVW...pg&name=medium
You can blame Heck for a lot of things, but Kingsley/Wanya this year isn't one of them.

Wanya's just not very good, man. He was good not great in college, and in the pros he's not good. He doesn't have a tackle's frame at all. Looks really small compared to other LTs. He's got a low ceiling, and I don't think his floor was ever high enough to give serious consideration to his possibility of being a franchise tackle for a team one day. Dude got arrested for weed possession in the offseason, and while that's a stupid law that he broke, how the **** do you get arrested for that sort of thing? You kind of have to be an idiot to get caught with that shit.

And Kingsley's got the frame, but he's so damn young and raw. I don't know who the greatest OL coach of all time is, but if he were on staff and were assigned the task of coaching Kingsley, even that coach would need more time than we gave Kingsley given where he started. And yeah, I was in favor of starting him in the offseason, but I figured we'd be a little smarter about bringing him along than we actually were. I really doubt that was Andy Heck's idea to leave him out on an island like that, and even if it were, he doesn't have the power within the organization to make that kind of decision-- that one is entirely on Nagy and Reid.

I'm still excited and dare I say even optimistic about what Kingsley can do. Wanya not so much. In both cases, though, their failures this season aren't the fault of Heck.

TRR 02-13-2025 09:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 17968213)
There's actually a few really good options in FA if we can just land one.

The draft is a no go. We need a SURE FIRE OPTION. Not another prospect. Or potential.
We don’t need a sure fire option. We need a consistently good enough option. Not a star, or an all pro, or a pro bowl level LT. Fisher wasn’t great. Brown Jr. wasn’t great. Donovan Smith wasn’t great. They were all consistently good enough. And our Offense was good enough for a Super Bowl.

Stanley, Robinson, Jackson all fit that bill. It just depends on if KC wants younger, higher ceiling, less injury risk, veteran presence, etc.

TheGuardian 02-13-2025 09:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRR (Post 17968276)
We don’t need a sure fire option. We need a consistently good enough option. Not a star, or an all pro, or a pro bowl level LT. Fisher wasn’t great. Brown Jr. wasn’t great. Donovan Smith wasn’t great. They were all consistently good enough. And our Offense was good enough for a Super Bowl.

Stanley, Robinson, Jackson all fit that bill. It just depends on if KC wants younger, higher ceiling, less injury risk, veteran presence, etc.
That is what I mean by "sure fire". SOLID. Dependable.

We ain't gonna get a Roaf in this FA but we can get a GOOD LT.

TEX 02-13-2025 09:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 17968254)
You can blame Heck for a lot of things, but Kingsley/Wanya this year isn't one of them.

Wanya's just not very good, man. He was good not great in college, and in the pros he's not good. He doesn't have a tackle's frame at all. Looks really small compared to other LTs. He's got a low ceiling, and I don't think his floor was ever high enough to give serious consideration to his possibility of being a franchise tackle for a team one day. Dude got arrested for weed possession in the offseason, and while that's a stupid law that he broke, how the **** do you get arrested for that sort of thing? You kind of have to be an idiot to get caught with that shit.

And Kingsley's got the frame, but he's so damn young and raw. I don't know who the greatest OL coach of all time is, but if he were on staff and were assigned the task of coaching Kingsley, even that coach would need more time than we gave Kingsley given where he started. And yeah, I was in favor of starting him in the offseason, but I figured we'd be a little smarter about bringing him along than we actually were. I really doubt that was Andy Heck's idea to leave him out on an island like that, and even if it were, he doesn't have the power within the organization to make that kind of decision-- that one is entirely on Nagy and Reid.

I'm still excited and dare I say even optimistic about what Kingsley can do. Wanya not so much. In both cases, though, their failures this season aren't the fault of Heck.
Dont die on the Kingsley hill. All he's shown he can do is jump out of a swimming pool in a bathing suit. He's shown a lot of what he can't do on the football field though. And because of how he was handled this past season, it may be that much harder for him to do stuff on the football field, especially LT. But you're right, he is very young so he'll be given time.

Chris Meck 02-13-2025 09:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by O.city (Post 17968232)
Read a few articles today, they don’t have the cap for it right now unless they restructure some guys

Few guys in Baltimore said they’d heard he was gonna hit the market
If they did that, they'd be in our shoes. No left tackle and drafting too low to get one.

I don't see them doing it. It would be really stupid, and that front office isn't stupid.

OKchiefs 02-13-2025 09:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 17968288)
If they did that, they'd be in our shoes. No left tackle and drafting too low to get one.

I don't see them doing it. It would be really stupid, and that front office isn't stupid.
I wonder if Rosengarten can play LT? He started 16 games for them at RT.

TheGuardian 02-13-2025 09:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEX (Post 17968287)
Dont die on the Kingsley hill. All he's shown he can do is jump out of a swimming pool in a bathing suit. He's shown a lot of what he can't do on the football field though. And because of how he was handled this past season, it may be that much harder for him to do stuff on the football field, especially LT. But you're right, he is very young so he'll be given time.
I don't get some guys obsession with Kingsley on here.

He's literally the worst rookie LT I've ever seen. At best he can be a guard and they are already protecting him there.

RealSNR 02-13-2025 09:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEX (Post 17968287)
Dont die on the Kingsley hill. All he's shown he can do is jump out of a swimming pool in a bathing suit. He's shown a lot of what he can't do on the football field though. And because of how he was handled this past season, it may be that much harder for him to do stuff on the football field, especially LT. But you're right, he is very young so he'll be given time.
We currently have one guy on our roster with the frame and the body to potentially play LT in the NFL at a high level. That's Kingsley.

Yeah, the odds are against him since he's from outside the 1st round, but weirdly enough, there are plenty of success stories of guys like him with potential and raw characteristics who end up being good starters.

And he's a year ahead of any other rookies coming out in 2025 with a similar frame and potential to be a great LT. I'm honestly in the stopgap and/or free agent camp because I don't think there's any other way to guarantee safety for Mahomes this season, but if forced to pick between drafting more tackles this year or penciling in Kingsley as the starter, I'd rather pencil in Kingsley.

Like I said, he's a year ahead of anybody else in a weak OT class. And I don't want more Wanyas who don't have a chance of being a franchise guy.

Chris Meck 02-13-2025 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 17968296)
I wonder if Rosengarten can play LT? He started 16 games for them at RT.
Well, I mean, then you have to fill that spot and if you're intending to challenge for a Super Bowl, you will have to pay for a RT and there's not much available there, either.

Easiest path is to just stay with Stanley. I mean, everything else seems like a crapshoot. That's not their way.

I could be wrong, but it just doesn't make sense unless there's a personal reason.

Easy 6 02-13-2025 09:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 17968304)
We currently have one guy on our roster with the frame and the body to potentially play LT in the NFL at a high level. That's Kingsley.

Yeah, the odds are against him since he's from outside the 1st round, but weirdly enough, there are plenty of success stories of guys like him with potential and raw characteristics who end up being good starters.

And he's a year ahead of any other rookies coming out in 2025 with a similar frame and potential to be a great LT. I'm honestly in the stopgap and/or free agent camp because I don't think there's any other way to guarantee safety for Mahomes this season, but if forced to pick between drafting more tackles this year or penciling in Kingsley as the starter, I'd rather pencil in Kingsley.

Like I said, he's a year ahead of anybody else in a weak OT class. And I don't want more Wanyas who don't have a chance of being a franchise guy.
Amen to THIS

All of this talk about throwing last years second out the window already is laughable, Kingsley is getting at least another two years to show something at a minimum

Just gimme a three way camp battle between him and two vets, we'll get a worthy starter out of that fight IMO

TEX 02-13-2025 09:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 17968304)
We currently have one guy on our roster with the frame and the body to potentially play LT in the NFL at a high level. That's Kingsley.

Yeah, the odds are against him since he's from outside the 1st round, but weirdly enough, there are plenty of success stories of guys like him with potential and raw characteristics who end up being good starters.

And he's a year ahead of any other rookies coming out in 2025 with a similar frame and potential to be a great LT. I'm honestly in the stopgap and/or free agent camp because I don't think there's any other way to guarantee safety for Mahomes this season, but if forced to pick between drafting more tackles this year or penciling in Kingsley as the starter, I'd rather pencil in Kingsley.

Like I said, he's a year ahead of anybody else in a weak OT class. And I don't want more Wanyas who don't have a chance of being a franchise guy.
That's all true. But here's the shocker, Wanya actually looked "better" (if I dare use that word) than Kingsley wherever he played and he was terrible at LT. Held his own surprisingly for his limited stint at RT. Maybe Kingsley improves. I just dont want him getting Mahomes killed during that process, so please no throwing him out there until he is ready. (IF he ever is) They sure didnt do him any favors this past season.

RealSNR 02-13-2025 09:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 17968303)
I don't get some guys obsession with Kingsley on here.

He's literally the worst rookie LT I've ever seen. At best he can be a guard and they are already protecting him there.
Off the top of my head, some pretty good tackles who had horribad rookie seasons:

Andrew Thomas
Duane Brown
Trent Williams (? I remember him sucking hard his first year, but I could be misremembering)
Eric Fisher (as a RT, too lol)
Kolton Miller

Hell, even Lane Johnson was pretty bad.

And... sure. I'll do it. I'll give him credit. How about Mongo over in Denver? We love to make fun of him, but if we had him on Sunday and Thuney moved back to LG, the game probably goes a lot differently.

TEX 02-13-2025 10:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy 6 (Post 17968313)
Amen to THIS

All of this talk about throwing last years second out the window already is laughable, Kingsley is getting at least another two years to show something at a minimum

Just gimme a three way camp battle between him and two vets, we'll get a worthy starter out of that fight IMO
Sure he will, b/c he's a round 2 pick. That may be what gives him the time.

New World Order 02-13-2025 10:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 17968319)
Off the top of my head, some pretty good tackles who had horribad rookie seasons:

Andrew Thomas
Duane Brown
Trent Williams (? I remember him sucking hard his first year, but I could be misremembering)
Eric Fisher (as a RT, too lol)
Kolton Miller

Hell, even Lane Johnson was pretty bad.

And... sure. I'll do it. I'll give him credit. How about Mongo over in Denver? We love to make fun of him, but if we had him on Sunday and Thuney moved back to LG, the game probably goes a lot differently.
Still remember Fisher being lit up in preseason by Parys Harelson

TheGuardian 02-13-2025 10:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 17968319)
Off the top of my head, some pretty good tackles who had horribad rookie seasons:

Andrew Thomas
Duane Brown
Trent Williams (? I remember him sucking hard his first year, but I could be misremembering)
Eric Fisher (as a RT, too lol)
Kolton Miller

Hell, even Lane Johnson was pretty bad.

And... sure. I'll do it. I'll give him credit. How about Mongo over in Denver? We love to make fun of him, but if we had him on Sunday and Thuney moved back to LG, the game probably goes a lot differently.

Yes but we're in the middle of a dynasty. Were any of those teams?

TEX 02-13-2025 10:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 17968303)
I don't get some guys obsession with Kingsley on here.

He's literally the worst rookie LT I've ever seen. At best he can be a guard and they are already protecting him there.
I dont either. But he is very young. Things could change. But from what I've seen, Im not counting on it. But here's the deal, even if he cant play LT, if he goes on to play G, it would be a successful pick. We'll see...

Rausch 02-13-2025 10:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy 6 (Post 17968313)
Amen to THIS

All of this talk about throwing last years second out the window already is laughable, Kingsley is getting at least another two years to show something at a minimum

Just gimme a three way camp battle between him and two vets, we'll get a worthy starter out of that fight IMO
I think Humphries will be back.

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OKchiefs 02-13-2025 10:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy 6 (Post 17968313)
Amen to THIS

All of this talk about throwing last years second out the window already is laughable, Kingsley is getting at least another two years to show something at a minimum

Just gimme a three way camp battle between him and two vets, we'll get a worthy starter out of that fight IMO
If KC were to take another OT early it doesn’t mean you’re throwing him out. He’d still be able to compete at LT and if that doesn’t work there is still RG or RT in 2026 when Taylor is gone. I’d still love to sign Stanley or Jackson (or Robinson I suppose) if any are available but if that doesn’t work out and you have to sign a tier B or C FA at LT (Humphries) I don’t think the answer is to steer clear in the draft when OT is going to be a huge need yet again in 2026.


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